Putting my head about the parapet

I think it’s mainly financial, I don’t think many young women can afford the luxury of staying at home.
When we had our first mortgage it was based only on my husband’s salary, that hardly ever happens now.
I agree with you, women should have choices, and I think in an ideal world, one parent would love to be around more for the early years, but I think very few would be able to.

Some men and women like to combine a career / work with having a family.

People’s expectations change over time. Eg when I bought my first house in 1970, I managed without a fridge. These days, people often expect to replace the existing kitchen and bathroom

Low paid workers need both parents to work to manage to provide housing, food, basics

I’m more concerned with the fact women continue to earn less than men, than in demanding men earn enough to maintain a family

Sorry vampire, I do not mean I don’t care about low wages

Iam64
That’s very true, we often say we had no expenses apart from food, mortgage, utilities and clothes when absolutely necessary. We had a second hand fridge, reconditioned washing machine, black and white televisions donated by one of my husband’s aunts, no phone, heating consisted of coal fire and paraffin heater.
I’m not moaning, most of us were in the same boat, and my grandparents thought we were really lucky to own our own home, and have indoor plumbing.
But times have changed, my daughters certainly wouldn’t want to live like that.

I chose to stay at home to look after my children until they went to full time school and then I went back to work part time. To do this we had to make sacrifices. For example a very small house the mortgage based on my husband’s salary only, holidays camping , second hand furniture, one car, etc . I have no regrets and loved the time I was able to spend with my children.

My question is why aren't we campaigning for more women to be financially able to stay at home if they want to. It used to the norm than men were paid enough to keep a family. Now the norm is that most families need both parents to work even if one would rather bring up their children.

Surely we should be campaigning for people to earn enough to keep a family and allow mothers to bring up their own children (if they wish) rather than paying others to do it.

Full time mothers seem to be undervalued today. It's as if they're lacking something because they want to bring up their own children. The daft thing is that if the same woman worked in a nursery caring for other people's children she'd be seen as a valuable member of society.

Think I agree with Iam in that our basic expectations and wants are so much higher. We don't want to do without anything but we are prepared to both work to get our 'everything'. Also the absence of parity is an excellent issue requiring attention. Don't think we had a holiday (other than with family or youth hostel) for the first ten years. Didn't expect it but sure, in my heart, wanted it. So many of what would now be considered ridiculous sacrifices were practised but that was our 'choice' if we opted for one stay at home parent. I would say we managed 'fine' on one pretty low pay but it was our choice. I was lucky enough to get back into my line of business once younger son was 14. I've no regrets but often wonder about the parallel life.

I’m not criticising my children’s generation, but their expectations are much higher than ours.
I went to work when my middle child started school, the youngest went to nursery, but even then I was fortunate enough to change my hours, so that she only went half days, and I always delivered the children to school and picked them up.
I don’t regret those early days at all. We were very good friends with another family, my friend and I got together every day, sitting in each other’s gardens, going to the park, the children were good friends, I wish my daughters could have had those relaxed and enjoyable years.

Kim19 yes agree with what you have said. Expectations much higher today so that one wage is not enough. Young people tend to want everything new and maintain the life style they had pre children. I can’t imagine anyone today putting up with the basic kitchen and bathroom I had when my children were small. New bathrooms and kitchens can wait but you cannot get back the time you have missed with young children.

I understand what you mean Vampire but it's not just running a home is it? These days people have higher expectations - they want foreign holidays, the latest technology, etc.
When I was a child (one of five) we rarely took holidays, didn't have many toys, had to make things last, make do and mend. Mum went back out to work part-time in her mid-forties as we had an extra mouth to feed. We never had a car or the latest 'stuff'- I think that many women are exhausted from 'doing it all'. In one of my jobs some of the part time ladies would say, "I was up until midnight finishing the ironing" and suchlike. There's got to be a happy medium somewhere, but where is it?

I only know one stay at home mum, her husband makes enough to keep her and 4 kids well, she has an ordinary house and a oldish car, it’s what she wants to do. Everyone else including myself has work of some kind, we are all different as long as you are happy don’t fret about staying at home.

