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What, if anything, do Conservatives now believe in?

(82 Posts)
DaisyAnne Mon 11-Jul-22 08:44:38

I appreciate this is difficult for conservative voters to explain. The "Conservative" government has not been in the least 'conservative' in the commonly understood way so it is anyone's guess at the moment.

We are, it seems, exiting the Johnson cult. Then it was easy to understand what they believed in - it was Johnson. They worshipped Johnson and his ability to get and keep them in power. They would stand for almost anything to keep him while he could perform. So we had the Johnson cult. It still exists, in the same way the Trump cult does, but it doesn't feel as if the majority "believe" anymore.

The mantra common to all those standing for the leadership is "tax cuts". Generally, it doesn't seem to matter which taxes they cut, nor do they seem to have an answer as to how this will revive the economy - it won't. Ask what they will do about inflation, poverty, low growth and cuts to public spending. There is no answer. This tax-cutting, wealth-retaining party is going to borrow to do this. So where is Prudence now?

Tax is not our problem - growth is. This swath of walking egos talk endlessly about tax but rarely, if at all, about growth. Perhaps, along the way to poverty, they will offer another useless clown to entertain us. Let's face it, they are quite good at that. Such a pity we can't live on laughter.

BlueBelle Mon 11-Jul-22 08:48:57

In answer to your title ….feathering their own nests

Whitewavemark2 Mon 11-Jul-22 08:51:44

Small state low taxes is what most conservatives believe in. To achieve a smaller state they will have to cut deeper into public services.

I honestly can’t see the NHS or the proposed social care surviving, or the proposed beefing up of the military.

They also (most) believe in a free market. How they square that with Brexit is also a mystery.

Kandinsky Mon 11-Jul-22 08:52:30

In answer to your title ….feathering their own nests

Same as most other politicians - liberals included.
Have you seen the news about Macron & Uber?

Whitewavemark2 Mon 11-Jul-22 08:52:37

Yes and as bluebell says.

Protect the ability to avoid tax at all costs.

RichmondPark Mon 11-Jul-22 09:08:50

Amongst all the lies, backstabbing and posturing from all the new candidates it's hard to find anything concrete, positive or believable.

The Conservatives seem to be entirely focused on their leader and have ceased to work as a functioning team.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 11-Jul-22 09:13:12

I have been reading the promises being put out by the hopeful candidates.

They don’t seem to be saying anything about the crises in the cost of living or the NHS.

All they are talking about is cutting tax. The trouble with cutting tax is that it is inflationary, and with the current rate at 10% this doesn’t seem terribly sensible.

I also can’t see how it would help resolve the growing inequality gap.

MaizieD Mon 11-Jul-22 09:24:36

Kandinsky

*In answer to your title ….feathering their own nests*

Same as most other politicians - liberals included.
Have you seen the news about Macron & Uber?

You're a conservative, aren't you, Kandinsky?

How about telling us what you believe in rather than trying to deflect with a bit of whataboutery.

It's disappointing that people have come out with generalisations about the upper echelons of the party.

I'd be very interested to know what 'ordinary' people believe in that leads them to vote conservative.

Luckygirl3 Mon 11-Jul-22 09:36:48

Capitalism, privatisation, competition, profit: hence the collapse of so many public services, since they do not understand the word "service" or co-operation.

Education: instead of being a service, it has become an opportunity for those who know dot all about education to feather their nests by becoming chief execs of academy trusts, which top slice the money due to schools to perform their wholly unnecessary "management" functions. And now an element of compulsion is being introduced to try and have all schools as academies and in multi-academy trusts by 2030.

Health: "outsourcing" of functions to private companies has resulted in fragmentation and loss of coherence and commitment. The companies who take on the various contracts are simply there for profits and not to serve. There is is, that word serve again.

I could go on, but you get the gist.

Whatever these candidates spiel off to us, these are the basic tenets that we are having to live with. Sadly many people who vote Tory have failed to make these connections.

Luckygirl3 Mon 11-Jul-22 09:43:28

Oh yes - and social care.

LA-run residential homes have vanished - all we are left with are privately-run homes who are there to make a profit. Many are on their knees because they struggle to survive on the measly fees that the LAs pay per resident, because the government provides insufficient funds. Care at home is provided by a hotch-potch of private agencies. Monitoring the standards of homes and agencies is a massive challenge - how can you close a poorly performing agency or home when there is nowhere else for residents to go? Are they parcels to be shunted around?

I was in SS adult services pre-privatisation and then I knew the homes and knew the home help services and knew that they were properly set-up, supported and monitored. What a mess it became and all in the name of profit.

growstuff Mon 11-Jul-22 09:44:39

Being "anti-woke".

halfpint1 Mon 11-Jul-22 09:59:33

Kandinsky

*In answer to your title ….feathering their own nests*

Same as most other politicians - liberals included.
Have you seen the news about Macron & Uber?

