Johnson and Brexit

POGS, it's not the "EU Army denial again". I'm not denying Juncker said what he did . What I am questioning (not denying) is whether the claim that there are firm plans is true. Supporting something, as opposed to having firm plans, is not the same thing. I have listened to Merkel's original address from November 2018. She is asking for co-operation between armies and stating that, at some time in the future, an integrated army would be the best way for Europe to defend itself. That really isn't how the Express (and some other media) have represented it.

Meanwhile, this makes interesting reading: Is an EU army possible? besacenter.org/online-debates/debate-is-an-eu-army-possible/

Remember the Iran War, POGS? I expect Tony Blair does.

I've read what you've written. The UK was absolutely correct not to accept US intervention if the price was accepting US terms. I, for one, do not want to get dragged into another war against Iran as the US's poodle.

It was the Iraq war, I'm afraid, growstuff.

The Iran/Iraq war was earlier, when we supported both sides by selling arms to both...

Ooops! Silly me! Typo because I'm tired. Off to the dunce's corner :-(

It appears that on the orders of Dominic Cummings, Boris Johnson and every member of his government must now keep repeating the phrase "undemocratic backstop" in an attempt to dismiss legitimate concerns about the threat to the Good Friday Agreement posed by brexit.

Jane Merrick, writing in the "i" today, reports that-

"The Prime Minister’s hopes of a post Brexit trade deal with the US would be dashed should he threaten the Good Friday Agreement by removing the Northern Ireland backstop from the Withdrawal Agreement, changing the UK border with Ireland, a senior US politician has warned. Richard Neal, the Democratic chairman of the US congressional committee responsible for trade policy, said that Boris Johnson missed the point about the Belfast Agreement, that it had been voted for by people in both Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland.

In an interview with the Irish Times ahead of Mr Johnson’s visit to Northern Ireland, Mr Neal, who is also co-chairman of the Friends of Ireland caucus in Congress, warned that there should be “no compromise” on risking the peace process. His remarks are significant because any threat to the Good Friday Agreement could be used as leverage in Congress to block any Johnson Trump trade deal.

Mr Neal is chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, which has the power to block or approve trade deals. Mr Johnson’s post-Brexit trade policy weighs heavily on a potential deal with Washington DC, and the US President has previously said that he could strike a “very substantial trade agreement” with the UK. Stressing that it was not the President but Congress who wrote trade agreements, Mr Neal (inset) added: “He [Mr Johnson] needs to be reminded that this is not about a return to empire. You’d be hard-pressed to find everybody else who has been saying the things he has as related to the backstop provision.

“If Boris Johnson calls the backstop ‘undemocratic’ then he misses the point that people in the north and in the Republic both voted for the Good Friday Agreement. It was a democratic exercise in a representative democracy.” Mr Neal added: “There should be no compromise. The Good Friday Agreement has worked as well as anybody could have imagined. It brought to rest the longest standing political conflict in the history of the western world, and I don’t think there’s any reason for the Irish government to back away.”

Cummings is playing with fire, but I suspect he doesn’t care.

Tension is beginning to ratchet up in NI and if someone being interviewed this morning is right, then a remain voting NI would almost certainly vote to join with the RoI.

Then of course there is Scotland who is champing at the bit, to have another referendum.

The Tories are in severe danger of completely wrecking the United Kingdom.

All this talk about the EU army is part of a project fear from leavers, funny how the same people also claim the EU is on the verge of collapse, if it about to fall apart it won’t be able to have an army so what are you worried about?

I'm sorry, I feel like saying. Calm Down! We are not about to disintegrate, whatever comes, we will get through it, if not. We are all doomed.?

The problem with Northern Ireland is that even if the majority voted to join Eire, there would still be a significant number of unionists, who fiercely oppose it. On the other hand, the people on the border will strongly oppose any hard border, which there would have to be. Surely people's memories aren't so short that they've forgotten the intransigient and entrenched attitudes which cause the troubles. The Good Friday Agreement was only possible because both countries were in the EU. If anybody seriously has heard of any viable solution, I'd love to hear about it.

No, we're not all about to disintegrate but why would anybody in their right mind actually choose to make life worse?

crystaltipps, There just isn't any logic.

