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Darling GS

(56 Posts)
GagaJo Tue 19-Nov-19 22:02:31

My daughter and grandson live with me, by force of circumstances. The benefit of this, for me, is that I get to see my GS everyday. The downside of it is that my daughter and I don't get on

There was a BIG argument between she and I at the weekend and she tried to leave (no where to go though). I am pretty sure that at the first opportunity, she will be off and will deny me access to my GS.

I adore the boy and I've been his other parent (she's a single mum). I'm sensible enough to know that if she does that I'll have no rights at all and may well not see him again.

After the argument, I apologised although I wasn't the only one to blame. Gransnet has shown me that it isn't worth insisting on being right. Having access to my GS is far more valuable.

I can't help worrying though. It's exactly the sort of thing she'd do and I dread it.

Bibbity Tue 19-Nov-19 22:20:46

I can see why you’re worried.
As you say you would have a good argument for visitation.

However if you were to peruse this you would have to do so immediately after visitation was stopped.
The entire basis of your argument would be that he has a strong consistent bond with you.

The moment you go a month,2,3 without seeing him you’ve lost that argument.

Are there living conditions likely to improve? Does she work?

agnurse Tue 19-Nov-19 22:23:08

The other thing to keep in mind is the costs that are involved in making a case.

Your daughter is a single mom with nowhere to live right now. If she is able to move, and you start a court case against her, that could well require money that she doesn't have. That's food coming out of your GS's mouth.

It comes down to what you think is more important.

GagaJo Tue 19-Nov-19 22:24:58

No. I am, however, about to go overseas for work in Jan. To be honest, I don't think it would make much difference. Grandparents have no rights anyway. I'm hoping the time I'm away will clear the air between my daughter and I a bit. Living together really isn't good for us.

I wish I hadn't got so enmeshed with his life really. It'd be a lot easier if I were a more 'remote' grandparent.

Luckygirl Tue 19-Nov-19 22:27:58

Are their particular things that you and your DD argue about? Could you sit down and think what you might do to avoid igniting the flames? I am not suggesting that you are necessarily in the wrong here - but you have a lot to lose, so being one step ahead in preventing flare-ups might be n your interest.

It is often difficult for an adult child to be back under the parental roof. Difficult for everyone.

GagaJo Tue 19-Nov-19 22:35:33

It is very difficult. We've always had a prickly relationship but got on better when living far apart.

I get annoyed with her disregard of care for my house. She gets very difficult when she has PMT (getting worse the older she gets). She also feels I've controlled her whole life and blames me for a lot of things. Personally, I wish she'd be more responsible and take more responsibility for her actions. Two sides of the same coin. Completely different opinions. Ultimately though, I MUST learn to bite my tongue regardless. Because I know her and what she will do.

I'm now trying to stay out of her way. I'm out at work from 7am to 7pm and am retiring to my room after GS is in bed.

I'll be gone from Jan to June for work so she'll have the place to herself (or with a lodger, her choice). I really hope that will fix things a bit. Although I'll miss my GS a lot, the lack of arguing will be better for him.

pinkquartz Tue 19-Nov-19 22:40:33

I thought I read that if you have been involved in the child's upbringing then the rules are different.
So if you have been his other parent then you may have more rights than you think.

You can easily find out It is somewhere on the internet. Or another Gran might know of course.

Otherwise is there anyway you can help her to live near by but under in a separate building.
I couldn't live with my daughter. We are too strong minded though in different ways.

Or say sorry and point out you are going away fairly soon.

GagaJo Tue 19-Nov-19 22:47:05

I've always read that it is nigh on impossible for grandparents to get any rights.

I apologised several times. She had SAID it was what she wanted but then when I did, she still wasn't happy. She did have PMT at the time.

I bought a flat about 5 miles away for her and the GS (sounds a lot better than it is) but she couldn't afford to live in it even with no rent/mortgage. I guess eventually I may have to sell my house and split the proceeds to get somewhere small for each of us. It is VERY hard for single parents these days.

