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The loss of freedom of speech, of sidelining women and biology

(65 Posts)
DiamondLily Thu 12-May-22 12:47:27

I've been asked to repost this:

'Julie Bindel had a pretty horrendous time whilst delivering a (previously postponed) lecture to York University's Free Speech Society.

The activists, who say we must be "all be kind" didn't display much courtesy or kindness to her.🙄

She was abused, accused, screamed at, and had placards thrust in her face. The TW mob were out in force, and she was "invited" to kiss their "man-boobs" and told things she could do with their "trans d*cks".

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-10806353/JULIE-BINDEL-explains-female-students-bullied-hearing-feminists.html

Meanwhile, in the Court case involving Alison Bailey, Stonewall tell us that there are no such things as male and female bodies. They don't exist...🤔

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10807211/We-not-inherently-male-female-Stonewall-campaigner-says-bodies-just-bodies.html

It sure is a funny old world out there in Trans La-La land.

Doodledog Thu 12-May-22 14:09:48

I find this so depressing and frightening. In the name of 'inclusivity', those who believe that sex is different from the social construct of 'gender' are excluded from speaking their point of view. They've come for the 'TERFS' - which group will be next?

We are told that transwomen are women, but women are 'Cis' women, or breeders. That transwomen can be mothers, but women are 'people who give birth'. It has been suggested that abortion should be denied, as unwanted babies 'give a supply of children'.

It's so dystopian, and yet there are women who buy into it all, thinking they are being 'kind'. Can they not see how misogynistic the world is becoming, and how the only people to benefit from any of this will be men of the sort of mindset that has had to take a back seat since feminism took hold?

GrannyGravy13 Thu 12-May-22 14:21:56

Frightening that our hard won freedoms are being revoked by men, we are walking blindfolded into dystopia.

FarNorth Thu 12-May-22 14:24:37

That article by Julie Bindel is so upsetting.

maddyone Thu 12-May-22 14:25:32

I worry for the little girls. Heaven knows what they are going to make of all this as they grow older.

Aveline Thu 12-May-22 14:58:01

It is scary but basically it's so daft that there must be a backlash soon. The militant transwomen are setting their own case back with every outburst.

Doodledog Thu 12-May-22 15:11:40

I think (and hope) that the more the media pick up on these things, the more that 'ordinary' people will realise what's going on, and make a fuss. As it is, it tends to be only when something happens to someone we know that we notice.

I think you're right though, Aveline. There has to be a backlash soon.

Wheniwasyourage Thu 12-May-22 15:15:09

Yes, the backlash will come and the pendulum will swing back, as usually happens. One encouraging sign is the number of men who think that this whole militant transwomen thing is wrong. We will find the backlash a lot easier and quicker if they are with us!

DiamondLily Thu 12-May-22 15:26:50

Even on the stalwart BBC programme, Countryfile, those who menstruate and give birth were referred to as "people who menstruate" and not as women.

I don't actually know any biological men, whatever they are calling themselves, to have ever menstruated, or given birth.🙄

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10799431/BBC-accused-pandering-woke-warriors-Countryfile-presenters-people-menstruate-gaffe.html

MerylStreep Thu 12-May-22 15:38:29

DiamondLily
Obviously not everyone got the memo telling them that the BBC has left Stonewall. 😟

AGAA4 Thu 12-May-22 15:39:16

I haven't menstruated for many years so what am I?
I can't believe that the majority of women will accept this and hopefully not many men.

MerylStreep Thu 12-May-22 15:49:03

AGAA4
The vast majority of people don’t accept this, but we now have the situation where the tail is wagging the dog.

Aveline Thu 12-May-22 16:13:20

This aggression must be testosterone fuelled which must be galling for other transwomen.

Callistemon21 Thu 12-May-22 17:12:36

DiamondLily

Even on the stalwart BBC programme, Countryfile, those who menstruate and give birth were referred to as "people who menstruate" and not as women.

I don't actually know any biological men, whatever they are calling themselves, to have ever menstruated, or given birth.🙄

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10799431/BBC-accused-pandering-woke-warriors-Countryfile-presenters-people-menstruate-gaffe.html

That's is just ridiculous- Adam Henson should have realised that and refused to use BBC-speak.

If he was going to refer to a woman as a person why did he use the term cow and not the term cattle?

Elegran Thu 12-May-22 17:53:48

Men used to say that women who wanted equality and the opportunity to go into male professions suffered from "penis envy", and Freud more or less built a whole branch of psychiatry on the concept of women's damaged mental health due to their resentment of the superiority of men.

Now that women are catching up with men in most things (by no means all) I can't help feeling that much of what we are hearing is vagina envy. One thing that men cannot do is to conceive, carry, deliver, and nourish in the womb and out of it, so women are relegated to "birth person" and so on, as though that is their only useful accomplishment.

The grapes are sour - they can't do it, so it is a minor achievement. At the same time, some men envy women their womanliness so much that they want to have it for themselves.

Oscar Wilde wrote in "The Importance of Being Earnest" "All women become like their mothers. That is their tragedy. No man does. That's his."

