My daughter refuses to see me

Chrissiegirl, any updates?

Yes Survivor the support thread for those living with estrangement is on the same forum as this one.

I'm so sorry to hear of your loss but know it's not usually you but instigated by a spouse or significant other that has to do with control and manipulation. Sadly the children are used as pawns to inflict pain to satisfy the sick needs of this person and the no contact can actually save you from witnessing the horror these narcissists can push upon loving targets to get their demented supply of others' pain to feel superior. There's no remorse and they don't care who they hurt, including their own children. The more pain the better to feed their need of dark supply like sucking in the dead smoke of a spirit they've killed. You'll learn the no contact actually protects you from the evil and support of others is always beneficial. Speaking of:
I can't locate the estrangement thread, can someone please help?

March I acknowledged in an earlier post that we don't know of that is the case re controlling relationship. My point was a more general one re controlling relationships but I don't think I made that clear. Sorry

Also. The kids are teenagers, so say 13 years minimum.
OPs DD and her DH must have been together 13 years plus and all this has happened 18 months ago.

Something happened 18 months to cause this.

We don't know that's the case though.
OP said she had a 'fairly good rapport after she grew up and had her own children.'
What happened before she grew up and had children?
And a rapport isn't what I'd call a good mother/daughter relationship.

'Of course over the years we had a few spats but nothing major and nothing to warrant her estrangement from us.'
In OPs opinion.
We don't know if the daughter would see these as 'spats and nothing major' they might be to her. They might be the reason she needs space.

We don't know why the Grandchildren don't want to see her (if that's what happened.)

We just don't know.

In a genuine controlling relationship, the controller would sabotage the possibility of counselling!

My Mother in law tells people that her son is in a controlling relationship waves and that is the reason she longer sees her son and Grandchildren.
She warned him it would go wrong, he would see what I'm really like and he would be waiting for him to come 'running back.'

That was 6 years ago,in that time we have got married, brought our own home and we are trying for our 3rd child.
We have been together over 10 years.

There has been no progress made with their relationship.
Blaming me has fixed nothing. Calling me controlling has fixed nothing.
It's pushed him further away.
She accepts no responsibility.
The rocky relationship they had before I came along, the cross words and the arguments they had, had nothing to do with the breakdown of their relationship and as far as I know she is still waiting for him to see the light.

I think they need counselling together. Could this be something you could try?
There are always 2 sides to a story. Both of those sides need to be told and both parties need to listen.

Chrissie, unless there's something you're not seeing, it sad to say, it sounds as if there is some kind of control issue in ED's life. I wish her all the strength, wisdom, and courage it takes to get free. And I hope you keep your door - and your heart open - and just have patience (I know it's not easy).

Whywhywhy - You sound like a delightful GM! I hope you and ED reconcile someday, but till then I'm glad you and the GC are getting to enjoy a relationship. How kind and thoughtful of XSIL to send photos, etc.

Starlady - I make those times that I see my two grand daughters so special. We paint, draw, sew, knit and do all sorts of crafts that they dont get to do at home. They are both made to feel so special for all the time that I have with them. I cuddle, kiss and hug them and tell them that I love them so dearly.One is 11 and the other is 9. I lost 2 years of them growing up and have to forget about that and enjoy what I have. The ex SIL always makes sure that he sends some photos and always gets me a school photo. One day me and my daughter will get back together but for now I'll do all I can to make them happy.

agnurse I am not suggesting intervention. Just making the point that someone in a controlling relationship can't necessarily "solve their own problems!" It is a simplistic statement in my view. Gentle contact that keeps the DD aware of the safety net when she is ready to use it is not intervention as such. My experience tells me that this is right!

Thanks fo the additional information. We are trying to help you pinpoint the problem so we can give better advice and you may be able to fix this issue with your daughter

How long has your daughter been with her partner? Was he always controlling?

So nothing happened at all?
No miscommunication, crossed wires, different expectations, misunderstanding?
She went from getting along to cutting you off?

You say that you have had spats but nothing that warrants an estrangement.
Could you please elaborate on what those spats are?
The same event can be seen very differently on both sides: what you think is no big deal, it is a severe offense for the other side.

You also said you went to her home to see your GD.
Do you think she may have been ticked your priority was only the GD, ignoring your adult daughter?

