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Channel 4 debate

(179 Posts)
Anja Mon 17-Jun-19 06:49:56

If that load of idiots is the best that’s in offer for the next PM then ‘We’re Doomed!’.

Riverwalk Mon 17-Jun-19 06:58:04

I didn't watch it Anja - refuse to allow the Tory party in-fighting any more of my brain time than is absolutely necessary!

I don't know why the national broadcasters are showing these hustings - 99.9% of us have no say in the matter.

Cindersdad Mon 17-Jun-19 07:31:09

Apart from Rory Stewart none of them inspire me. Dominic Raab stands out the most odious looking to disregard parliament.

Why do they keep going to the 2016 vote which was riddled with lies and misunderstanding. Remember Boris Johnson admitted lying yet still gets away with it. BOJO especially and the rest of them are not fit for purpose.

A second referendum and/or a general election is the only way forward. We need PR to give us a proper day in the future. Deliberate lying to win elections or referenda to be a criminal offence.

tanith Mon 17-Jun-19 07:31:11

Children in a playground came to mind when I saw a snippet on the news 👺

Iam64 Mon 17-Jun-19 07:47:13

Missed it as I was binge watching a series on Netflix. I've looked at reviews on line and may watch on catch up when I'm doing my ironing later. That's about the level of my enthusiasm for this contest.
I'm still so cross that a group of largely white, older, middle aged men are going to select our next PM. This at a time when the country is in dire straits. Taxes, public services, crime, education, health - where do the potential leaders stand on that. I can't see any way out of this unless there's a general election soon after Doris wins the contest and the country has a say.

goldengirl Mon 17-Jun-19 09:51:50

What bugged me was the constant interruptions when someone was speaking! How childish and ignorant. And these are people who want to run the country! The best man [yes, all male note!] I thought was Rory Stewart

Urmstongran Mon 17-Jun-19 10:00:18

I think with the selected audience it was Channel 4's cunning plan to attack tories. Well done Boris!

EllanVannin Mon 17-Jun-19 10:06:06

I didn't watch this but I'd said a week or two back " God help us all ".
Apologies to all those who support Rory Stewart but to my mind he's not leader material and is as weak as water !
As prisons minister this character seems only interested in the " house-keeping" side of crime grousing about the lack of cleanliness in prisons.They're prisons for God's sake !!
Grime is par for the course ! Isn't it ?

We need someone who is tough and assertive with a genuine interest in the public, someone who has the courage of their convictions. Sadly, there isn't anyone of that calibre.

EllanVannin Mon 17-Jun-19 10:06:59

* they're prisons.

GrannyGravy13 Mon 17-Jun-19 10:08:08

Channel 4 gets funding from the EU.

Good on Boris for not being part of the bear pit!!!

Looking forward to seeing what he has to say on BBC tomorrow!

Whitewavemark2 Mon 17-Jun-19 10:10:07

It was truly dreadful. I have never heard such a load of piffle in my life.

Urmstongran Mon 17-Jun-19 10:13:52

I didn’t realise the EU helps fund Channel 4 GrannyGravy13

That explains the bias!

silverlining48 Mon 17-Jun-19 10:24:32

But Boris is surely part of the bear pit as you call it GG. Actually it was all very polite.
I think it’s concerning that he has yet to give an interview anywhere and is represented on the today or any other programme by ‘supporters’ standing in fir him. Certainly his advisers are trying to keep him away from answering questions, worrying about him making more gaffs, which is probably wise of them but is this man the best we can find to lead the country, he seems only a slightly more affable Trump.
I too look forward to Tuesday.

Urmstongran Mon 17-Jun-19 10:31:19

“Silence is golden as Boris's lectern wins Tory televised debate” says John Crace this morning in the Graun.

‘Rory Stewart’s calculated weakness played to viewers at home, but the elephant in the room won the day”

Whitewavemark2 Mon 17-Jun-19 10:32:17

The only plan a single one of them had for Brexit was Mays plan and that was Stewart. The rest just tried to sound macho about it all.

They were all part of the government that trashed our public services some to the point of collapse.

Then when on to say that their priorities were —public services. Lies, lies, lies.

