Gransnet forums

Legal & money

Social Care and daughter

(80 Posts)
icanhandthemback Wed 29-May-19 19:24:29

My disabled daughter who is heavily pregnant, had a young carers assessment done for her daughter who has been quite involved with her mother's care especially as SIL has returned to work after 6 years looking after my daughter. He returned to work for 33 hours per week because he felt his mental health was suffering because of caring for my daughter. Young Carers have flagged concerns because there are times when my Grandaughter has to pour a dose of morphine for my daughter if she has a pain attack when her Dad is out. However, although it is a very small dose in the scheme of things, it does make my daughter very drowsy. Her daughter is able to look after herself, make a sandwich and drink, put herself to bed etc. Her Dad is always available at the end of the phone for any problems.
I have suggested that we get around the problem of the morphine with her daughter having to measuring it out by pre-loading a syringe and locking it into a key safe which my grandaughter can hand to my daughter. That way, there is no possibility of my grandaughter accidentally fatally overdosing her mother which would scar her for life. The problem is, a baby cannot be self sufficient and my daughter is really worried about how Young Carers will view her ability to cope. Because the pain when it comes is excruciating, she can't manage without the morphine but neither can she predict when it will happen which means that she can't have a carer be there for those times. Social Services obviously can't pay for somebody to be there just in case. She is hoping she won't need the morphine again quite so much as she needs it now but we just don't know what is likely to happen. This is a very new aspect to her disability which we weren't expecting.
Before she got pregnant, her husband wasn't working and they have both realised just how much better things are now he's got into the swing of things. He feels very selfish saying so but he thinks he can't cope being at home 24/7 again. He doesn't think his employer will be very happy if he suddenly has to down tools to go home. I am unable to step in because I have commitments to other family member.
Does anybody know of anything she can do as I am sure she has a right to be a mother and is petrified of her baby being removed from her care because of the medically prescribed morphine?

Sara65 Wed 29-May-19 19:29:24

This all sounds really worrying, how old is your granddaughter?

crazyH Wed 29-May-19 19:29:57

Oh I do hope they do not remove the many such worrying posts on today. I am not knowledgable enough to give you advice but I wish you and your family, all the best xx

Sara65 Wed 29-May-19 19:33:54

Like crazyh, I don’t think I can be of any real help, but I do feel really concerned for your granddaughter, and also your poor daughter, I’m sure someone will pop up with some good advice

Gonegirl Wed 29-May-19 19:34:45

I would think there is no alternative to your son-in-law staying home to be the main carer of his baby, and if necessary, his wife.

There are many young mums who find it extremely difficult mentally to stay at home full time caring for a baby. They try to find ways of coping. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but he did have something to do with the pregnancy happening.

I wish them well.

notanan2 Wed 29-May-19 20:08:33

That really doesnt sound okay. Could a fentanyl patch or syringe driver be an option? Or long acting morphine or oxycodone tablets?

notanan2 Wed 29-May-19 20:12:23

There are other ways of delivering morphine it shouldnt be making her thay drowsy!

icanhandthemback Wed 29-May-19 20:23:28

Gonegirl, I have empathy with your viewpoint and he has been the driving force behind wanting another baby because my daughter had huge reservations. It's not so much the baby he doesn't want to care for but being a full time carer to my daughter is hard work for anyone and he became quite resentful towards the end of his stint with them. He is 5 years younger than my daughter and if I am honest, he probably would have moved on quite quickly if his father hadn't died suddenly and tragically soon after they met. My daughter was a relatively healthy lady with a really well paying high end career so the changes in their life were quite shocking. He has always been the sort of person who loves working outside and he will happily work all the hours God gives him for peanuts so I do worry about how he will be with my daughter and grandaughter if he is pushed into this position. The consequences would probably be that he would get custody of their eldest daughter and the baby if he left her because she really couldn't cope. We have discussed him reducing his hours but the company won't let him.