Bridgeit Tue 19-Nov-19 22:53:14

Grandparents do have rights, check it out with citizens advice. Best wishes

Bibbity Tue 19-Nov-19 23:18:16

GPs do not have rights in the UK.

Children have rights.

BradfordLass72 Wed 20-Nov-19 06:08:54

Even if you had all the rights in the world, going to court is not the right route, it does so much harm to the child - as I know from experience.

I hope the 6 month break will give you a bit of thinking time and you are both able to see things with calmer eyes.

There's good medication, including natural remedies for PMT, no one has to suffer the evil gremlin days, least of all the little boy.
And there's counselling.
The closer we are to a person, emoitonally and physically, the easier it is to become irritated. This applies to all relationships

Learning how to communicate effectively can solve problems. Plus being aware that "mama is always wrong" grin.

See if you can get hold of a copy of - Daughters and Mothers: Making It Work, by Julie Firman, it's an excellent book and may give you some insights while you're away.

Glad you found a well-paid job.

Tedber Wed 20-Nov-19 06:44:27

Personally I think you have bent over backwards to help your daughter and she sounds totally ungrateful.

You have bought her a flat? So she does have somewhere to go? Does she have a job? She should be able to manage without rent surely? Even on benefits?

Why sell your house? She has the flat? Instead of thinking of giving up your home and giving her money perhaps you could help her out a little with say the gas bill?

I know you are worried about losing your grandson but do you think she could actually cope cutting you out? She doesn’t sound like she has the first idea about coping alone.

As for the arguments- only you know if you can be more reasonable or tolerant. If my daughter was disrespecting my home and not making any effort to keep it tidy/clean there would be more than arguments!

I hope it all works out for you. Perhaps do nothing until June? Then you can decide. Preferably encourage your daughter to stand on her own feet in a mutually acceptable way?

BlueBelle Wed 20-Nov-19 06:55:29

One thing worries me you say you’ve been the other parent but you’re NOT and can you not realise how much this must have undermined your daughter ? Please don’t think I m being hard it’s so easy to drop into that role but your daughter must feel very very unimportant and out of control
You own the roof over their heads, you earn the keep, you look after her and her son, (perhaps better than her) she is resentful that you control her life and through poor circumstances she’s right, you do control her life, and although she needs you she resents needing you

BlueBelle Wed 20-Nov-19 06:57:10

Sorry missed half of my post off

You say you go to bed after your grandson has gone to bed everything evolves around him and of course that hurts and puts her well down the importance scale Why not go to bed and let mum and son have time together Do you put him to bed read him a story etc etc ? Or does your daughter ?
Does she work, if not why not?
I think the month away is maybe your saving grace and will be helpful in your relationship for her to be HIS MUM without your help for a month
Of course she’s not looking after your home she’s making a point which is’s not mine, we re only here because of your grandson, you don’t love me you just put up with me for his sake
This is all totally unfair as you ve been a good mum and trying your hardest to help get her on her feet but that’s not how it feels to her
Can you understand that?
Please don’t see this as criticism I could so easily have fell into the same trap when my daughter and grandkids came to live with me for a while I unwittingly tried to be the other parent a role I just fell into without thinking as I loved them all and wanted to help so much, luckily my daughter was very able to put me right and I understood how she felt and stepped back unless wanted Can you do that, I think you do need to

MissAdventure Wed 20-Nov-19 07:01:35

Is there a reason your daughter couldn't afford to live independently?

She would be able to claim as a single parent, and would get the same as others do, and they manage.

Lots pay 'top up' on top of the rent, so she would be better off than many.

GagaJo Wed 20-Nov-19 07:08:37

BlueBelle, I'm not insulted at all, you've hit the nail on the head with a lot of what you said.

I'm actually away for 6 months (this time) and then have a 2nd, hopefully long-term overseas job for the next academic year, so if she doesn't want to be around me, she can chose to stay in the UK.

Although I'll miss him while I'm away or IF we now live on different continents permanently, ultimately, I want what is best for him. So if my stepping out of the picture for most of the time is best, I'll do it.