CarlyD7 Mon 17-Jun-19 10:35:00

This is not a general election - it's between the MPs and then the Tory members. Why is it using up viewing time? Why is it using up OUR precious time? Personally, I am sick and tired of the in-fighting in the Tory party - that's what got us into this whole Brexit mess in the first place. None of them deserve to be PM.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 17-Jun-19 10:38:13


lemongrove Mon 17-Jun-19 10:38:26

anja I doubt that they are really idiots ( any more than a bunch of Labour hopefuls vying for the top job).
Pitting yourself against fellow MP’s, for any Party, is always going to be difficult.
Tbh, I think the whole televised debate scenario, that seems obligatory now for politics is a waste of time.They all are setting out their stall and hoping you will buy their goods, but viewers ( even if tempted by the goods for sale) can quickly find that the goods are not nearly so appealing once the candidate has won.They turn out to be broken,dog eared,or not for sale at all.
Since the Party itself (members) will select from the last two,
It hardly matters anyway.

counterpoint Mon 17-Jun-19 10:45:03

@GrannyGravy13 Could you say what makes you think Channel 4 receives EU funding?

GrandmaKT Mon 17-Jun-19 10:48:13

Having done a quick search, I can find no evidence of Channel 4 receiving funding from the EU. Could someone post a link?

polnan Mon 17-Jun-19 10:51:29

I agree with you CarlyD7

everything is much too intrusive nowadays, and digressing, all the Royal Family rubbish. ARGH!

not debating, what little I saw of it... kids in playground, and that is disrespectful to kids.. as someone has commented

God help us

Theoddbird Mon 17-Jun-19 10:53:02

Margaret Thatcher refused to take part in a similar debate when she was running for prime minister. Preferring to let them argue. She did eventually take part in debates...when the list had whittled down.

lemongrove Mon 17-Jun-19 10:53:44

If you think that was poor Polnan.....just wait for the next general election!

Sealover Mon 17-Jun-19 10:57:28

Check out Radio 4 programme last Friday called Rethinking Representation. I think it was on at 11am. Excellent. Makes the Channel 4 debate shameful. So refreshing to hear a 'political programme in a measured, calm and SO sensible.People have short memories, it's not long since Jeremy Hunt brought the NHS to its knees, Michael Gove the education system. So many apologies made for Boris who has a penchant for offending people. Potential leaders of the country? So scary.

sue01 Mon 17-Jun-19 10:58:00

Theoddbird is spot on. Boris is being well advised. If it is the new lady in his life who has planned his campaign, they are indeed a formidable team.

Barmeyoldbat Mon 17-Jun-19 11:00:08

Didn't watch it as I am sick to death of the whole thing. I spent yesterday, a wet afternoon, discussing events with friends and we were all of the same mind, even if we try to ignore this B an Tory fighting its still there.

EllanVannin Mon 17-Jun-19 11:02:48

Boris won't come clean on his thoughts for Brexit ! I've said before that he's a closet remainer but he'll never admit it so does a vanishing trick to get out of any embarrassment.
This man's no good if he can't stand up to his own beliefs. He's a waffler who deviates from the truth. Doesn't kid me !

Urmstongran Mon 17-Jun-19 11:07:37

Team Boris are very slick. They’ve done their homework.

GuestCorrectly Mon 17-Jun-19 11:09:21

There’s clearly a problem when Rory Stewart is the only one I thought talked any sense and yet I’ve always thought him weird. Also his voting record in Parliament does nothing to charm me.

keffie Mon 17-Jun-19 11:10:24

Granny Gravy, Boris is known as a liar, a cheat manipulative, ego centric, lazy and does not give a damn about anyone.

He is a narcissist who has the unusual "quality" of making people laugh. He is put out of the same ilk as Trump and Farage

He has been sacked from two large media papers for outrageous lies. Involved in a set up to get someone beaten up and has been fined 3 times for the lies he told in the leave campaign.

He also fathered a child out of marriage whilst he was married and lied about it too to The Tory party committee. He is a serial philanderer who would sell his Grandma down the river for anything he wants

It's all about him and when he gets what he wants loses interest. I know two people who in there words have had the unfortunancy to work with him and witness how he plays

His antics and behaviour are well known in his world. The only reason he gets away with it is because a section of the population and those around him are like "hes a bit of a bumbling fool and a good laugh"

That does not make good P M material. Still if he wins the truth will soon out. Only so long the spin can work for.