My daughter used to have carers who came in to help her to do the things that you would prefer your husband not to do but since moving district, they are not sure that they consider her a suitable case. Added to that, her PIP reassessment failed by 2 points to keep her higher care and mobility and if she wants to challenge it, she will have to go to a tribunal which she really doesn't want to do because of the stress of it.

icanhandthemback Wed 29-May-19 20:28:46

Sara65, my grandaughter is nearly 8. She is, due to the circumstances, a very grown up girl and obviously her mother checks her medication before she takes it. However, her wrists dislocate so she can't get the lid of the bottle which is why her daughter does it. The chest pain she suffers is like having a really bad heart attack, her blood pressure drops to the floor making her tremble badly and her heart rate shoots up to about 150 bpm. Whilst she is pregnant, she has decided that she will go to the hospital until they can sort something out. She also worries terribly about the affects of the medication on her unborn baby. It is so stressful for everyone.

icanhandthemback Wed 29-May-19 20:34:44

notanan2, it isn't just the effects of the morphine. She is so ill with the pain, it exhausts her. Coupled with a condition where her joints dislocate, her muscles are very weak and these attacks cause fatigue. The morphine is the last straw as it gives her a thumping headache on top of everything else.
She had decided that she wouldn't have another baby because of her condition but last year, she got pregnant accidentally and had just got used to the idea when she lost it. That seemed to have made her desperate to have another child.

BlueBelle Wed 29-May-19 20:57:10

How old is the ‘caring’ child and what disability does your daughter have ? There must be an answer, does she live far away from you I realise you have other care duties but can people within the family /friend circle draw up an hour or two each to help each day
I don’t think it sounds as if she will manage at all with a new baby unless the family (if the husband won’t) step up to take over at least for the first six months
Could your daughter and granddaughter stay with you for a few months?

Sara65 Wed 29-May-19 21:02:21

Oh goodness icanhandthemback, what a massive burden for you all.

Your little granddaughter must be extraordinary, I have two nine year old granddaughters, and the would never handle that amount of responsibility.

I think gonegirl is right in saying that your son in law needs to be home, at least in the short term, this is way too much for an eight year old to be handling, and the worry you are feeling must be off the scale!

I’m sorry for all of you, will there be any improvement in your daughters condition after the baby is born?

Goodbyetoallthat Wed 29-May-19 21:12:09

Does your daughter have Ehlers Danlos Syndrome?
I really sympathise but you cannot expect a 7 year old to be in charge of distributing morphine.

As your daughter & her partner have decided to have another child he will have to drop some hours to help her with the baby. How will they manage otherwise?

Doodle Wed 29-May-19 21:12:41

ican so sorry for your family and the condition that they are in. Apart from the issue with the morphine, how on earth will your daughter cope with a baby? If her joints dislocate how will she be able to hold or change the baby? Is it possible that she and her husband could perhaps find a young (but considerably older than your DGD) person who doesn’t have a job to perhaps live in and help where they provide lodgings and food in return for some help.

quizqueen Wed 29-May-19 21:21:08

I'm sorry, but in my opinion, for this family to have even considered having another baby, with the situation as you describe it, is a very bad decision.

maryeliza54 Wed 29-May-19 21:23:57

It sounds as though the baby is due soon and as hard as it is I’m sure you know this situation especially when the baby is born is simply untenable. As harsh as it may sound the two children and their welfare are the most important. As said upthread, your SIL just cannot work in these awful circumstances - he just cannot. There is physical safety to consider here as well as the emotional well being of the older child. If he won’t stop work I think you must bring in social services. No one has the ‘right’ to be a mother but children have a right to be properly cared for. I think you know all this really don’t you and that there is no magic solution. I hesitated before posting this because I know it sounds harsh and the situation is really sad but sympathy won’t help - both the adults need to do what is right not for them but for their children and perhaps you can help them accept that rather than seek a solution which doesn’t exist.