Elegran Thu 12-May-22 17:56:02

If they really wanted to be women, they wouldn't wish to keep the magic wands that give them so much power and pleasure as men.

JenniferEccles Thu 12-May-22 22:28:33

This is all utter nonsense.
99.9% of people know it’s utter nonsense, so isn’t it best to ignore it?

Callistemon21 Thu 12-May-22 22:34:10

JenniferEccles

This is all utter nonsense.
99.9% of people know it’s utter nonsense, so isn’t it best to ignore it?

Not so easy to ignore, though, when women are being abused like this:
She was abused, accused, screamed at, and had placards thrust in her face. The TW mob were out in force, and she was "invited" to kiss their "man-boobs" and told things she could do with their "trans d*cks".

Doodledog Thu 12-May-22 22:38:41

How (or who) would ignoring it help?

JenniferEccles Thu 12-May-22 22:53:18

Yes I see your point Callistemon21
Not easy, or I guess right to ignore that level of nastiness and aggression.
I just hate the thought of giving those awful idiots any kind of publicity.

Chewbacca Thu 12-May-22 23:22:11

isn’t it best to ignore it?

It's because we ignored it for so long that we are where we are now. Women thought that having smashed the glass ceiling, started to be paid, and recognised professionally the same as men, that we'd achieved equality; and we took our eyes off the ball. We failed to spot Stonewall. And now we're having to fight again but, this time, not for equality, but the right to be women, protect our safe spaces and not to be erased.

DerbyshireLass Thu 12-May-22 23:45:32

Chewbacca

^isn’t it best to ignore it?^

It's because we ignored it for so long that we are where we are now. Women thought that having smashed the glass ceiling, started to be paid, and recognised professionally the same as men, that we'd achieved equality; and we took our eyes off the ball. We failed to spot Stonewall. And now we're having to fight again but, this time, not for equality, but the right to be women, protect our safe spaces and not to be erased.

Exactly this.

When I first encountered "The Handmaids Tale" I thought it was too far fetched. Now I'm not so sure .....😞

We've seen what's happened under the Taliban, the move
Towards banning abortion in some US states, the continued practice of young girls being forced into marriage, female genital mutilation, sex trafficking and now being described as a "birth person". The very definition of the role of fertile women in the Handmaids Tale.

We are heading into very dangerous territory.

Doodledog Fri 13-May-22 00:14:05

JenniferEccles

Yes I see your point Callistemon21
Not easy, or I guess right to ignore that level of nastiness and aggression.
I just hate the thought of giving those awful idiots any kind of publicity.

I know what you mean, and understand why you think that; but they have operated for a long time by silencing women, cancelling academics or writers who speak out, and harassing women at feminist meetings (often violently). Their treatment of lesbians in particular has been dreadful, but people only noticed if they were involved in it.

Stonewall has inveigled itself into many workplaces, (often those with large numbers of employees, such as councils and universities) and persuaded people that having their diversity champion kitemark is a good thing, whilst those affected by it have been forced into compliance with things like choosing a 'gender' and displaying it on email signatures, and to play along with their rules for fear of losing their jobs. Again though, people not impacted by this have remained unaware - when I have posted on here about it I have been accused of lying. Even though I have seen it in action, it was denied. I don't think that this was because the accuser was lying herself - I think she just wasn't aware, because it hadn't affected her, or anyone she knows.

Teachers are brainwashed into 'supporting' children to think that they may be 'in the wrong body', regardless of the wishes of their parents, and children are taught that there are numerous 'genders' as though this were fact, but unless we have young children or are closely involved in what young grandchildren are being taught, we won't know about this unless we are working as teachers ourselves.

The nonsense in maternity wards and prisons will only come to the attention of most people if they find themselves in one of those places, which is probably very unlikely for most of us on here grin.

All of this has been going on under the radar, to a large extent. Not so much that people are ignoring it, but that they don't see it happening. As it starts to encroach on more and more people, however, we all need to speak out and try to stop it in its tracks.

None of that means that genuine transpeople (by which I mean those who just want to get on with their lives living as though they were a member of the opposite sex) should be treated as anything other than full and equal members of society. It is not transpeople in general who are the problem. It is trans rights activists and their 'allies' - the extremists who want to change the language and insist that transwomen are women, but women are 'cervix havers', and that men should be able to access women's spaces just by saying that they are female.

nanna8 Fri 13-May-22 00:35:01

We, as women, need to fight tooth and nail against this subtle and not so subtle erosion of our womanhood. Do not be fooled, it is men who are behind all this and their insatiable greed for power over us.

FarNorth Fri 13-May-22 01:06:32

JenniferEccles

Yes I see your point Callistemon21
Not easy, or I guess right to ignore that level of nastiness and aggression.
I just hate the thought of giving those awful idiots any kind of publicity.

It's not only the shouting idiots, tho.

The very categories of woman and girl are being redefined to include males and this is already happening in places you would never expect such as girlguiding, women's domestic violence refuges, hospitals and prisons.