The best of of a bad bunch is Rory Stewart who talks sense but wont get elected cos he doesn't talk the Tory delusion.

There will have to be a G.E and a confirmatory vote at some stage.

We wont leave in October. The Irish border cannot be solved and it cannot be ignored either. The withdrawal treaty states that if you read it. Section 10 if my memory serves me right makes that very clear. It cannot be changed.

It's either the deal bought by May or revoke and stay. As much as they pontificate that is the reality.

Nothing will change under a new leader. The same problems remain.

There is a special place in hell to quote Donsld Tusk with Cameron heading it for those who started this

Urmstongran Mon 17-Jun-19 11:16:51

Remainers love Rory.
Leavers need Boris.

123coco Mon 17-Jun-19 11:34:38

* Urmstongran*. You are really unbelievable in your ignorance!

Whingingmom Mon 17-Jun-19 11:36:43

I’m not sure about Ch 4, but BBC gets £4 billion pa from the EU apparently. Even more disgusting re licence fees

Whingingmom Mon 17-Jun-19 11:39:53

Sorry£4m - still too much!!

Elvive Mon 17-Jun-19 11:40:11

Yes, well done new lady. She has forced him to ditch the cheese and pate and tamed his hair. It's all good.

varian Mon 17-Jun-19 11:40:28

The Brexit Broadcasting Corporation has been extremely biased against the EU for a very long time. Why else would they have invited liar Farage to appear on QT 29 times in the years before the referendum?

knspol Mon 17-Jun-19 11:44:02

I watched only the first half and the very worrying thing for me was that Michael Gove seemed to be the candidate who spoke most clearly and decisively - heaven help us all.

maxdecatt Mon 17-Jun-19 12:02:36

We need tough negotiators and the shower on TV last night are not tough. Get businessmen around the table.
The fundamental misunderstanding among the current would-be leaders is that Mrs May negotinated a deal with the EU. However it was subject to approval by the UK parliament and they have rejected it three times. So, NO DEAL acceptable to the UK actually exsists and they should stop referring to "the deal with the EU"...because there is no such deal. Mrs May is out of the picture and with her went "her" deal. A new Prime Minister will have to meet with the EU and both sides start from square one to work out a deal acceptable to Britain and the EU. Our side must now make it clear that the £39 billion the EU want (originally they demanded over £80 billion) is also fresh on the table and is part and parcel of any deal. No acceptable deal from the EU means no £39 billion from the UK. It is very simple. Tell the EU: Be reasonable and all are happy. Play your games as you did with Mrs May and you kiss your £39 billion goodbye. A way to focus EU minds is to make the £39 billion part of the negotiating period. A deal in four weeks earns £39 billion. Dragging their heels as per EU normal behaviour will see the pot of gold shrink by £10 billion for every week they delay beyond the first four weeks. So a deal in four weeks and get it all. Continue your EU style delay and procrastination for 8 weeks and you get bugger all. It is a racing certainty that an acceptable deal will be agreed in less than four weeks. The EU cannot afford to lose that £39 billion, if they do they will be bankrupt in about a year.... unless they really cut their overheads to the bone, something those spendthrifts will never be abl;e to do..

maxdecatt Mon 17-Jun-19 12:03:47

VARIAN.,. Farage was invited back multiple times because he is the only one with anything sensible to say.

lemongrove Mon 17-Jun-19 12:04:52

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 max......if only, eh?

lemongrove Mon 17-Jun-19 12:08:35

The Beeb invited NF varian on QT so many times because they knew he would bring in viewers and there would be controversy, also perhaps he was willing to take part so often, it wasn’t a conspiracy.

winterwhite Mon 17-Jun-19 12:12:16

Well, whoever wins will automatically be prime minister so I think fair enough that the nation has a chance to hear what the candidates think. The televised snippets were of course the few acrimonious bits. On the whole it was good tempered.
Not enough about policies / funding / taxation, but that was down to the questions chosen in advance by Channel 4.
I thought Boris did himself harm by not attending. Who does he think he is to be above public participation? I'm surprised that so many people seem to think it clever and wise of him not to say what he thinks at such a crucial moment. Supercilious might be another word.

humptydumpty Mon 17-Jun-19 12:13:15

In 2009 Nick Griffin was on QT for BNP and made a complete prat of himself, great!

