Manners going out of the window?

My 4 year old GD knows her please and thank yous and sorry (though I think that an excuse for being naughty) but she's heading in the right direction. I remember being in a busy place with my then 2 year old daughter an was horrified to see her pushing her way through a crowd. I did apologise to some of the people she'd pushed. One person did say that at least she'd said "Excuse me"!!

Caps in the house or at a table are nit my thing though I'd prefer the thing on their head than placed on the table. I've seen this happen many time in eating places in the USA and I just want to walk out. Manners have become out of date as there is so much ME ME ME now. Noticed even schools in some areas have RESPECT SELF as their leading philosophy for the children. Manners have no chance unless instilled at home. One thing I do like about the USA is how in a lot of places they use Sir and Ma'm addressing you.

There is a big difference between politeness, consideration and good manners, and Hyacinth Bouquet etiquette.

I think good manners are so very important to both young and old alike, unfortunately a lot of adults don't set an example!! Thankfully my children had good manners & their children are growing up with those same manners too.
I always maintain that you should leave somewhere knowing that you'd be welcome back, tell my grandkids the same & get them to check & make sure that they have their manners with them in a pocket!
That makes them giggle! Yep Grannies nuts!!

If the children are in my house be they my grandchildren, my nieces or my great grandson I expect them to stick to my rules.... sit at the table for meals, no yelling at the table, no fighting, don’t interrupt, ask before you take something from the fridge or cupboard . I have never understood the elbows on the table thing, we have never done the please and thank you thing even with our kids at home but did teach them that outside the house others may require it.

young parents are quick to teach their children to say please and thank-you but that is all. as they get older what about consideration for others? 'Do as you would be done by' is another one, needs explaining to them of course.
I think the elbows on the table one was for back in the day with big family, there wasn't room to for elbows on table, A bit like men these days with their leg spreading! wouldn't have had that years ago!

Kartush. Have I misunderstood your post ? No please and thank you at home ? Apologies if I read it wrong

Manners, like everything else, change in the course of a generation, or so.

When I was a child, up to around 1960 men and boys automatically took of their caps or hats when coming indoors, or greeting a lady in the street. A woman kept her hat on in restaurants and when visiting friends in their homes during the day, if she belonged to my grandmothers' generation.

Then we all stopped wearing hats and by the time it became fashionable for boys to wear baseball caps, the lads who did so, had never heard it was impolite to wear headgear indoors.

Putting your elbows on the table was most definitely considered bad manners in my childhood, where manners were not just a matter of saying please and thank you, but a standard of general polite behaviour.

Manners covered all aspects of life, but they change. My grandmothers had been brought up never to speak to an adult, unless spoken to. My generation wasn't, but we were taught to rise in buses and offer our seats to grown-ups. Today's children aren't, as a rule.

I remember the brother of a schoolfriend of mine rising whenever any adult came into the room where we were. He was the only boy I knew who had been taught to do so, and it really won him points in the eyes of my great-aunt, to whom it had been a commonplace of good manners in her youth.

Personally, I draw the line at mobile phones and lap-tops at the table during meals. I expect people to eat with their mouths closed and their elbows off the table and not to put their knife in their mouths, and while I taught I did ask pupils not to wear sunglasses and hats in the classroom.

Oh, and at the beginning of the lockdown I offended a friend, who had been reproved in a shop for not covering her mouth when she coughed, by remarking that I too would have requested her to remember to do so.

I don't know where the caps off indoors came from either, just that it's always been part of my upbringing and even now, in my seventies it makes me feel uneasy, and especially so at the table.
As a child I also remember ladies wore hats in church but gentlemen removed them. Must try to find out why.

Most of us on GN were brought up in an age when things were much more formal. Life is more relaxed now, I agree with Furret good manners are about respect. I did expect please and thank you from my grandchildren and for them to be aware that things would be different at my house.

Aepgirl I completely agree with you. A cap/hat indoors shows disrespect to the house owner/host. I don’t understand why so many people think it doesn’t matter any more. Also elbows on the table - if, for instance, I was out on a dinner date, (which I wouldn’t be because I’m married but I can’t think of an analogy) and the man put his elbows on the table, there wouldn’t be a second date. It may seem petty to some but lack of manners ( which includes all other manners too) shows poor upbringing. Yes I am a bit of a snob but I’m happy with that. Showing manners shows you have respect for the person you’re with.