The whole brexit project is all about making life a lot worse for ordinary UK citizens so certain foreign billionaires and money speculators can get even richer, serving the purposes of certain ultra-right wing foreign politicians who regard us all as pawns in their game of gaining power, influence and megabucks.

crystaltips

"All this talk about the EU army is part of a project fear from leavers"
----

Well I did not vote Leave.

It could be argued since Junkers State of the Union Adrees things have moved forward in the direction of an EU Army /EU Defence alignment call it what ever we want.

www.europarl.europa.eu/legislative-train/theme-europe-as-a-stronger-global-actor/file-european-defence-union

Extract.
'On 14 December 2016 Parliament re-emphasised that the EU must strengthen its security and defence capabilities and expressed support for all related initiatives, including the setting up of a defence configuration of the Council and the activation of PESCO. On 16 March 2017 the EP urged the Council to take steps towards the harmonisation and standardisation of the European armed forces. It called on the Council and the HR/VP to elaborate an EU White Book on security and defence.

On 13 December 2017 the EP welcomed PESCO. It urged the Member States to commit themselves to a common and autonomous European defence, and to aim to ensure that their national defence budgets amount to at least 2 % of GDP within a decade. It added that a common cyber defence policy should be one of the first building blocks of EDU, within the PESCO framework, and called for the establishment of a DG Defence in the Commission.

On 13 June 2018 the EP adopted a resolution on EU-NATO relations where it stressed that "certain EU Member States’ non-membership of NATO should mean that they have different EDU obligations" and that EU Member States should be capable of launching autonomous military missions where EU action is more appropriate. On the same day Parliament also adopted a resolution on cyber defence. On 3 July 2018 Parliament adopted a legislative resolution on the proposal for a regulation establishing the European Defence Industrial Development Programme aiming at supporting the competitiveness and innovative capacity of the EU defence industry. In December 2018 the EP adopted a resolution on military mobility in which it expressed its support for the initiative and for EU-NATO cooperation. In its annual resolution on the implementation of the CSDP, the Parliament welcomed the progress in all areas of security and defence and underlined, among other things, the need for a stronger parliamentary dimension, including oversight, of security and defence policy, among other thingd through a fully-fledged Committee on Security and Defence, complemented by joint interparliamentary meetings between representatives from national parliaments and MEPs. In February 2018 the EP welcomes PESCO, CARD and the EDF as important steps towards a common defence policy, and noted proposals by certain Member States for an EU Security Council and a European Intervention Initiative. It recalled its call for the establishment of a permanent Council of Defence Ministers underlined the importance of appropriate democratic accountability of decisions taken in the area of defence and the need for reinforced cooperation between the EP and national parliaments in this regard. On 28 March the EP adopted a resolution supporting the European Peace Facility and on 18 April 2019, Parliament adopted the partial agreement on the European Defence Fund.
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Good question from Hugh Grant talking about the obscene amount of money being wasted on no deal.

“Can the government do this without parliamentary approval”

My guess is yes but I take his point, it is just disastrous, when the NHS, education, social services etc need so much. This money has been denied to the social fabric of our country ever since the Tories took office, and yet look at this sudden emergence of such vast amounts.

Be in no doubt that the Tories have no care for the NHS, or poor.

Whietwavemark2 saw an interesting comment this morning. The latest top up to the Brexit propaganda fund is enough to give every nurse in the UK a 10% pay rise. Put that on the side of your bus Johnson.

We are beginning to learn what government by cult looks like, with every ministerial pronouncement about Brexit now indistinguishable from the rabid outpourings of the legions of pseudonymous Brexiter social media warriors. It’s as if all the seats at the cabinet table have fallen into the hands of @bleiveinbrexit38754 accounts.

No bogus statistic, half-truth, misunderstanding, naivety or downright lie is left unuttered. The world looks on, bemused and amused, at the spectacle of a once-respected country now simultaneously belligerent and absurd, daily trashing its global reputation even as it proclaims and romantically remembers itself as a global power.

Old nonsenses, such as the pivotal role the German car industry will play in securing a great deal, are dusted down and joined by new ones, such as Dominic Raab’s assertion that only by not having a deal will getting that great deal be assured. Every report of the resulting damage is dismissed as not being caused by Brexit, or discounted as being worth it because of Brexit.

chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/2019/08/government-by-cult.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+blogspot%2FrznWQ+%28The+Brexit+Blog%29

Good morning,
May I first introduce myself I live in Urmston, so I suppose I am a 88:year old Urmston Granddad with very different views than your Urmstongran that I have just been reading.

