Labour now

'Batshittery'! Haha, haven't come across that word before. Yes, I agree, Corbyn and friends, Momentum and those of that ilk fail to understand their own core voters, which are capitalist/ aspiring/materialist/ conservative at heart not Socialist.They will keep on bleeding support/votes as time goes on.

rosesarered then the Labour party needs a name change as its NOT the labour party of Keir Hardie,THAT labour party was founded on christian principles ,nothing "christian" about some of the materialistic voters "labour" has now.Maybe a truly left wing party wouldn't succeed nowadays but didn't Corbyn win by a landslide ? That would indicate that there are old fashioned socialists around ...shame he didn't live up to the hype ,he's not a socialist at all ,just talks the talk then votes WITH the tories

rosesarered then the Labour party needs a name change as its NOT the labour party of Keir Hardie,THAT labour party was founded on christian principles ,nothing "christian" about some of the materialistic voters "labour" has now.Maybe a truly left wing party wouldn't succeed nowadays but didn't Corbyn win by a landslide ? That would indicate that there are old fashioned socialists around ...shame he didn't live up to the hype ,he's not a socialist at all ,just talks the talk then votes WITH the tories

Yes, maybe it does need a name change.
Corbyn won by a landslide from Labour Party Members ( not most voters)
Yes, Corbyn is a Socialist, no matter what you think paddyann

I think that what Lisa Muggeridge says is absolutely spot-on.

This will irritate a certain poster but paddyann is right ,labour was founded on Christian principles and I should know

Corbyn won by momentum bringing in new members with momentum values

There's nothing new, original or perceptive in any of the OP - it's all been said before and I don't see how any of it advances the discussion at all about what Labour needs to do or what needs to be done by others. I actually think it's puerile drivel with no real thought or analysis at all but hey it will do for another negative thread and allow for some baiting, cheap shots and gfery which is why I wont be visiting this thread again

Back to what the OP said, when I was young many working class people voted Tory and, as now, plenty of (mainly upper) middle class people voted Labour. Thee were also serious tensions within both parties, between the centrists and the more radical extremes. Plus ca change.....

The divisions in British politics are no longer between the working class and capitalists, between left and right. Corbyn really isn't an extremist - he's an anachronism, stuck in the politics of the 1970s or thereabouts. Labour won't win unless it develops a vision, which it currently doesn't have.

rigby agree with your drivel description. I kept reading it thinking I'd missed something, but gave up in the end. It simply reiterated a not particularly surprising viewpoint that gets rolled out periodically.

But Corbyn does have a vision, the same one be has had for msny a year

Perhaps some Labour voters don't enjoy Labour being talked about.....but are happy to diss the Tories.Well, it has to work both ways.I think that far from being drivel it is right on the money (Lisa Muggeridge.)Anyway, this thread is not simply dissing, but finding an explanation for Labour plummeting in the polls.
Who would object to Labour being founded on Christian principles ab?

The core voters have changed and the Labour Party need to recognise this fact.

'One of the striking things about the left is this shock at working class tories, and working class people who dont want their revolution.'

No shock at all to me. I lived with working class Tories in my formative years. My parents always believed the rubbish they were fed by the Express and the Mail.

By the way, did it strike cords, or chords?

Rosesarered, I didn't bring Christian principles into this,i just replied to a post which did

Somebody should tell Corbyn perhaps ' that working class people don't want their revolution ' because he seems to think that they do.

Ah, yes, I see ab

Seems there are working class Tories in Copeland

Labour didn't even lose Copeland in the 1983 election

And middle/ upper class in Stoke!

And the labour vote in Stoke was down .

Do you have links to the full articles, thatbags? I'd like to read the articles/blogs in context.

By the way, I agree with most of it, which is why I keep banging on about a realignment of political parties. The conservatism (with a small 'c') of working class voters doesn't surprise me at all and it's not a surprise to the people who have been writing about it for years. The referendum has just split open the divisions over many issues.

It's also why I don't think the Labour Party supporters have shared values. The history of the Labour Party doesn't matter. It's about where it is now and how it can represent the many people who disagree with and/or suffering from Tory policies.

Blair managed to unite different factions by spending on hospitals, schools other public services, while keeping business interests happy. Even without Iraq, he was always walking on a tightrope, but it worked for 13 years.