But why would you campaign for that just for women. Young women tend to be out performing men in university and in early stages of career, why would you not campaign for the lower earner to stay at home which in lots of cases would be men. I changed from management to part time work when my children were young, I dont think you can underestimate the impact on the person who takes that 'hit'.

vampirequeen full time mother’s are definitely undervalued today which is quite wrong. We have become a very materialistic society and people are often ‘valued’ on what they have in terms of material assets e.g. big house etc. Most full time mothers will be unable to compete with two income families (although there are exceptions if husband/partner is a high earner.)

I agree vampirequeen the wheel seems to have turned full circle. Full time parenting is not rated as valuable as being in employment. It's a shame as it is such a vital role. Material expectations are higher, the job market does not allow leeway for parents who take a break in their careers for child care.
Having said that I would not have enjoyed full time parenting, my husband & I were fortunate in that we could work shifts so that one of us was at home for child care.

I think it's just become a two income society because two incomes have become the norm. It makes it harder for those who want one income for a time to make that choice.

Galaxy

But why would you campaign for that just for women. Young women tend to be out performing men in university and in early stages of career, why would you not campaign for the lower earner to stay at home which in lots of cases would be men. I changed from management to part time work when my children were young, I dont think you can underestimate the impact on the person who takes that 'hit'.

And that hit becomes an even bigger one if the couple separate. Women have much poorer pension provision because of the p.t. Work or not moving into management posts. I moved out of management at the point I was being encouraged to go for the next level.
My mum was the oldest of four. Both her parents started the 6am shift at the mill. She was responsible for getting all four of them off to school. She was determined we wouldn’t have that, so stayed home. I wonder how many of us born in the 40’s and 50’s had parents who aspired, like the middle classes,to have mums who ‘didn’t need to work’

Amongst my dd’s friends ( late 30s/ 40) the issue for them is the availability of part time / flexible working. They want to work because it’s part of who they are - it’s not just about the money. They’ve worked hard for degrees/ professional qualifications etc. The logistics can be difficult but they all work part time atm and have employers with family friendly policies ( which apply to both male and female employees). She and her friends work in a variety of settings - private sector, public sector and not for profit.
I agree that the real issue is not which choice you make but whether you have a meaningful choice. And many don’t

And for many women you become trapped not just in terms of career bit in terms of marriage and for some that can be a really dangerous place to be.

Oh and nobody wants to shoot you vampire , it's a really interesting discussion.

All mothers are full-time mothers, whether they work or not.

The issue is that the cost of living is rising and wages are stagnant and not in line with inflation. It’s difficult for even two working parents financially, let alone one. Free childcare would make a huge difference in women being able to get back to work if they want to, but we also need to ensure that flexible and remote working become more the norm.

I think a Universal Basic Income is key here, so everyone is supported regardless of whether or not they’re in work, enabling them to actually make their choices rather than the economy making it for them. We’d see much happier families and individuals then.

I agree op. I think it's very sad that mothers who would love to stay at home with their children for a few years can no longer afford to do so because of crazy house prices that depend on 2 salaries for a mortgage.

It's also bad for communities to have no one around during the day because everyone is at work, school or in the creche.

I also agree that priorities have changed a lot, and some people aren't prepared to sacrifice anything in order to have a better quality family and community life. The shock horror from some people last summer when they were asked not to go on foreign holidays was depressing to witness. When you think what people just a couple of generations ago were asked to sacrifice in the common good.....

But I think modern day house prices and rents have done huge damage to families and communities.

Sign if the times ! I like many others stayed at home with my children, then worked part time when they were in school. It is a difficult question because all parents have the right to work if they need / choose to do so. However my daughter and her husband work the child are happy but have such busy days ! Breakfast club before school , and after school care makes for a very long day for children. Pre Covid the youngest had a full day with me and the rest of the week in nursery. My daughter often looks very tired , she has a very responsible job which she loves. However I sometimes wish she had a more relaxed life with her children. I loved being at home with my children, playgroup one morning a week , visits to friends who had children, no anxiety if children woke with tummy ache , sickness because I knew I could be at home and sort it out. Having said that , I am a great believer in gender equality . Am also aware that many parents prefer to be in work than be stay at home mums or dads , and of course for them that is the best option.

A fantastic case for Universal Basic Income it seems to me ?‍♀️ No brainer.

Parents choice , they decide what is right for their family. Staying at home with children is a personal choice. Lots to weigh up - nursery fees in particular!!!!?