Why I am sad.

Even when my husband is looking away I can guess what he's thinking. When I walk into a room of strangers, I can pick up on certain moods. Mind you, there are times when I'm totally baffled by me...

I never told them, so never had to say 'I told you so'. If I had, I might have lost a son, but as it is, although he made mistakes, I have a very precious GD as a result and he is happily married and settled as father of two other great kids.

I agree Greatnan. Hard to keep our lips zipped! Sometimes my DD1 sees a look on my face and says 'keep it in your head Mum' - good advice and I am sure has saved many a disagreement!

Keeping your mouth shut when you know you are right should be taught in motherhood classes! I know a good deal about such matters as tax, insurance, mortgages, divorce, probate, finance in general and education, although some of my knowledge is probably out of date. I have been Head of a Remedial Teaching Service, a conveyancer, a portfolio manager, a financial advisor and a tax inspector. (I chose to leave some professions, and in some cases circumstance meant I had to change my career). I could have saved members of my family a lot of money if they had asked my advice before plunging into commitments, but of course I am just 'Mum' or 'Nan' and what can she know?
I have also watched as one daughter made the same mistakes with her children as I made with her , in not forcing them to face up to the harsh realities of life.
I suppose we all want to shield our children from pain, but I now know that they have to make some mistakes in order to mature and learn.
How often have the words 'I told you so!' trembled on our lips - but must never be spoken!

greenmossgiel I agree - I have posted personal comments on here that I would defend if the subject(s) of the discussions wanted to challenge me - especially the ex-DIL, who has tried to make my life miserable in the last few months. There are certain things I would not say for fear of hurting someone I care about, so I keep my own counsel and talk generally about those issues. I've learned so much from other Gransnetters and been able to take a different perspective on any number of issues.

Many of us have been able to identify with the fears and worries that have been brought onto this thread. Greatnan showed great strength and trust in us all when she opened her heart. In doing so, she allowed many to unburden themselves and 'out' their considerably awful concerns. Although she has had to step back a bit, I think it's so good that we're able to still bring to the fore the things that we feel we can, and indeed need, to discuss in order to help ourselves and each other a bit.
When I've spoken of the things that have really worried me, I've just been so overwhelmed by the warmth and such helpful advice given by women from all walks of life. We're all mothers, and we all love our children unconditionally and have come through hell and high water with them sometimes. Although there are things that have occurred in my life that I wouldn't consider discussing on any forum, I feel I can trust myself and my anonymity to continue to post with care.

This thread has raised so many issues. The practical one of privacy or lack of it and how that impacts on what we share. I did share a problem that would easily identify me if my DD read it but I had such good advice that I really feel the risk was worth it. After all, I am sure much worse is put on Facebook when everyone knows exactly who is being talked about. I do see though that Greatnan's situation was just too sensitive for her to take the risk of keeping the posts public. As someone mentioned we could PM someone we trusted but I found the range of responses so helpful, each containing a further insight, which added to the comfort I found. I hope people will still be able to share but I suppose it has been good that we have to think a little about making sure we are fully happy that we are either very well disguised or that we don't care if we are identified. Not sure if I put that very well but hope it makes some kind of sense.

It is just so uplifting to read about how other women are battling on with some heartbreaking situations that it really makes me realise how little I have to moan about - so the ceiling in the front room fell down just like 'Carry on up the Kyber', the cat has been sick on the sofa, DH lost two days work with bad back, weather a bit dodgy (nothing compared to bagitha and others in the north) etc.

Sewsilver hit the nail on the head with the comment about watching children make mistakes and 'saying nothing'. There are lots of courses for communication skills but what about non-communications skills. How to smile, say nothing even when that damn elephant is not just in the room but has taken up the whole house.

How true, JessM. You never know what's round the corner...

JessM that is so true. Having raised my children to be independent and looking forward to my youngest child leaving home I now find myself re-parenting my daughter AND co-parenting her son. I love my children, but like bagitha I saw my job as raising them to let them go.

(Have been a bit out of touch lately and didn't comment on this thread previously as I felt I needed time to produce a considered response, but now the thread has moved on - as they do. Love and hugs to all who have contributed bravely.)

And just when we think we have got is cracked, along comes a surprise of some kind.

I found the letting go DS1 and Dd hard. It's one thing to know they need to make their own mistakes then watching that happen and SAYING NOTHING.But I also find it hard to not be able to let go of DS2 who has severe learning difficulties and will always need me. I worry about him after I am gone

I don't think I found letting go too hard because it happened in stages. They left and came back to stay for a while with their partners/fiancées. Now they keep an eye on me, from a distance. And so does my adult GD. It's nice!

I think you've hit the nail right on the head there, granIT. The letting go is another essential parenting skill that can be quite hard to learn. Doesn't half make life easier if one does learn it though and I think it is something we should take pride in when we manage it.