Ginny42 Mon 17-Jun-19 12:16:34

Crikey Max! Clearly Mrs May was unaware there was such an eloquent negotiator available to out-fox those pesky Europeans. It's all so easy standing back shouting from the sidelines, but it's the key players on the pitch who have to score the goals.

varian Mon 17-Jun-19 12:31:52

There are 73 Maps representing the UK in the European Parliament yet during the years before the referendum liar Farage appeared on QT 29 times and the only other MEP ever invited was ultra-brexitty Tory Daniel Hannan who was invited once.

Hannan is another liar. He told us during the campaign "no one is talking about leaving the single market" which he now denies saying.

Utterly disgraceful bias by the Brexit Broadcasting Corporation.

grandmac Mon 17-Jun-19 13:04:07

Did favour Rory Stewart until I saw him being interviewed by a female journalist where he was sprawled in a chair with his legs as far apart as was possible. Such disrespectful behaviour shows ignorance, arrogance and rudeness IMO. Not good qualities in a leader.

travelsafar Mon 17-Jun-19 13:11:00

I too fell under the spell of Rory Stewart .

Elvive Mon 17-Jun-19 13:12:55

Was it the spreading legs that did it travel?

sarahellenwhitney Mon 17-Jun-19 13:17:04

Wise man Boris in not wishing to be part of a 'free for all'.

Tillybelle Mon 17-Jun-19 13:33:13

Boris was remiss for his cowardly refusal to stand up and be counted. He was too frightened to be the only person who says we should agree to a no-deal Brexit.

I don't think it was a "Bear-pit". It should be a lively and challenging debate. If anything it was not all that challenging.

I think the only things Rory Stewart has against him are his looks and his posh background and voice. He is a decent caring man imho.

As Boris J. couldn't face the crowd or be bothered to stand up and speak, I will give a wonderful testimonial from one of his previous employers:

“Boris is a gold medal egomaniac… His chaotic public persona is not an act – he is, indeed, manically disorganised about everything except his own image management. He is also a far more ruthless, and frankly nastier, figure than the public appreciates… I would not take Boris’s word about whether it is Monday or Tuesday… He is not a man to believe in, to trust or respect, save as a superlative exhibitionist. He is bereft of judgment, loyalty and discretion. Only in the star-crazed, friviolous Britain of the 21st century could such a man have risen so high, and he is utterly unfit to go higher still.”
Sir Max Hastings

GrandmaKT Mon 17-Jun-19 13:50:52

maxdecatt you seem to think that the £39 billion is some sort of punitive divorce settlement being demanded by the EU.
It is actually money that the UK owes the EU for projects already committed to that are ongoing until next year. If we renege on paying it we are unlikely to be viewed in a positive light by any potential new trading partners!
As for the EU "dragging their heels" - words fail me!!!

ReadyMeals Mon 17-Jun-19 13:55:20

I don't know why they call this new style of politics show a "debate". They are not debates, they're kind of panel shows like gardeners question time, but with politicians rather than botanists.

lovebeigecardigans1955 Mon 17-Jun-19 13:59:12

I didn't watch it either. What was the point? It's not as though Ch 4 viewers have a vote on it. Complete and utter nonsense.

luluaugust Mon 17-Jun-19 15:54:23

Exactly , as we have no vote why bother with this broadcast.

crystaltipps Mon 17-Jun-19 15:57:35

It was Father’s Day so perhaps Boris was busy.

Nanniejc1 Mon 17-Jun-19 16:21:19

I agree Urmonsgran us leavers want Boris....Remainers want Rory,he seems weak & wet to me but there who am I to say & I’m sure that Boris will have lots of clever people to advise him on the best course of be honest it’s like ‘last chance saloon’ for the Conservative Party because they will never be forgiven if they don’t take us out of the EU & can’t imagine anyone would want to see Corbin as PM!!