I think me being the 2nd parent has been a double edged sword for her. She wants it, because otherwise she gets no help, has no break at all from him. But equally, you're right, she resents it. I have stepped back a bit in the past, but then... she's back to having no break from him.

GagaJo Wed 20-Nov-19 07:23:07

MissAdventure, due to a complex set of circumstances, she gets very little benefit. It isn't possible for it to be increased. So as BlueBell said, she really is stuck. Even the small amount she gets wouldn't have paid utilities on a small flat.

I don't know what the future holds. But the current situation doesn't work so maybe my not being here for 6 months will help us think of solutions.

MissAdventure Wed 20-Nov-19 07:39:21

Hopefully, gagajo.
I'm sure it'll do you good.

BlueBelle Wed 20-Nov-19 07:51:14

Gagajo thank you so much for not taking my post as unwanted criticism I so understand the whole situation it’s no bodies fault but I think whilst it ll be a huge wrench the time away may be the best way forward You will obviously keep in touch with them regularly and swallow your aching heart for your grandson How old is he by the way ?
Although you really (sometimes) don’t like your daughters behaviour try and make her every bit as important as your little chap. Ask after her first when you ring, talk about stuff you know you can agree on tell her you’re missing her “even though we have our ups and downs” 😊 in other words let her feel you trust that she can and will manage
Can your daughter work she must feel so so useless, her self esteem must be rock bottom and who do we hurt when we feel bad about ourselves ....those closest to us, in your case her safe old Mum
Good luck with your job it sounds very important

GagaJo Wed 20-Nov-19 08:04:24

Hahaha, not at all. I'm only a teacher. But I THINK the temporary job is a good one. I HOPE it is. confused

BlueBelle Wed 20-Nov-19 08:08:40

Good luck x

BlueBelle Wed 20-Nov-19 08:27:29

When I tried to hard to help, to solve, to make everything better my very wise daughter sent me this poem I would like to share it with you It was my wake up call I m sure I didn’t get it all right after I read it but it made sense
Please Listen: A Poem
By: Leo Buscaglia
When I ask you to listen to me
and you start giving me advice,
You have not done what I asked.
When I ask you to listen to me
and you begin to tell me why
I shouldn’t feel that way,
you are trampling on my feelings.
When I ask you to listen to me
and you feel you have to do something
to solve my problem,
you have failed me,
strange as that may seem.
Listen! All I ask is that you listen.
Don’t talk or do – just hear me…
And I can do for myself; I am not helpless.
Maybe discouraged and faltering,
but not helpless.
When you do something for me that I can and need to do for myself,
you contribute to my fear and
But when you accept as a simple fact
That I feel what I feel,
No matter how irrational,
Then I can stop trying to convince
You and get about this business
Of understanding what’s behind
This irrational feeling.
And when that’s clear, the answers are obvious and I don’t need advice.
Irrational feelings make sense when
we understand what’s behind them.
So please listen, and just hear me.
And if you want to talk, wait a minute
for your turn– and I will listen to you.

GillS Wed 20-Nov-19 08:50:07

Thank you Bluebelle. The poem is beautiful and I have recommended it to my FB family and friends. You must have a lovely relationship with your daughter.

Grandelly54 Wed 20-Nov-19 11:30:11

Oh dear, reading your post and it's like De ja vu,! Had the same problem, nearly three years with us which was lovely for us as we got to see the boys, take them out, read them stories, play, watch them grow. It was hard as our daughter has bipolar and her dad had to get in between us more times than I can remember. Eventually she met a new man, they are married and the boys love him and he them, my point is we, my daughter and me now get on like best friends and proper mummy and daughter. Take heart and have faith,call will be well.

Dinahmo Wed 20-Nov-19 11:32:23

It does sound as though PMT could be a major cause of your arguments. Has your daughter done anything about that? My mother suffered from PMT and had a short fuse when having periods. Her GP kept telling her it was the menopause (she was 40 at the time) but it turned out that she needed a hysterectomy. This was over 40 years ago so things may be different now.