BlueBelle Wed 29-May-19 21:28:41

Sorry ican I posted before. Your last posts showed up so some of my questions have already been answered
8 is very young to have so much on her shoulders even if she is level headed and grown up Does she go to school and who looks after your daughter when she is there?
She really needs a live in career doesn’t she so the child can be looked after too Could they stay with you when the baby is born for the first few months if the father isn’t after helping her ?
What a difficult situation Do the in laws help at all does your daughter have siblings or close friends ?

FlexibleFriend Wed 29-May-19 22:03:41

I take large doses of morphine they don't come in bottles they come in blister packs and are really easy to open. I've taken oramorph in addition to the tablets when in hospital and didn't find it helped to be honest. My pain isn't consistent either but the meds work better if taken every 12 hours rather than as and when.

Eglantine21 Wed 29-May-19 22:40:10

I really can’t see how they are going to manage a new baby unless the husband gives up work. A little girl can’t be expected to take that on as well.

What was the plan?

I’m sorry, I’m a bit unsympathetic to your daughter and her husband because I was a young supporter of a disabled mother.

It had a profound effect upon my childhood but at least my mother wouldn’t have added a baby to my responsibilities.

notanan2 Wed 29-May-19 22:50:55

notanan2, it isn't just the effects of the morphine. She is so ill with the pain, it exhausts her.

Appreciate that there is more to it, but the morphine issue is one fixable aspect by switching to a slower release form: patch/syringe driver/slow release tabs.

There are clearly a LOT of major issues but why not fix the fixable, at least its something. A child should NOT be handling morphine!

notanan2 Wed 29-May-19 22:52:46

How pregnant is she? I cant see how it can work, is it too late to terminate? They are barely parenting one child as it is!

maryeliza54 Wed 29-May-19 23:05:43

The OP says heavily pregnant

paddyann Wed 29-May-19 23:09:57

I am so sorry for the situation your family is in and I understand fully how you feel.My daughter has Fibromyalgia and hyper joint mobility syndrome amongst other things like PCOS.Her kids help care for her because her OH works away 12 out of 14 days .Not because he doesn't want to be there just because his line of work isn't available any closer to home.My daughters family lives 40 ish miles from me and although we help every week with things and bring the kids here to give them and her a break its heartbreaking to see her go downhill at the speed it's happened.She was fit and well and running two businesses until 4 years ago.The young carers staff here are fab,they check in on the family often and arrange things to occupy them outwith the house .Is there someone you would trust who lives near your daughter who you could pay to be on standby to administer meds? My daughter has a neighbour who is happy to be there when we cant be and that makes a huge difference to us all .Try to get her to attend the tribunal and see if she can get someone who knows the system to go with her.My daughter took a friend who works in Citizens Advice and he was fantastic .I too think a baby in these circumstances is a mistake but its on its way and I understand the need to have another after a miscarriage I dont know how she will manage a baby though with such severe symptoms .My heart goes out to you ,life is really harsh on you all .I hope you manage to find the help you all need

SueDonim Wed 29-May-19 23:44:11

Would temporary foster parents for the baby be an option? It's hard to see how your Dd could manage a baby when she is unable to look after a 9yo. If the baby is born morphine-dependent he/she is likely to be difficult to care for as well, due to withdrawal syndrome. Fostering might be an answer to that, until the baby is easier to manage and perhaps go into nursery care.

Alternatively, could you fit a baby into your life for a while? You mention other caring duties but sometimes babies slot in well, due to being portable and not too mobile inthe early months.

maryeliza54 Thu 30-May-19 00:11:22

I honestly think any temporary solutions are not what is needed. The baby and little girl need security and stability and the little girl needs a childhood. She can have this with a father who stays at home, claims all the benefits and help the family are entitled to. Perhaps the OP could help sort out a system whereby the father can have a regular day off to have some ‘me time’ by either offering to go over to help out or pay for help to come in on those days. The grown ups in this situation ( including the OP) need to start from the premise that the children and their well bring come first.