Tillybelle Mon 17-Jun-19 16:22:31

crystaltipps grin 🤣😲

Nanniejc1 Mon 17-Jun-19 16:31:56

I personally don’t see why we should pay the EU a penny & it should certainly be on the table when negotiating.We need a strong negotiating team ,not one that is going to just except what they are told (like May).Farage should be included,he would be a strong negotiator as would Rabb,Rees Mogg ,Sir Bill Cash etc.Believe it or not Farage gets invited on to tv programmes because he actually has a personality,is entertaining & says things that lots of people want to hear.

Iam64 Mon 17-Jun-19 16:45:14

When you leave a club, there are consequences. Leave the gymn or golf club, you still pay the gees you signed up for. Is the EU any different ? The leaving fee was never on the side of a bus

Greta Mon 17-Jun-19 17:11:55

We now have 6 candidates who all know that they, and only they, can deliver Brexit. It must therefore be a matter of possessing a particular personality trait that Teresa May lacks. She could not negotiate a proper deal but now it will all change because Superman will just do it.
I hear Matthew Hancock has decided to support Boris. Could it possibly be that he (Hancock) believes Boris will win the race and give MH a ministerial post? Plus ça change!

suzied Mon 17-Jun-19 17:16:47

They are just jostling to rearrange the deckchairs on the Titanic.

GillT57 Mon 17-Jun-19 17:34:14

nanniejc1 as has been said many times, the 39bn is not a fine, it represents costs for ongoing commitments and projects that we signed up while still members of the EU, including pension costs for people like Farage.

Ginny42 Mon 17-Jun-19 17:50:24

Nanniejcl I see that you wish Farage to be on the negotiating team for us leaving the EU. The EU is his employer and paymaster in a job which has paid him handsomely for not attending meetings he was supposed to chair. A job with pension rights many people would regard as seeing them well set up for their retirement.

If he is on the negotiating team he will be being paid a salary by the EU whilst he negotiates the UK leaving. Bizarre.

Marieeliz Mon 17-Jun-19 17:51:06

Rory Stewart would have to ask Mummy for the money. Read article where when in Afghanistan he had no money and asked a journalist for some. He said Mummy would pay it back. Enough said.

Riverwalk Mon 17-Jun-19 18:07:21

I've noted that Stewart's Wiki page no longer refers to him as having been a Governor/Deputy Governor of an Iraqi province, he's now said to have been a Deputy Governorate Co-Ordinator.

I'm wondering just how much of Afghanistan he really did walk, supposedly across the whole country.

Firecracker123 Mon 17-Jun-19 18:08:00

Theresa May is backing Rory Stewart that's a good enough reason Not to back him, I think he's an EU plant pushing her crap deal.

dayvidg Mon 17-Jun-19 18:09:43

Regarding the Question Time 'bias', whilst by no means seeing all of Farage's appearances, those I did see he was the only non-remainer on the panel.

Ginny42 Mon 17-Jun-19 18:13:35

Marieeliz, read about his work in Afghanistan before ridiculing him. He helped to restore the old part of Kabul, establishing a clinic and a primary school and at one point was imprisoned by the Taliban. Mother's boy? I don't think so.

Anniebach Mon 17-Jun-19 18:32:49

I like Rory Stewart, perhaps next time

Ilovecheese Mon 17-Jun-19 18:44:06

Quote from Caroline Lucas
"Watching C4 debate, hearing so many pledges about righting wrongs and so many promises about tackling injustice, makes me wish that these men had been in government so they could have had a chance to implement them

Oh wait....."

She articulates what I thought watching the debates.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 17-Jun-19 18:49:49

What everyone thought with any intelligence ilove

maxdecatt Mon 17-Jun-19 19:15:47

GRANDMAKT If the £39 billion is our portion of what we are obliged to psay why did the EU initially chance its arm and demand almost £90 billion ? They will take whatever they can get. I do not propose reneging on the £39 billion but I believe our paying it should be part and parcel of the deal that is to be done. It is the best bargaining chip on the table and must be used. Remember that the EU accountants have refused to sign the annual accounts for over 19 YEARS. Accountants only do that when they do not like, do not believe, the financial claims of a business. In other words when they think and know that the books are crooked. So, by definition, that means the accontants employed to audit the EU regard it as a deeply crooked organisation that is unchanged for almost two decades. Do you want to be part of an organisation that cannot produce an honest balance sheet? If so move to France or Italy, both have dodgy financial records.

