Disappearing

One of the most important insights I got from mindfulness was talking to yourself as if you were a friend. Sounds simple doesn't it...but for example would you say to a friend 'you are nothing?' Of course you wouldn't. So don't tell yourself that. Its not easy. We seem to get into habits of beating ourselves up in the hope of??? goes nowhere. Be a friend to yourself. I suppose it comes from all those lessons we were taught when small, don't boast, be humble and they are still good things we just have to know where to draw the line. You could say 'I think I am a bloody miracle of patience and loveliness'

if this is new it could be linked to menopause ,speak to your GP about HRT.I have always been very sociable until menopause arrived and I'm what my GP calls borderline agrophobic , I dont want to go out or mix with other folk ,am happiest at home with just family .This is all good...for me but my OH loves to socialise so I have to push myself to go out .Hoping it will pass .Perhaps your issues are linked to hormonal problems too .

I’m in exactly the same boat Elle Anne. In fact I could have written your post myself! I feel the same as you. Let’s hang in there Elle Anne and tell ourselves that we are worth something. Surely if we keep telling ourselves that we will both start feeling better about ourselves?

Hi EllieAnne I think you would find it beneficial to go on an assertion course. Assertion is very different from aggression and sometimes we women are so careful to avoid aggression we forget how to be assertive and end up afraid to voice our opinions at all. Then we start to lose self esteem and its the road to non-existence. With an assertion course you learn how to get your message across in a calm manner.

Ellie Anne You've taken the first step to not feeling grey. Please think about taking some of the advice here. And when you work out how not to pussyfoot round our lovely AC let us know! Good luck

Ellie Anne I am so sorry you feel that way. I think many women, especially older women feel this way sometimes. I have no advice just didn't want to read and run and wanted you to know you are not alone. Please continue to post on here if you feel you want to vent or have someone listen.
Sending you virtual hugs x

I'm so sorry you feel this way Ellie. I haven't read all the thread so apologies, but have you been bullied in the past? This often makes you feel like you're worthless.
Have you anything which lifts your spirits, such as a hobby, something which you are good at? Could you build bridges with your husband - a shared interest perhaps? Would he agree to a 'date night' now and again? I hope you can find a solution as you're not getting the best out of life.

A line from Desederata..

You are a child of the universe...no less than the trees and the stars...you have a right to be

Ellie Ann read look up and read the whole poem

You are a special person an Individual. Never run yourself down. Sending Love and Peace to you x

Ellie Anne, you sound such a nice person.I am sure your opinions will be valued when you speak up.You have confidence somewhere hidden away,it just needs to make an appearance.
You are an important person,a Mum and wife,and when you arent at home I am sure you are important to many other people.
I hope you get sound advice from a professional and start to feel better soon.
Sending hugs.

yes, I pussyfoot around my two grown up sons, to a degree, and certainly my dil`s (I have two) I have falling out, so I will keep quiet when I have to..

why create arguments?

EllieAnne, I feel for you. Please believe in yourself as a lovely and kind lady who is probably valued by those who know you.
I would like to meet you and I am sure I would find that you would be a wonderful friend,

Dear Ellie Anne. My heart goes out to you and to Gizmogranny. I feel so sad for you both.

As many others have said, I too understand how this feels. I went through over 20 years of being under the thumb of a bullying older husband. All the time I was "treading on eggshells" and every day was a terrifying endurance test. He would go for days without speaking, ignoring me, even an offer of a cup of coffer. If asked if he was ok he would spin round aggressively and shout "I'm ok. You're the one who should be worrying!"

Then I met a friend who endured the same. She and I began to meet up at her house because her husband had left. She was the most wonderful support to me.

With her encouragement I went to an Assertiveness course. It was really useful. Nothing like I expected. The other people were so kind and sweet and some were in such a similar position as mine. As time went by this gave me courage to go back to Uni and study again and I went into a lovely career just at the end of my working life. Best of all, I met a range of wonderful people.