Bask in all that love Greatnan hugs are good (so is lemon cake made with love). My DH comes from a very undemonstrative family, and I have had to teach him about hugs, he is a very fast learner, and now hugs all the men in the family, my son his son SIL my brothers, they were all bit taken aback at first but now seem enthusiastic!

Ah, I can feel that hug, Goldengran!
We have not been a demonstrative family in the past, but I am getting lots of hugs from my daughter and GC this holiday. One GD has just brought me a cup of tea and a slice of her own lemon cake - she is 14 and a dedicated baker!

*Greatnan (((hugs)), just because I want to .

Geraldine, it was probably too late by the time I became aware that my gmail had been 'hacked', but thank you for acting so promptly to remove my posts. I think I am now past worrying about what my daughter might do next - of course it is illegal to access someone else's computer but I certainly don't want to get her or my GS into any trouble.
I can see now that I was indiscreet to give so many details which would identify me to anyone who knew me, but it was just such a relief to be able to talk about it to someone other than my other daughter, who has been patience itself in letting me go over and over her sister's letter. And who would have thought for a moment that she would descend to spying on me?

This is a bit off the point of where this thread has gone now, but many of these posts have made me think that being a mother doesn't get easier as your children grow up. I personally find it very hard to let go. My adult daughter doesn't really need me worrying about her any more, but I watch her making what I feel are mistakes and it's worse than when she was small. Then I could just tell her to stop. Now I can't do anything, and I have to sit and watch. Without the power, the anxiety feeds on itself - it's very hard.

There are obviously very few studies of identical twins reared separately, but those that exist do tend to show remarkable similarities in personality, taste, choice of career and partner, etc.
I remember one of our lectures at teacher training college was entitled 'The environment acts as a threshold amplifier to an hereditary input', which we decided meant 'You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear'.
There are traits which are genetic but may not be developed because the child's life experiences do not encourage them, whether for good or evil.
I was researching children's self concepts for my MEd. dissertation and I came across a study which showed that children do best if they are brought up in a loving but well-ordered family. Second best, to my surprise, was a a cold but well-ordered family, and worst was a disorganised and chaotic family, so children never knew where the boundaries were. More than anything, apparently, children need order and routine - they find it difficult to cope when parents react one way to some behaviour one day, and in a different way the next day.

Yes I have always been a believer in nurture rather than nature theories myself. Most people born with incredibly plastic brains. I am less adamantly so than I was though.

"Can Geraldine or someone up there". Grannylin - love the last bit!

Yes, you do need to be a signed up member and logged in to read profiles, but anyone can read the threads. (but not contribute)

It's the same on all forums on the web. They probably couldn't, technically, stop the general public reading it.

Gally you can always choose to pm someone you feel you could trust to share a private discussion with you, and not be worried about it being exposed here on public threads.

Nanarosie your comments are bang on - there are too many children who have been made to feel they are to blame for being harmed, and they can carry that burden till the day they die. I once helped to staff a helpline for callers who had been watching a Channel 4 programme about paedophiles, about 18 years ago, and a woman in her 90s phoned in to disclose what had happened to her as a child. She wanted to say it before her life ended. She had carried that memory all those years, and finally realised that she was not the instigator of that abuse. I don't remember saying all that much, nor did she, we just cried together and she said she would sleep peacefully that night.

Hi JessM, yes you are right - research tells us that 100% of abusers have suffered some sort of abuse or severe neglect themselves, and have lived in dysfunctional environements, but being abused doesn't mean they will go on to abuse themselves.

There are a few elderly sex offenders who also have some brain lesions, but these do not cause them to sexually abuse, however this brain damage can result in disinhibition and all control is lost as a result. Temporal lobe damage does not cause sexual offending - other parts of the brain have also been referred to, such as the amygdala - sexual disinhibition can occur with such damage, but not necessarily sexual offending/abuse of children.

The XYY chromosome was reputed to signify propensity to violence in men, but further research showed just as many non-violent men having the same chromosome.

Sexual offending is widely understood to be learned behaviour, and it is more entrenched in those offenders who have been corrupted as far as their sexual arousal and attraction becoming solely towards children - neither gender is immune from being targeted by paedophiles, many of whom see children androgenously - it is their lack of adult features that is attractive.

For every theory that sexual offending is caused by genes, chromosomes, alcohol, brain damage and so on, there is research that shows these theories have no foundation.

There are quite a few things in my life which I would like to discuss on GN but there is no way I can do that. I don't know if Mr.G has ever looked at GN - probably not, but I can't bet on it and I have never introduced any friends to it as they would know who I was immediately and I wouldn't want them to know my secrets; the only way would be to change my 'name' and I really don't want to have to do that. So, my secrets will have to go to the proverbial grave with me which is a pity, but that's life - and it would be so good to discuss them with anonymous friends!!