When did UK governments lose their way?

I think that some of the problem is that so many politicians go into the job from university, where they probably studied politics or economics or something related, and then go through the researcher/aide sort of route. When many of us on GN were young, the politicians had at the very least met all kinds of people during the war(s) and therefore had a much better understanding of how other people live than some of the younger ones. That's not to say that all the younger ones are bad, far from it, just that their life experience is often more limited than that of their predecessors.

That may help to account for the common feeling that politicians don't understand the rest of us.

I also agree that we have to change the voting system. I am not in any way a Tory, but it has to be said that the voting system for the Scottish Parliament means that for those who do vote Tory, their vote does count, whereas under FPTP, they would be effectively disenfranchised.

One problem is that so many of our politicians now choose politics as a career straight from university. they work as interns, then they get jobs in lobbying group, political PR, think tanks, party HQs and the like while angling for parliamentary seats.

Once in parliament, their only aim is to stay there and get their pension, it makes them malleable and biddable and always prepared to compromise their principles for party promotion because they know if they get kicked out of parliament they are unemployable, unless they can get back on the party merrygoround again.

In the past most MPs had had other jobs, had skills and professions they could return to, or private incomes, that meant they were not slavishly devoted to toeing the party line. Now we are dependent on those with private incomes for indpendence of thought and action in parliament - and that is not a good thing.

Are they just a reflection of the rest of society as a whole?
Not sure. Just asking.

Absolutely agree Wheniwasyourage. Too many politicians these days are career politicians with no real experience of life outside university and Westminster. Nor have any of them come up through the unions like used to happen when people with shop floor experience rose through the ranks and were elected MPs. Another problem is that when parliament sat in the afternoon and evening it was actually possible for professional people to continue in their jobs as well as being an MP. Not any more. My suggestions for reforming the system are quite radical and so far have no voiced support from anyone but they are: Parliament should only sit part time - say Mon, Tues, Wed. MPs should be paid a decent salary in line with other professions such as senior consultants or lawyers. MPs should only be permitted to serve for a limited amount of time, say five years. I think these suggestions would raise the calibre if our MPs substantially and we might even get a better government and a better country as a result.

Our previous MP had grown up and gone to school in the area he represented but had also had a successful career outside of politics. He would also ask his constituents opinion before voting on important issues like whether to keep Trident. He would outline the pros and cons and then ask us to chose. Sometimes his constituents opinion were the opposite to his but he always went with the majority vote. He actually resigned from his party after many years excellent service when he felt his own party were making the wrong choices. His constituents whether they agreed with his politics or not agreed he was a good man who had always fought for the good of his area.
I want any MP representing me to have had experience of a world outside politics as otherwise they seem to exist in a political bubble far removed from the people they are meant to represent.

There are plans to build a huge piece of infra tructure in our parish, it will absorb most of the land in the area. Its only purpose is to enrich the investors in the company building it, not ordinary shareholders, or insurance companies with huge pension funds, but overseas sovereign wealth funds.

Everyone is opposed to it: county council, local council, parish councils local MPs. It has been turned down twice at public appeals and has been proposed again.

Now the planned project is in the constituency of a Conservative MP, a young men parachuted in from party HQ after the previous incumbent resigned, quite close to the election cut off date. He is not a natural rebel and we all believe that he will soon be offered some preferment on condition.........

The Scottish system was designed to deny a majority or any party.The SNP managed to do just that .
Three of the main parties in Scotland are actually NOT registered IN Scotland they are English registered and run by their English masters .
Unlike NI where the parties are ALL registered in NI and therefor in theory SHOULD work FOR the community they represent .The "unionist " parties in Scotland (NOT the SNP or Greens ) work for Wm and constantly put Scotland down.With devolution no w at risk ,many wonder why they want to work here when they are destroying the job they have ...maybe they want a seat in the lords?
Whatever the reason,they shouldnt be ALLOWED to sit in a parliament they dont believe in or represent .

It's been happening for many years. I'd say about 20 years. I've noticed how successive Governments have stopped Governing "For the People" and keep insisting what they do is for the good of the people but take no notice when we try to disagree. The only way is to vote the existing party out and give the others a chance. However over the years they don't keep their promises either, once we've elected them. I have no idea what the answer is. I do know that we don't pay enough taxes to get what we expect for free at point of service. Too much of our taxes are spent on stuff we don't agree with. High Speed Trains, Extended ULEZ, 15 minute cities, LTNs. We do need to help the environment but it needs to be done fairly not hit the working people hardest.