Learning Assertiveness, how to set and keep Boundaries and most of all how to love yourself are three very worthwhile things in my experience. The last is essential.

My husband eventually killed himself, he could not accept that I was taking proceedings for a Legal Separation. I was married in Church so I was not happy about Divorce which I saw as breaking the vows. But the Legal Sep. allowed me to be in charge of my finances. He left me with terrible money problems and has managed to reduce my income to the rest of my life. He was controlling me by never giving me a penny and absorbing my hard-earned salary into his money. I had to gain legal control pay the household bills as he was not doing so to punish me for stopping being a timid and scared mouse around him. I needed to protect the children.

Assertiveness isn't shouting and being belligerent. It is the opposite. It is being self-assured and trusting yourself and not letting unreasonable people hurt you. It is not always possible to fend off such people as I know only too well, but I am so glad I began to learn about how to value myself and not let this kind of manipulation upset me.

I too pussyfoot around my children. Rightly or wrongly, I agree with others above, that life is too short for arguments. Mine do not completely understand my physical disability for example, and think I should do more than I am able to do. But then they live too far away to see me in daily life. But when it comes to a serious problem they are there for me.

Our children have vastly different lives to ours at their age. I think it is very tough for them. One of mine has two little boys and is working in a terribly demanding profession. She gets exhausted. Sometimes she is short with me but I let it ride over me. I know she sees terrible things at work and it must affect her.

But to you two sweet, kind, good-natured Ladies and all you others who are similar, I really want to say:

PLEASE learn to love yourselves! Learn to value yourselves.

I believe you are the salt of the earth. The kind and gentle mothers who hold us all together. We don't need the Public Speaking MP type of people round us, declaring what they think is right or, more often wrong! Anyway they often jump in without looking at the facts and assume they know everything then get it disastrously wrong! We don't go to thick-skinned shallow people for advice.

How much more valuable is the quiet, thoughtful person, who cares about making sure she has the facts straight, and doesn't harm anyone. We need thoughtful people who care about what they say and have scruples and would not say anything they were not sure about!

Ellie Anne and Gizmogranny you are both such valuable people!
All my best friends, from Primary School onwards, have been quiet, kind and thoughtful people like you. I value you very highly.

Hello Ellie Anne - like others I really feel for you and want to say to you that you are just as significant and worthwhile as everyone else - but realise just saying it doesn't make it feel true for you. I do think it would be good to speak to a counsellor - someone outside the situation who could help you see yourself more truly as an OK person. We don't have to be perfect - and it is a meaningless idea anyway. You might fine either or both of these paper back books helpful - I hope you will consider giving one or both a try:
"Feel the Fear and Do It Anyway" by Susan Jeffers

" A Woman in Your Own Right" by Anne Dixon.

Both are very good and easy to read and are still in print after many years because people continue to find them valuable.
I wish you well.

I used to always pussy foot around my husband....until I realised it was all ‘blather’ with him. He knew nothing about anything that didn’t involve his job (railways) or his passion (football). Outside his comfort zone he’s a know-nowt! Once I realised this and realised I could out-think him , and out-talk him, he was a ‘goner’ as far as being the boss (his phrase) was concerned. He had dominated me for last time. Find your voice , bothered with husband and children . No need for bossiness or rudeness...just assertiveness. It’s liberating .

polnan

"why create arguments?"

I just had to say how much I agree with you. Family is important.

Also I sometimes feel that two of my DC still like to impress me when they say things! I think the child-parent relationship never ends no matter how old the child.

What an absolutely beautiful post tillybelle. Hello Ellie Anne. So sorry you feel this way, I lack confidence and it's affected me all my life. You've been given some good advice here so I can't add anything, just wanted you to know that there are people here who care. Please find something that you enjoy, as others have said, that's just for you. Hope you feel better soon. Take care. X

That's your post at 13.05 tillybelle

EllieAnne: I just tried to send you a private message (it was a long one too) but it was blocked as it seems you cannot receive private messages. Are you aware of this?
Seems very odd to me....