My OH became aware that I would argue black was white when suffering from PMT but I wasn't really aware of it.

jaylucy Wed 20-Nov-19 11:38:50

I would hazard a guess that as well as PMT, your daughter may also be suffering from depression.
It is hard when you feel as if you have been cornered into a life you never planned for yourself. As much as she loves her son, she may feel that her whole life revolves around him and there is little left for her. I know from experience.
It isn't your fault that she is like she is. Blaming someone else is so easy to do when you can't see any way out or any way that your life can change.
The hours that you are working I would guess means that she is on her own for most of that time - you don't say that she has a job herself, or how old your GS is but when you return from overseas, it might be an idea to sit down with her and work out a sort of shift system around your GS so possibly your daughter can work while you are at home with him? It might boost her self esteem and help things all round.
Oh, and make sure that if she does have a lodger while you are away that they sign an agreement or you may well find you are stuck with an unwelcome "guest" that you can't get rid of !

Jishere Wed 20-Nov-19 11:44:37

I guess you don't go into too much detail why you don't get on.
But as you are bailing her out, surely she should be a little bit grateful? I mean it sounds like its rent free, Bill free.
That's your home and you can't chill in the living room. Sorry none of this makes sense. You are tip toeing arround your daughter, working hard and scared that in the future you won't see your GS although you are working abroad next year and won't see him anyway.
Surely at this rate you might as well give her the house.
You know what you should have let her go after the row,there is temporary accommodation but I'm sure she would have come back home grovelling.
Stop using GS as an excuse, GPS do have rights. Sit down and have a serious chat with your daughter and gain a bit of control back, discuss rules because what makes you think she'll be leaving any time soon!!

Worthingpatchworker Wed 20-Nov-19 12:04:24

I haven’t read all the comments. I sympathise with your situations. My mother and I don’t get along. Sadly I don’t have any children.
I did, however, have a niece, 16 years younger than me, living with my husband and I.
One of the things I did was to not have any expectations. I didn’t expect her to do any chores so it was a great thing, and praiseworthy, when she did.
There were two major disagreements where I was placed in an awful position between hubby and niece. We managed to work it out and, from her reactions, she resolved a lot of emotional issues whilst with us.
She has, since, moved on and got married but holds us dear to her heart.
All you can really do is show your love and create loving memories. When they leave your house that love and memories will go with them. Keep contact even if it might become a little one sided. I feel sure it will pay off.
I wish you the very best. Xx

Dillyduck Wed 20-Nov-19 12:07:27

It's YOUR house, YOUR rules.
Don't let her hold you to ransom because of your grandson.

SHE is the one who needs to apologise to you. I suggest you help her find somewhere else to live.

Coco51 Wed 20-Nov-19 12:09:12

The fundamental issue of denying you access to your grandson does not only affect you - your daughter should also consider how much emotional damage she is doing to her little boy who will have no understanding of why his beloved gran is not seeing him anymore. It will have huge separation anxieties for you all, but particularly him. Whatever the disagreement was about, your daughter must surely see that it is not worth causing long lasting distress and damage

gustheguidedog Wed 20-Nov-19 12:10:33

Now then @GagaJo, as most of you are aware, I am BLIND and so, therefore, I must use assistive technology in order to use the computer. Whenever we open Gransnet there is the `Privacy Warning` thing. We all have rows with folk especially our family but honestly love you're NOT going to solve it by letting every Tom, Dick or Harry know about it.
You said shes packing her bags etc. but think about it lass, it sounds like an `empty threat` as you say "(nowhere to go though)" Think about it if she did `do one` Where would she find another `Built-in babysitter`, if the little fella is as close to YOU as you obviously are to him HE WILL LET HIS MUM KNOW HOW MUCH HE MISSES HER.
I suggest sit down(arguing is easier that way - less stress) have a brew (declare a cease-fire) remind her that she has got more important things to do than snipe at you and for god's sake keep it between you and her.
I've read through ALL the comments on here, hey there's always gonna be someone who says, "Oh that happened to me" or "I have the same problem" take no notice lass THIS IS YOUR PROBLEM you solve it, what did folk do in the days before t'internet?