Chrissiegirl [flowers ]

Thank you for all of your responses. My daughter and I always had a fairly good rapport after she grew up and had her own children. Of course over the years we had a few spats but nothing major and nothing to warrant her estrangement from us. Now she is not in touch with any family member:
her partner makes sure the children see their grandparents on his side. I tried to reason with her in the beginning of this happening, but it seemed she was adamant to pursue her quest to cut me off entirely. I did see her recently in our home town and she actually ran up the street away from me. The awful thing is I don’t see my grandchildren who are now teenagers but we send them birthday money and Christmas cards containing money. I have got to get on with my life without them and hopefully one day we will be reconciled. Never once did I think this would happen to me. I haven’t told many people what has happened but friends I have told are totally shocked. I have always reached out to other people and tried to be a kind and fair person. Thank you for understanding my situation x

Dolcelatte what a nerve - not speaking and asking for money. I know what my answer would be. (Unless they were starving!.)

I do empathise with all those who are estranged having been there and it's comforting to know its not just me. I was always afraid of people thinking it was my fault.
It's amazing what we can cope with and adapt to. The sad thing though is that even though it may be resolved the closeness is never regained But thankfully none of us are that dependant on our families. We have our own lives to lead.

Oops! Hit post before I meant to! I was going to say I also realize this could still all be about her partner's control.

Chrissie, IDk if you're coming back in here or not. But you asked about ED, "How do I give up on her?"

Reading this over again, here's what I'm seeing:

"After a few weeks of silence she said she wanted nothing to do with me. I later went to see my grandchildren and she ordered me from her home..."

I understand that you wanted to see your GC even though ED did not want to see you and probably felt that estrangement between you and her shouldn't impact your relationship w/ those GC. How did you expect to see them at their home though, w/o encountering ED? If anyone else had told you they wanted no more to do w/ you, would you show up at their house? I doubt it. So what made you feel this was ok to do where your daughter was concerned?

Ok, maybe it was the desire to see your grands that did it. Can you see, however, that ED may have seen your showing up as a disrespect of her wishes? Did you only do this in this one case? Or has brushing off her wishes been part of a pattern over the years? IF it has, then that might be the reason she feels the need for some distance.

And IF that's the case, then, IMO, it's not a matter of "giving up on her" but of backing off and respecting her wishes, as painful as that may be. Maybe if she sees a show of respect towards her, it will soften her heart after a while.

Of course, I may be totally off-base on all of this.

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Whywhywhy, I take it that you get to see your GC through your XSIL, which is wonderful of him - but that you still have no contact w/ ED. I know this estrangement must hurt and I'm so sorry about it. But I'm glad you get to spend time w/ your GC and I hope you treasure every minute of those visits.

Orchidover, that is so sad. My heart aches for your GD! TG she has you to turn to!

It sounds as if the problem is in her mum though, I'm sorry to say. If she only sees this man once a week, he's not controlling her or anything like that (I know you didn't say he was). And if she has always put men/BFs (boyfriends) ahead of her child, then, again, that's on her, not the men.

Then again, are you sure GD isn't exaggerating? After all, it's not uncommon for sons and daughters not to like the people their parents date. And if your DD (dear daughter) only sees the current man once a week, that leaves 6 other days for her to spend time with GD. Granted, GD may genuinely feel as if her mum favors BFs over her, but I would take her viewpoint w/ a grain of salt.

MadGran77

Controlling relationships are extremely complicated and it's often very hard for the controlled person to get out of them. Trying to intervene can actually make things worse. That's not a theoretical risk; sadly, some abusive partners have injured or even killed their partner or even their own children around the time the partner tried to leave.

If she is being controlled, she needs to be the one to determine if she is ready to leave and the safest way to do that. Especially if there are children involved. (In many jurisdictions she can't simply walk away with the children; she could be charged with parental abduction.)

Your DD is a grown adult. She needs to solve her own problems.

IF she is a controlling relationship (and I agree that we don't know whether she is or not) then she can't necessarily just solve her own problems

My daughter is involved with a man for 7 years and he has bought nothing positive to her life, they see eachother only once a week. She puts him before her daughter who has just spent 3+ years at uni. My granddaughter says her mum doesn't care for her only this man. In fact she says any man her mother has met over the years has been more important than her.

No response from the OP?

I havent spoken to my daughter in 4.5 years. I also didnt see her two children for 2 years until her ex husband stepped in and said that they needed me in their lives, which was great of him. I used to phone, text and write in the early days (none acknowledged) but I am afraid to say that I have given up lately. So sad as she was such a lovely little girl. I know what you are going through. x