You are in a dark place if you feel the way you do and I promise you that you can find connectedness, peace and contentment with a massive effort that you need to put into it. When you do it, gradually you begin to feel things again.
It's like learning to walk again because somehow in our life journey we gradually without knowing have lost that ability.
You start slowly, baby steps with a lot of patience and self compassion for yourself as if this was your child in the same situation. All the time telling yourself my thoughts are not me for me to behave the way I think. Those repeated small baby steps are your new behaviours that will make you feel better and when we feel better we'll think more positively.
I benefitted enormously from Mindfulness, Meditation, joining my local U3A, doing voluntary work after 20 years of being on antidepressants. I found 80% of my old self again. Now I take part in discussions and conversations like I used to making sure I know something about it. It was very hard when I started but I made myself to do them because I realised no one could help me if I stood in the way. I knew I had to do it if I wanted a better life than this and no one could do it for me no matter how much they loved to do it. The minute I realised my thought are distorted and therefore, I'm not my thoughts, I began to improve.
It took time to unravel the "your thoughts are not you". I took a short online course on CBT (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy ) and two online courses on Mindfulness & Meditation to understand my thoughts, emotions and behaviour. A few sessions of counselling, reading numerous article online and watching youtube on the subject helped me. You'll be amazed at how much then you have to talk about too. I always start by saying I think or I read or I heard or I watched this, that and the other on this, that and the other subject. I listen to what others say about the topic without being defensive, offensive or eager to prove one's right or the other's wrong. I also use I don't know very much but love to learn. Yes, your problem could be hormonal, thyroid, traumas, changing relationships, ... I'd see my GP about these too and ask him if counselling or CBT or Mindfulness could be helpful for me. I'd tell him exactly what you've written in your post and he/she should take it on from there if he/she's a decent doctor. If not, I'll make an appointment with another doctor. By the way, many doctors now a days speak highly of Mindfulness & Meditation because it's been working for tens of millions of people. I'll be thinking of you.

I also tried to pm you, Ellie-Anne. After I'd put together quite a long post, I discovered that you weren't receiving pms.

TillyBelle Thankyou for such a well thought out response. Truly inspiring and uplifting.

What gives you personal pleasure?
Walking, swimming, sewing? I think it's time you spent more time doing things for yourself, which would give you both pleasure and a feeling of satisfaction, and then self worth.

Ellianne, it occurs to me that you aren't having opportunities to smile and be with friends. Do you have any good friends you can have an evening out with?

We all pussyfoot around our children, because we are scared of conflict

I find I can disagree with my sons without causing conflict. We usually end up laughing and agreeing to differ. After all, they are adults with good qualifications, responsible jobs and their own families. We are equals!
I had a lot of learning to do when, after moving away from an area where I had good friends, only a few months later, my husband left me. It took me some time to get back on an even keel but it did help that I was, at the time, doing an introductory counselling course and I was able to apply some of the techniques to myself, helped by other course members. So I agree with other posters that counselling would be worth trying.

Maybe asking for a change in antidepressants? Only you can change the way you live your life and I think going to assertive classes would be a good start. I would ask your GP to refer you.
I on the other hand am like Monica, I don't pussyfoot around my adult children lol and I certainly wouldn't have them shouting at me. They'd soon get their answer. I'm known to get on my soapbox and give my views on things. I take after my dad for that. But although I have my firm opinions I do respect the views of others and everyone has a right to have their own opinions. I love a good debate and there's never any fallouts. We are a close and loving family by the way. lol
I do hope that you can get some help Elle with your confidence. You seem such a lovely person who needs to find her voice.

You definitely need something to make you feel better about yourself as you are experiencing depression and it's affecting your mental health. What about acting lessons or a course in assertiveness. Have you seen the livewell site? There's an assertiveness outreach service
www.livewellsouthwest.co.uk/about/all-services/