LuckyFour Wed 20-Nov-19 12:18:14

I'm just wondering why mums/parents need to have time away from their children. They may want time to themselves but should they need it and therefore expect to have it. I didn't live near my parents when my children were born and were growing up. I didn't feel I had to have time away from them, it never occurred to me. Why does someone have to be there so that parents can have time away from their children, even if they are single parents.
Grandparents should be just grandparents, not pseudo parents.

NotANana Wed 20-Nov-19 12:30:29

This sounds like an awful situation and I do feel for you.
But...your daughter is old enough to take responsibility for herself and her child. If she was old enough to have a baby she is old enough to take some responsibility for raising it and looking after it.
And PMT is grim but it it isn't an excuse for poor behaviour.
This woman (your daughter) and her child (your grandchild) is living free of charge in YOUR home. Your home = your rules.

When I left home (after one too many arguments with my father) he said "You have made your bed, now you can lie on it". So I'm not inclined to much sympathy for grown-up whiny kids. And yes, I am aware of how difficult it is for single parents. But a bit of gratitude and working with you wouldn't come amiss.

I'm sorry if that sounds harsh, but that is what I think.
I hope that things get better for you all.

Hetty58 Wed 20-Nov-19 12:36:25

My daughter and grandson lived with me for years. We did get on, though. When she left, he stayed with me until he was ten!

patricia1958 Wed 20-Nov-19 12:38:42

I have a daughter who's now a single mum and we didn't get on she is under a lot of stress I have been like you perhaps I used to say sorry when it wasn't my fault perhaps if you just said I want you to know I love you very much and I'm always here for you BOTH keep thinking about your grandson and how much he loves you

icanhandthemback Wed 20-Nov-19 13:19:55

PMT is such a horrible one to live with whether you are the one suffering or the one living with the sufferer. If she is anything like me, she will feel fully justified when in the PMT zone even if she is being totally unreasonable and then, when she's out the other side, she beats herself up and feels unloveable because she knows how she's been. The less she loves herself, the more she'll look to see if she really is loved particularly when she's back in the PMT phase and if you look hard enough, you can always find them. I became quite paranoid during those times. Meanwhile the people living with you feel they are living on a knife edge and PMT lasts longer than people realise so you never really get back to normal before its starts rearing its ugly head again. Antidepressants helped me live with it for years until I had a radical hysterectomy.
From what you say, it seems that you are either "involved" with your DGS's care to give your daughter a break or you aren't so she can't cope. Is there a happier balance you can make? Perhaps get it so she asks for when she needs some time off but you take a back seat. When she is in a good phase, ask her how you could make her feel more in control. You might be surprised at the answers you get. Take some time to think about what she is saying with a "I'll have to take some time to process that," if you think she is being unreasonable. You can always return to her with a well thought out compromise. You might have to do this several times to affect any change but the moment you signal that you need time to think and reflect on what she is saying, you are acknowledging that you are listening. Too often we get caught up in arguments because we don't give ourselves time to process what the other person is saying and respond instinctively when you may actually have to reframe your instincts.

BlueBelle Wed 20-Nov-19 13:32:01

It was very different for me as my daughter and I get on very very well but as she and the children had suffered a bereavement I was trying too hard to make it all ok and it’s so easy to go too far and get too involved but I think the break will do you and your daughter an enormous amount of good and hopefully you ll realise you have more in common than you think and miss each other and get back on a more even keel
Maybe when you return you can think of how the living arrangements can be changed to suit you both better

BusterTank Wed 20-Nov-19 13:35:33

If your worried you won't see your grandson if she moves out , just keep the peace for his sake . Just set a few house rules .