I've just done a quick search and found that men being required to remove their hat, any hat, indoors goes back to medieval times when knights removed their helmet on entering a home to signify that theirs was a oeaceful visit and they didn't expect to be attacked.
So that's why I feel uneasy to see a man indoors wearing a hat ?

Hi, we remind them of please and thank you. (Elbows on the table went out the window years Im afraid. ). I will pull them up about table manners - spearing a whole fish finger and then eating it bit by bite off the fork for example! But age appropriate. I expect better manners from the 12 year old then the 4! Other then that unless they're being rude or misbehaving I don't worry to much.

Manners should lead to considerate behaviour, empathy. Etiquette is just for show. I just woke up to the fact, that in this con constituency selfish, inconsiderate behaviour is to be expected, as cons can only think of themselves, no matter, how much showy etiquette they are aware of. So we end up with a town centre park littered with debris and human excrement after much partying.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Just thought of something that strikes me as really bad manners and we saw a lot of it around before the lockdown. People who are out with a dining companion and then spend much of the time talking to someone else on the phone I wonder why they bother going out with a person who is right there in front of them when all their conversation appears to be had with whoever is on the end of their phone and aren't there with them. I do think it's bad manners to take telephone calls at the dinner table. Unless you happen to be a doctor on call, otherwise switch it off!

My mother was a stickler for good manners and pretty outspoken too if friends didn't say please or thankyou, she'd ask them if they were taught manners in their house. Oh dear.

We always had to say please may I leave the table and I got the giggles one day when a cousin who was sitting at the table-top mangle had said " please may I leave the mangle ". It sounded so funny at the time.

Thankfully all my GGC were taught manners so please and thankyou come easy without having to remind them.

The boys don't wear caps, they'd never fit because they don't have short hair-cuts and their hair is thick on top but not down to their shoulders. Old-fashioned is what it would be called going by some haircuts.

My girls are quite strict about manners as that's how they were brought up. If the two younger DGC talk whilst eating I always say "chew, swallow then talk" which they both love & have been known to say it to their parents if needed! Our eldest DGD isn't allowed to look at her phone while eating. If one of the little ones coughs they will get a "hand" & obviously please & thank you but this is no different to home, if anything I'm more relaxed than their mums. I don't like rudeness, I quite often get a message to have a word with the eldest (though tbh I think her mum is too strict!)

I don't see my DGD often enough to influence her much.
I say please and thank you around her but she is very reluctant to say them herself, although her parents encourage her to do so.
Apparently, though, she is very polite at school.

Uncooked joints off the table

One of my Grandma's favourite sayings

'Hat honour' for men used to be very important.
In the 17th century men were expected to remove their hat to show respect for a social superior.
Quaker men did not do so, as they believed all were equal.

My children are much stricter with their children than I think I used to be!
after each meal they say “Thank you for my nice lunch/tea / whatever. Please may I get down”
Mine used to ask to get down to be fair and as a child I had to say “Please may I leave the table” to which my Dad would usually joke “Well you can’t take it with you” - and we would groan.
But I also remember when the girls came home from visiting Granny and Grandpa I woukd realise what lovely manners they showed, not only at the table, but in general. I don’t think they were nagged into it, but followed the example of my in-laws who had lovely manners!
(Lasted about a day! )
TBH it is their parents’ job but the fact remains that good manners will stand anybody in good stead in later life -and boorish behaviour whether at table or elsewhere, and bad manners will always create a bad impression.
A good example by parents and grandparents however is worth any amount of nagging of course.

My elder son thanked me for insisting on good manners. He has noticed that the way he carries himself has had a huge impact on his career.

There has been an issue regarding "manners" for many years now. It begins at home I think but needs reinforcing with extended family, schools etc.

Mr B wears his hat indoors, he needs to wear one outside in the sun but as he is in and out all day he just keeps it on. What has not wearing a cap indoors got to do with manners. I believe manners is about respect for others.