Hilarious. How to avoid a question, throw in the EU or even better, France

Kandinsky Mon 11-Jul-22 10:01:55

I’m not a conservative - I voted for brexit so therefore voted for Boris to ‘get Brexit done’

I have voted Labour in the past.

But I would like to hear some thoughts on Macron & Uber. Not that he’s the only EU leader guilty.
What are your thoughts?
I’m not expecting much as this news item will be conveniently ignored by most on this board.
Doesn’t fit the script.

Kandinsky Mon 11-Jul-22 10:03:00

Hilarious. How to avoid a question, throw in the EU or even better, France

And there we have it.
Perfect example smile

25Avalon Mon 11-Jul-22 10:06:19

They are divided and in disarray. They were never united under Johnson anyway. Be interesting to see which contender wins. They are busy fighting each other at present and the media is helping them dig up mud to sling at each other.

Casdon Mon 11-Jul-22 10:06:26

Kandinsky

I’m not a conservative - I voted for brexit so therefore voted for Boris to ‘get Brexit done’

I have voted Labour in the past.

But I would like to hear some thoughts on Macron & Uber. Not that he’s the only EU leader guilty.
What are your thoughts?
I’m not expecting much as this news item will be conveniently ignored by most on this board.
Doesn’t fit the script.

It’s on the news that UK ministers were doing the same regarding Uber Kandinsky so wouldn’t criticising Macron be the pot calling the kettle black? Our kettle is quite black enough already.

Chewbacca Mon 11-Jul-22 10:09:16

I have been reading the promises being put out by the hopeful candidates.
They don’t seem to be saying anything about the crises in the cost of living or the NHS

Yes, it's glaringly absent isn't it? They've learnt nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Kandinsky Mon 11-Jul-22 10:12:22

So what are your thoughts on Macron?

Okay. I’ll answer my own question as nobody else seems able to.

I’m glad Macron & other EU leaders have been exposed as greedy shysters.
I wonder what other dodgy dealings they’re involved in?

There. Question answered.
Have a nice day 😊

Commonground Mon 11-Jul-22 10:12:25

Kandinsky

*Hilarious. How to avoid a question, throw in the EU or even better, France*

And there we have it.
Perfect example smile

This is not relevant to the original post.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 11-Jul-22 10:16:59

Kandinsky

I’m not a conservative - I voted for brexit so therefore voted for Boris to ‘get Brexit done’

I have voted Labour in the past.

But I would like to hear some thoughts on Macron & Uber. Not that he’s the only EU leader guilty.
What are your thoughts?
I’m not expecting much as this news item will be conveniently ignored by most on this board.
Doesn’t fit the script.

It isn’t what this thread is about.

I’m sure lots of people have lots of things to say about UBER, but you need to start a proper thread, and not get peeved if no one is taking up your post about Uber.

maddyone Mon 11-Jul-22 10:20:22

I think they must be interested in lower taxation based on what most of potential candidates have said.
I would like to know how they propose to unite the country. It’s been a difficult time for us all in recent years.

Oldnproud Mon 11-Jul-22 10:27:59

The current Conservatives seem to believe that their staying in power at all cost is all that matters, that the good of the country and its 'ordinary' people barely comes into the equation.

They appear to believe that honesty, decency and integrity are nothing more than vague ambitions to be paid lip service to every now and then.

They appear to believe that we, the general public, are fools, to be kept in our place, to be exploited and to be promised that a few crumbs will be thrown our way at some unspecific time in the future if we vote for them when there's an election looming - promises that time after time fail to materialise.

They appear to believe that they can only hang on to power by bombarding the general public with anti-opposition propoganda.
It speaks volumes about how little the Conservatives really have to offer now, that unfounded whataboutery is their go-to weapon of choice

Whitewavemark2 Mon 11-Jul-22 10:28:21

Hunt is prioritising bringing back fox hunting.

What planet do these people live on?

maddyone Mon 11-Jul-22 10:36:05

Whitewavemark2

Hunt is prioritising bringing back fox hunting.

What planet do these people live on?

Good grief. Unbelievable!

Dinahmo Mon 11-Jul-22 10:43:25

Kandinsky

I’m not a conservative - I voted for brexit so therefore voted for Boris to ‘get Brexit done’

I have voted Labour in the past.

But I would like to hear some thoughts on Macron & Uber. Not that he’s the only EU leader guilty.
What are your thoughts?
I’m not expecting much as this news item will be conveniently ignored by most on this board.
Doesn’t fit the script.

If you're going to bring France into the mix, why not the other countries? Such as the Netherlands? And please don't forget the involvement of Osborne, Hancock, Gove, Javid, Vaisey and Patel.

Here's the link:

www.theguardian.com/news/2022/jul/11/osborne-hancock-tory-ministers-did-not-declare-secret-uber-meetings-leak-reveals