Mamma66 Wed 20-Nov-19 13:37:51

I really sympathise with your situation. My adult Stepson and his partner split almost two years ago, it was an extremely acrimonious split and she denied him access to the children for five months (two were his, and one child he had brought up since she was 15 months old). He went to Court and contrary to what Mum thought my Stepson was given contact with all three children. The children’s mother was intending on withholding contact from the eldest child, the Court saw differently. What you have to remember is that whilst grandparents may not have much in the way of rights, decision making will be firmly around what is best for the child, so your concerns about your daughter denying you access to your grandson might be unfounded. If the Court deems that you have a close and positive relationship with your Grandson they may make the decision that relationship is maintained regardless of what your daughter thinks.

Coconut Wed 20-Nov-19 15:20:30

Reading this I know I’ve been so lucky with my daughter. We’ve always been best friends, have done role reversal when I’ve been at a low ebb etc Of course we don’t always see eye to eye, but we’ve always just talked things thro. She left her partner and came back from Marbella with her 6month old son to live with me and we bought him up for 6 years until she met her now husband. I was working full time and shared childcare whenever I could, I was always respectful of DD with decisions etc but was able to speak up if/when I felt I needed to. We used to make a joke of our differences, but I always told DGS that DD was number one Mummy. He is 13 now and has a wonderful stepfather, so I’ve happily slipped down to no:3 carer, but he still puts no:2 Mummy on my birthday cards. I live next door in a granny annexe and we are a team working together etc I so hope that you can chat things thro with your DD so that you can both understand each other’s feelings and forge a lovely bond with DGS best interests at heart, good luck ....

Coyoacan Wed 20-Nov-19 15:25:23

You have my sympathy, OP, as your situation sounds very similar to mine, except that my dd is able to pay her way and I have never felt that it would reach the point where would deny me access to my granddaughter.

PMT is a bitch. As often as not they say and feel things that the rest of the time they don't feel at all and wouldn't dream of saying.

And its complicated still living together now that they are adults with their own responsabilities. The habit of being a mother who tries to solve all their problems for them dies hard as does their habit of expecting you to solve their problems.

My dd and I are finally living apart and she is having difficulties managing her budget because I used to do a lot of the shopping and never asked her for a contribution, but she is getting there.

Hithere Wed 20-Nov-19 17:04:32

What was the argument you had and you apologized even if it wasn't your fault?

What is your dd doing to manage her PMT?
What is she doing to improve her complex set of conditions that do not allow her to have more social allowances?

Has she given examples of your controlling nature and if so, what were those?

You need to tell her you are not a second parent and she is the mother.

I get the feeling of you enabling her so your gc doesn't suffer.
The gc is suffering from this unstable situation anyway

Barmeyoldbat Wed 20-Nov-19 17:42:36

Its very hard for a daughter to live at home with her child and mum. I think Bluebelle has given you some wise advice and so I have no advice to give you. But I would say when I split from my ex the last place on earth I would have gone to is my mum. I just could not have ever lived with her, she would also have stepped in as the other parent and her idea of bringing up children is not the same as mine. So I would say take BB advice to heart. Good luck

crazyH Wed 20-Nov-19 18:23:47

Try and patch things up ASAP - the longer you leave it , the more difficult it gets. Mothers and daughters are notorious for this - I’ve got a difficult daughter and many a ‘strop’ has happened between us but I am always the first to make the first - I never apologise because most of the time I’m right - but I do pop in to see her with my tail between my legs and pretend nothing’s happened. I adore my grandkids (they are teenagers now) and in order to see them , I always had to eat humble pie. Things are different now - they are busy with their own activities and Nan is the last thing on their mind - life eh?

Houndi Wed 20-Nov-19 18:30:43

I am looking after my mother im law because her daughter couldnt care less
Before she was bad she seen her 3 times in a nearly a year.When i asked her to come and stay with her for a week while i go on holiday she refused.Now with my mother in law ill i have had to cancel our cruise.Look after my mother in law 24 7 and she couldn't care less
She a selfish bitch

Bibbity Wed 20-Nov-19 19:46:16

Well Houndi, what was their relationship like before?
Was she a good mother to her before?

I know that none of my MiLs sons would ever travel to her to assist her no matter how ill she was. You reap what you sow.

