Darling GS

I can see why you’re worried.
As you say you would have a good argument for visitation.

However if you were to peruse this you would have to do so immediately after visitation was stopped.
The entire basis of your argument would be that he has a strong consistent bond with you.

The moment you go a month,2,3 without seeing him you’ve lost that argument.

Are there living conditions likely to improve? Does she work?

The other thing to keep in mind is the costs that are involved in making a case.

Your daughter is a single mom with nowhere to live right now. If she is able to move, and you start a court case against her, that could well require money that she doesn't have. That's food coming out of your GS's mouth.

It comes down to what you think is more important.

No. I am, however, about to go overseas for work in Jan. To be honest, I don't think it would make much difference. Grandparents have no rights anyway. I'm hoping the time I'm away will clear the air between my daughter and I a bit. Living together really isn't good for us.

I wish I hadn't got so enmeshed with his life really. It'd be a lot easier if I were a more 'remote' grandparent.

Are their particular things that you and your DD argue about? Could you sit down and think what you might do to avoid igniting the flames? I am not suggesting that you are necessarily in the wrong here - but you have a lot to lose, so being one step ahead in preventing flare-ups might be n your interest.

It is often difficult for an adult child to be back under the parental roof. Difficult for everyone.

It is very difficult. We've always had a prickly relationship but got on better when living far apart.

I get annoyed with her disregard of care for my house. She gets very difficult when she has PMT (getting worse the older she gets). She also feels I've controlled her whole life and blames me for a lot of things. Personally, I wish she'd be more responsible and take more responsibility for her actions. Two sides of the same coin. Completely different opinions. Ultimately though, I MUST learn to bite my tongue regardless. Because I know her and what she will do.

I'm now trying to stay out of her way. I'm out at work from 7am to 7pm and am retiring to my room after GS is in bed.

I'll be gone from Jan to June for work so she'll have the place to herself (or with a lodger, her choice). I really hope that will fix things a bit. Although I'll miss my GS a lot, the lack of arguing will be better for him.

I thought I read that if you have been involved in the child's upbringing then the rules are different.
So if you have been his other parent then you may have more rights than you think.

You can easily find out It is somewhere on the internet. Or another Gran might know of course.

Otherwise is there anyway you can help her to live near by but under in a separate building.
I couldn't live with my daughter. We are too strong minded though in different ways.

Or say sorry and point out you are going away fairly soon.

I've always read that it is nigh on impossible for grandparents to get any rights.

I apologised several times. She had SAID it was what she wanted but then when I did, she still wasn't happy. She did have PMT at the time.

I bought a flat about 5 miles away for her and the GS (sounds a lot better than it is) but she couldn't afford to live in it even with no rent/mortgage. I guess eventually I may have to sell my house and split the proceeds to get somewhere small for each of us. It is VERY hard for single parents these days.

Grandparents do have rights, check it out with citizens advice. Best wishes

GPs do not have rights in the UK.

Children have rights.

Even if you had all the rights in the world, going to court is not the right route, it does so much harm to the child - as I know from experience.

I hope the 6 month break will give you a bit of thinking time and you are both able to see things with calmer eyes.

There's good medication, including natural remedies for PMT, no one has to suffer the evil gremlin days, least of all the little boy.
And there's counselling.
The closer we are to a person, emoitonally and physically, the easier it is to become irritated. This applies to all relationships

Learning how to communicate effectively can solve problems. Plus being aware that "mama is always wrong" .

See if you can get hold of a copy of - Daughters and Mothers: Making It Work, by Julie Firman, it's an excellent book and may give you some insights while you're away.

Glad you found a well-paid job.

Personally I think you have bent over backwards to help your daughter and she sounds totally ungrateful.

You have bought her a flat? So she does have somewhere to go? Does she have a job? She should be able to manage without rent surely? Even on benefits?

Why sell your house? She has the flat? Instead of thinking of giving up your home and giving her money perhaps you could help her out a little with say the gas bill?

I know you are worried about losing your grandson but do you think she could actually cope cutting you out? She doesn’t sound like she has the first idea about coping alone.

As for the arguments- only you know if you can be more reasonable or tolerant. If my daughter was disrespecting my home and not making any effort to keep it tidy/clean there would be more than arguments!

I hope it all works out for you. Perhaps do nothing until June? Then you can decide. Preferably encourage your daughter to stand on her own feet in a mutually acceptable way?