maxdecatt Mon 17-Jun-19 19:38:27

Ginny 42. You are trying to be sarcastic but fail rsather badly.
I suggested we get real negotiators around the table. Mrs. May could not negotiate her way out of a wet paper bag. She was regarded as a successful Home Scretary because in that post there is no negotiation. All that a Home Secretary does is implement laid down governnment policy. She rubber stamped Windrush, she sent vans around the streets telling immigrants to go home or be thrown out. There was no negotiation...she was simply "following orders". She should have been a Civil Servant.....brain in neutral, no initiative, no room for common sense. It was never "her deal". It was what the EU told her the deal was to be. She did not negotiate....remember that she was sent out of the room while the "big people" discussed the issue..... and then she meekly accepted their diktat. Any British Prime Minister worthy of the title would have told them to get stuffed and just walked out. Can you imagine Margaret Thatcher putting up with the unelected EU officials tellling her that she could not meet with the other heads of state to talk about Brixit? Can you imagine her sitting in a side room and eating alone while the EU types had dinner together? Can you imagine Maggie being snubbed in the photo line-up and left iso;lated and alone. Her handbag would have smacked a few arrogant heads, especially those of Juncker and Tusk (both failed politiciuans in their own countries) and she would have told them off in public.

Marieeliz Mon 17-Jun-19 19:44:02

Ginny42, no one else seems to have brought that up and I'm sure they would have if it was correct. He looks like a typical Public School boy. It was probably his gap year. The journalist said Mummy sent her the money.

seadragon Mon 17-Jun-19 19:56:15

Yes, I heard that programme too, Sealover and promoted it on Facebook. As for the debate, please don't be deceived by Rory's frail physical appearance. Anyone who has read about his life before parliament, knows just how tough he is.

seadragon Mon 17-Jun-19 19:57:10

Unfortunately Rory's refreshing courtesy against the stridence of others may be a disadvantage in such an arena as a television debate.

Ginny42 Mon 17-Jun-19 20:01:42

Exactly Seadragon. Marieeliz- It's correct. There's plenty out there on his achievements before becoming an MP.

Elvive Mon 17-Jun-19 20:35:27

He seems the best of the bunch? Some handle on reality.

Anniebach Mon 17-Jun-19 21:41:05

Rory is getting popular with the public, he will be out tomorrow

Dinahmo Tue 18-Jun-19 00:22:24

maxdecatt - the arrangements for the withdrawal of a state from the European Union are set out in Article 218(3) in the Treaty on the Functioning of the EU. They have said on many occasions that they will not renegotiate with the UK. Any politician who states that they can do so is either pig headed, arrogant or stupid (or all three)

As regards the "signing off" of the EU's annual accounts, there appears to be a slight misunderstanding here. Included in their opinion of the 2016 accounts the state " we were therefore able to give a clean opinion of the accounts as we have done since 2007"

Auditors' opinions are given on the accuracy and reliability of the accounts, that they present a true and fair view and follow the rules of financial reporting. If they qualify a set of accounts they give their reasons for the qualification.

The auditors have found significant errors in how the money was paid out. This does not mean that all the people involved were fraudulent. The UK's Public Accounts Committee concluded that for years the complexity of the EU's spending programme, which creates misunderstanding, contributes towards these errors. It doesn't mean that the money was wasted but that it wasn't paid out according to the rules. eg - awarding and EU funded contract directly without holding a proper bidding process .However, the most common type of error is when people claim for costs which they aren't eligible for. Beloved (by some) NF has had his salary halved on order to recoup misspent money.

Joplin Tue 18-Jun-19 00:37:08

Tillybelle, what a good, & unfortunately truthful, summary of Boris! I hope it's widely read by as many politicians as possible.

GabriellaG54 Tue 18-Jun-19 07:59:25

Rory Stewart
Dated and subsequently married a woman who was still happily married to her first husband at the time of their meeting.


silverlining48 Tue 18-Jun-19 08:19:56

I know nothing about the backstory but If someone is happily married why would they agree to go on a date with another man?