GagaJo Wed 20-Nov-19 19:58:10

I've apologised because I love my grandson and I'll do almost anything to maintain my relationship with him. I know her modus operandi and know that if she takes a mind to, she'll stop me seeing him once she's moved out on her own.

Which is, as I've said, something she has no option in at the moment. Once she has some free childcare available I suspect she'll get a job and be off. Which is fine (nay, preferable), as long as I get to see him.

Hithere Wed 20-Nov-19 20:03:16


I am not sure how your comment rates to the main OP.

You may want to open your own thread if you want to get more support and avoid hijacking the main subject that the OP posted.

Hithere Wed 20-Nov-19 20:03:50

Relates, no rates

Buffy Wed 20-Nov-19 20:45:42

There's nothing worse than asking someone with PMT if they have PMT. or asking someone on antidepressants if they have been taking their medication! It's red rag to a bull. Hopefully a few months apart will make you appreciate one another more and accept one anothers shortcomings.
As she matures your daughter will realise you have her interests at heart as well as those of your grandson. Don't make her feel you only tolerate her because you dote on her son. She obviously needs lots of love. Good luck.

GagaJo Wed 20-Nov-19 21:13:55

We both only tolerate living together because of the situation. We'd both rather live apart. Not distant necessarily, but not in the same house.

Purplepoppies Thu 21-Nov-19 07:06:00

Sorry if I've missed this, but how old is your grandson?
Arguing infront of children can be really damaging. I understand that the odd disagreement can occur but full blown blow ups are destructive. I say this as a mum who struggles with her adult dd behaviour at times and I have to bite my tongue. They don't live with me (I really couldn't) but I'm heavily involved with the family dynamics.
I'm really surprised that your dd couldn't manage financially in a flat you purchased for them. She must be feeling pretty desperate and maybe like a crap parent if shes unable to support her son alone. I can't imagine how that feels.
You have been very generous, opening your home to them and with your money. I wonder if now you can be generous with your heart? Rather than worry that your daughter will stop access to your grandson I'd be concerned whether she really needs you and is afraid to ask to for help? Emotional support I mean, not financially. Its easy when two personalities are similar to clash heads and not really hear each other. Ultimately you both want the best for your gs, right? That means the two adults in his world being calm around him and listening to each other. You don't have to agree even!!
I hope you have a peaceful time before you travel and come back with a fresh perspective on your relationship. Not a plan to 'get access ' to your gs.....

cassandra264 Thu 21-Nov-19 09:56:11

Picking up on the points made by Purplepoppies - which make a lot of sense to me - I would like to recommend a book I took out of the library recently to help me with my own family matters.
It is called 'How To Have Meaningful Conversations - 7 strategies for talking about what really matters'. Author is Sarah Rozenthuler ( ).
Good luck!

Hetty58 Thu 21-Nov-19 10:05:50

At one time I had the greatest trouble communicating with my eldest son (although he lived here). He'd just get very angry and storm off if I tried to discuss his contributing to the bills. (He believed that he shouldn't have to.) In the end I wrote detailed letters to him and posted them under his bedroom door!

dazz Mon 30-Dec-19 10:22:59

I think Bluebells comment was overly liberal. when dos an adult child actually start acting like one. respecting another's home should be a given ! Sounds like Grandma has to be the breadwinner and the more she gives out to the daughter, the more ungrateful she becomes. not great having to live with our parents but the daughter is younger and fitter. perhaps she could go out and earn the living and let grandma stay home with the GS. if you actually have to earn your money you take more care of the things you buy !!

Sandmb Sun 15-Mar-20 11:45:33

My grandchildren lived with me and then one day tge parents got up and left taking the children with them and then won’t let me see them. I took them to court as I tried everything I could to rectify the situation and see my grandchildren and after permission was granted I was given access and to go to mediation which I wanted anyway. It was hard but in the end I was a big part of the children’s lives and them in mine. You don’t need a solicitor either you can do it yourself or with tge aid of McKenzie friend., which is what I did and as I was so impressed I trained to be one so if you need any help with forms attending court with you I’m here if I can help or just talk