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Russian spy attempted murder - what should the UK do?

(500 Posts)
Gerispringer Fri 09-Mar-18 14:07:05

Just listened to a radio piece on this awful attack on the Russian spy and his daughter in which 21 people were affected. one suggestion why these attacks are carried out in the UK was that the response of the UK in the past e.g. Litvinyenko has been weak, so whoever carries out such attacks has no fear of comeback. What can the UK do? Boycott the World Cup?

OldMeg Fri 09-Mar-18 14:10:44

I knew a policeman was also ill, but not another 20 people.

Nothing will be done, except possibly expel a couple of diplomats.

lemongrove Fri 09-Mar-18 14:17:23

The army are involved now down in Salisbury, trying to find out exactly where the nerve gas was employed on the two Russians.
How did the policeman come in contact with it though? I understand he was a plain clothes detective and not simply a uniformed officer first on the scene.It’s all mysterious.

lemongrove Fri 09-Mar-18 14:18:32

I think there will be more comeback than just expelling a few Embassy staff this time.

jollyg Fri 09-Mar-18 14:26:38

As usual Govt being an ostrich.

I feel for the family of the police man and all his family.

Any one involved with malpractice with police, seems to me to have a very strong union behind with them, sad to say.

Gardening leave and an enhanced pension.

If I sound a bit sarky, thats true for me

OldMeg Fri 09-Mar-18 14:36:19

Nerve ‘gases’ (often liquid at normal temperatures) so are either inhaied or absorbed through the skin. They are very reactive and the unfortunate police officer might well have touched the victims or inhaled fumes from them.

OldMeg Fri 09-Mar-18 14:37:40

I hope so lemongrove but options are limited if we have to take unilateral action.

Jalima1108 Fri 09-Mar-18 14:48:30

How did the policeman come in contact with it though? I understand he was a plain clothes detective and not simply a uniformed officer first on the scene.It’s all mysterious
Off duty, I think, and just went to help two people he saw in trouble.

It was very disturbing to see the reaction of Russian people being interviewed in the street in Moscow and to hear the Russian newsreader making jokes about living in England.

As usual Govt being an ostrich.
It does absolutely no good and probably a lot of harm if they jump in with accusations, retributions etc before being absolutely sure of the facts. One thing you can be sure of, they are not being ostriches, there will be much going on that we are not hearing about.

Jalima1108 Fri 09-Mar-18 14:51:48

I don't think that other people were sufficiently harmed that they had to stay in hospital.
They had tests and treatment but I think it is only the Russian, his daughter and the policeman who remain in hospital.

nigglynellie Fri 09-Mar-18 15:04:02

Absolutely Jalima. It would be completely ridiculous for the government to start speculating and pontificating on how, where and when. Obviously a lot more is going on here at MI5 level, and the less ill found gossip that is released from HMG the better.
What I also found disturbing is the attitude of the interviewed russian public who seemed to think poisoning anyone is a perfectly acceptable method of disposing of them! prison of course but poisoning?!! The attitude towards the west once again after all the hope and positive feelings of glasnos (?) seems to have slipped back into cold war mode, which is both sad and alarming.

Jalima1108 Fri 09-Mar-18 15:14:57

It is alarming nigglynellie

durhamjen Fri 09-Mar-18 17:09:21

rightsinfo.org/turns-spies-law/

Spies are above the law.

GabriellaG Fri 09-Mar-18 18:53:12

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

durhamjen Fri 09-Mar-18 19:12:13

If you like intrigue, how about this, Gabriella.
Trump and Putin conspire betwen them to kill Skripal, to stop him getting any closer to the truth of their dealings with the US election.
Do you buy it?

paddyann Fri 09-Mar-18 19:54:14

I dont think this is as uncommon as most of you seem to believe nor is it confined to Russians killing "spies" Remember Doctor Kelly 's mysterious suicide ? I think all countries engage in this stuff and have done for a very long time...this was different because it was so public ..not because it was unique .Reality checks all round....

lemongrove Fri 09-Mar-18 21:37:52

Dr Kelly was a suicide paddy poor man, he was too stressed by what was happening to him.He took pills ( his own) and alchohol.

lemongrove Fri 09-Mar-18 21:38:51

Russia prefers to deal out gruesome deaths, as a warning.

Anniebach Fri 09-Mar-18 22:07:39

The man lived in this country so the U,K. wasn't chosen to carry out the attack. There is little can be done, we are not going to bomb which every country was responsible.

Nothing mysterious about Dr Kelly's suicide , he had emotional problems as well as the stress he was under

maryeliza54 Fri 09-Mar-18 22:34:44

Great PR for the Met - Gabriella*. What a bloody disgrace

OldMeg Sat 10-Mar-18 07:40:57

Dr Kelly alleged suicide was indeed mysterious paddyann There were many inconsistencies which seemed to suddenly be just glossed over.

OldMeg Sat 10-Mar-18 07:51:57

There was never an inquest. And his body was exhumed and cremated last summer.

Fearless Sat 10-Mar-18 09:38:43

If there was nothing serious about Dr Kelly's suicide, why did the government decide the medical and post mortem records should be kept secret for 70 years?

GabriellaG Sat 10-Mar-18 09:46:14

durhamjen
No. I think it's so far removed fron Putin that the link to him will never be proved.
There is no such a person as an ex KGB/FSB agent.
It's like the line in 'Hotel California', 'You can check out any time you like but you can never leave'.
The murder (because that's what it was) of Stephen Curtis, a lawyer who became involved in the cat's cradle of Russian intrigue around the oil business Gazprom and the incarceration of Boris Berezovsky who (among others) sought sanctuary here, could never be proved, despite years of investigations.
His rented helicopter, taking him from Battersea heliport to his home on Portland, mysteriously exploded mid-air, killing both him and his usual pilot.
Efforts to untangle the financials in the case were fruitless...as you'd expect. He was known as 'The man who knew too much' as not even the Oligarchs who placed their trust in him, knew exactly where their money went or the routes by which it was sent.
The knowledge died with him.
I believe that Putin never actually orders any 'disappearance', I think it's an unspoken 'given' and that thise who know him best have no need of words to do his bidding.
Trump, IMO is an outspoken fool at times but enjoys the limelight, opening mouth before engaging brain, however, I do think that he's smarter than many give him credit for.
This is only my opinion and, depending on where you stand, the same view can look very different.

radicalnan Sat 10-Mar-18 09:48:49

Are we so naive as to believe that this is something only Russians do? We have plenty of oliagarchs here now, not government but 'gangsters', who knows what they get up to?

We have plenty of our own dirty tricks going on. This is scary, in that others may be harmed apart from the target, doesn't mean it was a Russian plot just a method they have apparently used in the past.

I think we ought to reserve judgement until we know more of the facts.

I have grave suspicions about the death of Dr Kelly and others, we never know the whole of the truth do we?

Lyndie Sat 10-Mar-18 09:50:13

I think we have to got tighten up who we let into the country for all our sakes. My niece lives in Salisbury, what if she had been passing and went to help with her baby!