Iam64 Tue 18-Jun-19 08:22:04

The marriage broke down, it happens as we're all old enough and wise enough to know.
I don't see much comparison between that and Doris with his serial philandering and unknown number of children. He betrayed his wife over and over. One of his daughters recently described him as a selfish **.

Elvive Tue 18-Jun-19 08:29:03

Exactly, not the same scenario at all. Actually " philandering" makes him sound like some sort of 19th century dandy.

Just like Boris makes him sound like some somebody we know and love.

The truth, from his ex wife, his children, his father, those who have worked with him is somewhat different.

Anniebach Tue 18-Jun-19 08:31:35

Just recalled Alan Clatk, one wife, many mistresses, many of the public loved him .😀

Anja Tue 18-Jun-19 09:01:41

Yes I called them idiots Lemon and perhaps ‘incompetents’ would have been more accurate. Gove managed to alienate the teachers, Hunt the junior doctors. Neither showed any of the ‘negotiating skills’ they boasted about on C4. Javid has failed to make any significant improvements at the Home Office and Raab didn’t last two minutes as Brexit Secretary.

There was only Stewart who actually attempted to debate, which is what the programme was supposed to be.

Firecracker123 Tue 18-Jun-19 09:02:04

I don't care how many supposed affairs or marriages Boris has had all I want him to do is carry out the referendum vote and take us out of the EU on the 31st October 2019 and get rid of the Remainers in the cabinet.

maxdecatt Tue 18-Jun-19 09:18:34

Dinahmo. Read what they said and read it carefully. " We are therefore able to give a clean opinion of the accounts" They do not say, "We give an opinion that the accounts are clean". What they were saying was that the audit wax conducted in a clean other words their opinion is clean and untarnished....not influenced by bullying of EU opfficials to whitewash a can of worms. That is not an fact it is a subtle condemnation of the acconts. "We found the books to have been cooked but are restrained from saying so is so many words". Auditors always cover their backs...they earn vast sums for their work and the last thing they would say is "This business is crooked". So they couch their report in language which prevents them (the auditors) from being accused of covering up fraud. "What we were allowed to see is more or less acceptable, but beyond that we cannot say" Their regulating body is well aware of the need to do so....auditors being struck of the board is the lastr thing they want.

Urmstongran Tue 18-Jun-19 09:49:03

Where there’s money there’s a temptation for wrong doing. The EU has an awful lot of money ....

lemongrove Tue 18-Jun-19 09:49:26

If the general public had known about the private lives of all politicians years ago, some, who were really very good at their jobs and brought in landmark policies for the greater good of the UK , would never have been chosen.Just something to think about.
You could say ( with some accuracy) that we know far too much now without seeing the whole picture, just snippets of information about individuals that don’t add up to the whole.
Am talking of all MP’s btw.

Whitewavemark2 Tue 18-Jun-19 09:50:50

Ooh do name lemon

lemongrove Tue 18-Jun-19 10:07:15

You would have to go back a long way WWM2 and read biographies of all PM’s,in all Parties, plus cabinet members.
Even then, you wouldn’t get all the flaws and private misdemeanors.Today, everything is brought out in the open for us to see.

Iam64 Tue 18-Jun-19 10:20:32

Sadly, lemongrove, not everything is brought into the open. Just ordinary gossip about affairs and recently the historical drug use many of the current crop of politicians of a certain age are likely to have shared with voters of their generation. Hardly anyone gets agitated about that, tho I confess to disliking serial philanderers and liars. Just saying

GabriellaG54 Tue 18-Jun-19 10:26:20

'^just saying^' What a juvenile remark with which to end a post.

GabriellaG54 Tue 18-Jun-19 10:28:52

Should read Just saying

Whitewavemark2 Tue 18-Jun-19 10:33:29

In other words lemon you don’t know. Guesswork?

Riverwalk Tue 18-Jun-19 10:48:38

There was a GN thread about RS five years ago - seems I was as sceptical then as I am now!

Rory Stewart

Just because he's not Boris Johnson doesn't make him a good prime minister.

Whitewavemark2 Tue 18-Jun-19 10:49:48

None of them will make a good prime minister

silverlining48 Tue 18-Jun-19 11:20:28

I have just read the thread from 2014 river and it seems many gnetters were impressed with Rory Stewart then as now. Personally I had never heard of him til recent events.