There is information about this investigation here:-

www.channel4.com/news/equality-and-human-rights-commission-says-it-has-paused-independent-investigation-into-chair-baroness-falkner

When the Tories got in.First Thatcher hatcheted as much as she could then all the other Tories following have all wanted to put their own stamp on dragging Britain down and ruining the economy further!Odd thing to be infamous for but those 'poshies' do seem to love it.🤔🤨

I agree with previous posters. Professional politicians who have never had a job outside politics don't govern well for people.
I remember when the Scottish parliament first opened that there were a lot of lawyers, teachers and others with all sorts of professional/working backgrounds. Debate was much more professional compared to the snipe fest that goes on now with no useful or serious exchange of views. It's woefully noticeable.

My old MP (before I moved house) was non other than Sir Lindsey Hoyle and he did seem ok for locals BUT as soon as he became speaker for the house in parliament it seemed like power got straight to his head & he forgot about the little folk who had been his stepping stone there.(I think the power is why he now does all the shouting & telling off in the house)😅 but I think some of its deserved!

1979,thatcher,neoliberalism experiment,getting in bed with usa,privatisation of most things,experiment ended in crash 2008. where next?

I think we need radical reform.
Abandon Lib/Lab/Con etc completely - ie NO parties!
There should be local elections where we vote for a person, and what they stand for (not a party) and the winners of those elections should then be selected to serve as our government.
Those elected, should choose a leader to be PM.
All issues to be discussed and voted on, on their own merit and the majority vote carried. Less time spent bitching and sniping, more time collaborating together and getting the job in hand done!

I agree that a lot of the problems lies with so called professional politicians who have never worked outside politics. Cameron was an example, researcher, aide, and onwards. No life experience, no skills outside politics. If your workplace is politics you will obviously do all you can to stay there; this means not being a tall poppy, always following the party line, not being a rebel. Conscience gets over ruled by necessity.

Aveline

I agree with previous posters. Professional politicians who have never had a job outside politics don't govern well for people.
I remember when the Scottish parliament first opened that there were a lot of lawyers, teachers and others with all sorts of professional/working backgrounds. Debate was much more professional compared to the snipe fest that goes on now with no useful or serious exchange of views. It's woefully noticeable.

Agree 100% Aveline.

When did they start to lose their way? Thatcher! She had all governments after her , permission to treat us like serfs!

Today’s Guardian- ‘Social mobility is a fairytale’ Faza Shaneen on fighting for Labour and hating Oxford.
Very impressive Labour candidate stood against Ian Duncan Smith and lost by 1200 votes. Points out the obvious disadvantages of studying PPE at Oxford from her viewpoint.

I think that all parliamentary candidates should be required to work for a specified number of years in a job that had absolutely nothing to do with parliament/politics.

Has it ever been any different?

It's just not so easy for them to pull the wool over our eyes now than it was in the past.

M0nica

There are plans to build a huge piece of infra tructure in our parish, it will absorb most of the land in the area. Its only purpose is to enrich the investors in the company building it, not ordinary shareholders, or insurance companies with huge pension funds, but overseas sovereign wealth funds.

Everyone is opposed to it: county council, local council, parish councils local MPs. It has been turned down twice at public appeals and has been proposed again.

Now the planned project is in the constituency of a Conservative MP, a young men parachuted in from party HQ after the previous incumbent resigned, quite close to the election cut off date. He is not a natural rebel and we all believe that he will soon be offered some preferment on condition.........

I think that this is the root cause of the problem. Governments since Thatcher haven't been run for the benefit of the whole country's citizens, they've been run for the benefit of wealth.

This is not a lefty diatribe, it's reality. Thatcher and subsequent tory governments believed in 'small state', minimal state investment in services. All tory initiatives were based on the belief that the state should provide minimal services and that everything would be more efficient if run by the private sector. And, the belief that wealth 'created' by the private sector would 'trickle down' to everyone. Sadly this was economic nonsense, all it's done is concentrate wealth in the hands of fewer and fewer people and left us with a lot of poor 'public' services. Most economists will tell you this.
Also, the wealthy, individuals and corporations, have been in a far better position to influence government than the mass of 'ordinary' people. Naturally, they influence government to their own advantage to hang onto and increase their wealth.

The only intermission in the last 40 years was the 13 years of Labour government when public spending was higher, people were better off, and state services showed some improvement. But even the Labour government was heavily influenced by the power of the wealthy.

Nannan2

When the Tories got in.First Thatcher hatcheted as much as she could then all the other Tories following have all wanted to put their own stamp on dragging Britain down and ruining the economy further!Odd thing to be infamous for but those 'poshies' do seem to love it.🤔🤨

Mrs Thatcher got in because the previous Government under Callaghan was so abysmal!

Honestly, anyone who thinks that governments of the past were any better perhaps didn't live through those era.

Callistemon21

Has it ever been any different?

It's just not so easy for them to pull the wool over our eyes now than it was in the past.

I think it's just as easy as it ever has been.

People stick with a familiar narrative and don't give it much critical thought.