One thing worries me you say you’ve been the other parent but you’re NOT and can you not realise how much this must have undermined your daughter ? Please don’t think I m being hard it’s so easy to drop into that role but your daughter must feel very very unimportant and out of control
You own the roof over their heads, you earn the keep, you look after her and her son, (perhaps better than her) she is resentful that you control her life and through poor circumstances she’s right, you do control her life, and although she needs you she resents needing you

Sorry missed half of my post off

You say you go to bed after your grandson has gone to bed everything evolves around him and of course that hurts and puts her well down the importance scale Why not go to bed and let mum and son have time together Do you put him to bed read him a story etc etc ? Or does your daughter ?
Does she work, if not why not?
I think the month away is maybe your saving grace and will be helpful in your relationship for her to be HIS MUM without your help for a month
Of course she’s not looking after your home she’s making a point which is ....it’s not mine, we re only here because of your grandson, you don’t love me you just put up with me for his sake
This is all totally unfair as you ve been a good mum and trying your hardest to help get her on her feet but that’s not how it feels to her
Can you understand that?
Please don’t see this as criticism I could so easily have fell into the same trap when my daughter and grandkids came to live with me for a while I unwittingly tried to be the other parent a role I just fell into without thinking as I loved them all and wanted to help so much, luckily my daughter was very able to put me right and I understood how she felt and stepped back unless wanted Can you do that, I think you do need to

Is there a reason your daughter couldn't afford to live independently?

She would be able to claim as a single parent, and would get the same as others do, and they manage.

Lots pay 'top up' on top of the rent, so she would be better off than many.

BlueBelle, I'm not insulted at all, you've hit the nail on the head with a lot of what you said.

I'm actually away for 6 months (this time) and then have a 2nd, hopefully long-term overseas job for the next academic year, so if she doesn't want to be around me, she can chose to stay in the UK.

Although I'll miss him while I'm away or IF we now live on different continents permanently, ultimately, I want what is best for him. So if my stepping out of the picture for most of the time is best, I'll do it.

I think me being the 2nd parent has been a double edged sword for her. She wants it, because otherwise she gets no help, has no break at all from him. But equally, you're right, she resents it. I have stepped back a bit in the past, but then... she's back to having no break from him.

MissAdventure, due to a complex set of circumstances, she gets very little benefit. It isn't possible for it to be increased. So as BlueBell said, she really is stuck. Even the small amount she gets wouldn't have paid utilities on a small flat.

I don't know what the future holds. But the current situation doesn't work so maybe my not being here for 6 months will help us think of solutions.

Hopefully, gagajo.
I'm sure it'll do you good.

Gagajo thank you so much for not taking my post as unwanted criticism I so understand the whole situation it’s no bodies fault but I think whilst it ll be a huge wrench the time away may be the best way forward You will obviously keep in touch with them regularly and swallow your aching heart for your grandson How old is he by the way ?
Although you really (sometimes) don’t like your daughters behaviour try and make her every bit as important as your little chap. Ask after her first when you ring, talk about stuff you know you can agree on tell her you’re missing her “even though we have our ups and downs” ? in other words let her feel you trust that she can and will manage
Can your daughter work she must feel so so useless, her self esteem must be rock bottom and who do we hurt when we feel bad about ourselves ....those closest to us, in your case her safe old Mum
Good luck with your job it sounds very important

Hahaha, not at all. I'm only a teacher. But I THINK the temporary job is a good one. I HOPE it is.

Good luck x

When I tried to hard to help, to solve, to make everything better my very wise daughter sent me this poem I would like to share it with you It was my wake up call I m sure I didn’t get it all right after I read it but it made sense
Please Listen: A Poem
By: Leo Buscaglia
When I ask you to listen to me
and you start giving me advice,
You have not done what I asked.
When I ask you to listen to me
and you begin to tell me why
I shouldn’t feel that way,
you are trampling on my feelings.
When I ask you to listen to me
and you feel you have to do something
to solve my problem,
you have failed me,
strange as that may seem.
Listen! All I ask is that you listen.
Don’t talk or do – just hear me…
And I can do for myself; I am not helpless.
Maybe discouraged and faltering,
but not helpless.
When you do something for me that I can and need to do for myself,
you contribute to my fear and
Inadequacy.
But when you accept as a simple fact
That I feel what I feel,
No matter how irrational,
Then I can stop trying to convince
You and get about this business
Of understanding what’s behind
This irrational feeling.
And when that’s clear, the answers are obvious and I don’t need advice.
Irrational feelings make sense when
we understand what’s behind them.
So please listen, and just hear me.
And if you want to talk, wait a minute
for your turn– and I will listen to you.

Thank you Bluebelle. The poem is beautiful and I have recommended it to my FB family and friends. You must have a lovely relationship with your daughter.

Oh dear, reading your post and it's like De ja vu,! Had the same problem, nearly three years with us which was lovely for us as we got to see the boys, take them out, read them stories, play, watch them grow. It was hard as our daughter has bipolar and her dad had to get in between us more times than I can remember. Eventually she met a new man, they are married and the boys love him and he them, my point is we, my daughter and me now get on like best friends and proper mummy and daughter. Take heart and have faith,call will be well.

It does sound as though PMT could be a major cause of your arguments. Has your daughter done anything about that? My mother suffered from PMT and had a short fuse when having periods. Her GP kept telling her it was the menopause (she was 40 at the time) but it turned out that she needed a hysterectomy. This was over 40 years ago so things may be different now.

My OH became aware that I would argue black was white when suffering from PMT but I wasn't really aware of it.