Apologies to any Leavers who might feel upset by my comments, but I am a strong European who served in the RAF & Nato in many EU countries..

Please excuse the sarcastic introduction.

Congratulations to all those leavers who believed Brexit could be achieved on the cheap & save £millions. The deception & rhetoric around Brexit is now coming home & this is only the early days. Already holidays abroad are getting out of reach of millions, we are now on route back to the WW2 planning days, with forecasts of years of subsequent problems around imports from the EU & tariff increases. I spent 30 years of my life building an export business into the great EU markets.
Every major business group is clear the Brexit being pursued by this Govt is a political choice that will put UK business in the slow lane for years. No amount of sugar coating of meetings between the new BEIS Sec and business leaders can hide that fact.
What is so shocking is that @BorisJohnson and his Dream Team are using people's taxes to now bribe people that their fantasies won't turn out to be our nightmares.
The effects on our export infrastructure could cause havoc particularly with our balance of payments, creating a further run on the £ already at an all time low.

I now believe the calls stating that any deal or no deal, whatever this government comes up with, should be put back to the British people so they can be asked, “Is this what you voted for?”

Please do comment on how do,you feel about the waste of £2.1 billion on a no deal scenario that could have been used to build essential new NHS hospitals and provide essential equipment to help save lives. “It is of course responsible for a government to be prepared for an emergency.
But this is an emergency of the government’s own making, money that is badly needed to repair of badly neglect infrastructure after the austerity cutsAccording to a health expert £2.1 billion that could have been spent on:

?420k hip ops
?45k nurses
?28k doctors
?2100 CT scanners
?6 entire NHS hospitals

We also expect to have to spend a few a few £billion on improve our environmental needs to offset climate changes on rivers canals, dams, new drainage schemes the list grows almost daily.

What an obscene waste of taxpayers' money Brexit has caused.
You leavers must be very proud of the Tory & Farage dogma that has created this appalling situation?

Apologies for harping on it is a bad habit in Urmston as you may have previously noticed

Are you real

As real as you or any of us, I'd say, Lessismore Do you find the writing style more literate than most posters'? That is because of when GranddadBrian went to school.

grandadobrian?

It isn’t 2.1 bn but a total of just over £6bn.

The U.K. economy has also retracted by £40bn each year since the referendum.

The question also to ask is whether the Tories would spend it on the infrastructure, NHS etc, or tax cuts for the wealthy.

My money is on the latter.

Yes I believe GrandadBrian is for real. Can you really dispute what he is saying lessismore? Or are you still believing that Brexit is going to take place with no problems?

Whitewave Scotland is not “champing at the bit” the SNP minority government and its followers is.

Prof Dougan is THE most knowledgeable expert on EU Law. Fully aware that many on here don't like or trust experts - but he is really worth listening to :

www.facebook.com/FullEnglishBrexit/videos/1242176982622966/

One of our leading clients in our business has been encouraging us to expand into Europe on the promise of work they would guarantee us should we do so. Therefore for the last five days, myself with two other partners in the business have been across to Belgium to investigate all the problems and Benefits such an expansion would incur to us.

I speak of the above as the customer who is encouraging us in the above is a very large London based insurance organisation who we have served for the last ten years. That brings to mind, that as Britain attempts to withdraw into it's Brexit shell and leave the huge border-free trading block of Europe, many leading commercial organizations are still looking at the benefits of the EU in terms of the economy of scale that it brings to them and their shareholders.

The last few days convinced all of us on that trip that no-deal Brexit Britain would not be a sustainable nation into the future. Some in reply to that may argue that Britain would negotiate trade agreements with the rest of the world to compensate for any loss to Europe. However, those trade agreements will take several years to come about, and the EU has such agreements in place already, where Britain as a separate entity would have to start those negotiations all over again.

The above begs the question, where are all the benefits to businesses at present based in the UK in carrying out the above?

No-one needs to fear that Professor Dougan is going to talk over their heads as an "expert" - He knows what he is talking about, and he speaks very clearly while doing so.

What is wrong with people who can't bear hearing something from an expert? If you were seriously ill, would you rather someone off the street analysed what was wrong with you, based on what their Aunt Kitty told them about what carried off Uncle Jim forty years ago, or would you rather trust someone who had spent their working life diagnosing from exactly your symptoms? Weird!