Anyone dissillusioned with a friend

I think everyone needs to take a step back. None of us are doing everything perfectly even if we think we are and this pointing of fingers at people who are doing a less good job (in our eyes) at isolating is beginning to feel a bit witch huntey.

Maybe her mother is threatening to go out herself if your friend doesnt go get these after thought items for her and shes chosing between two not great options!

There needs to be a society/community left at the end of all this

I understand what you’re saying and I have also experienced people doing what I don’t think is right as regards isolating etc. And yes it does upset me. So I decided not to look at it .
I’m doing things which help me cope and take my mind off it. If there’s one thing I’ve learned about life it is to lead your own life the way you think is best .
I don’t find it easy. I really want to put them right ! But it’s a waste of time trying to tell some people.

Maybe you're being too subtle? If staff at shops have told her she's not following our new rules and regs I think you should tell her outright. It's for her own and her mother's good.

Its not going to help you, or your friend, or this situation in any way if we all become judge and jury of others outtings.

Its a mad mad time. Not everybody is thinking straight. Not everybody is coping. Judge people on how they are usually, thats a much better indicator of who they are

I agree with stepping back.
Your opinions are valid but as the quote goes “Am I my brother’s keeper?”

By all means keep your distance and if she asks, tell her kindly but firmly that you don’t want to put yourself at risk and you are sure she wouldn’t want to put others at risk too.

A friend I know is doing a very similar thing. She is kindly getting some shopping for elderly neighbours ,but it is becoming apparent that rather than do one trip and get a proper list she is bobbing in and out several times a day.Also her husband is making a couple of trips a day to the local store even though she's told me they have enough food in for days if not weeks.She's making no secret of it.
I honestly thing some people are using the shop for essentials as an excuse just to get out.It's driving another friend who lives opposite mad.We both know she can't relax generally and always has to be busy. But we are biting our tongues though as hearing about even more deaths,and myself having a DD who is an ICU nurse it's hard not to feel annoyed. And knowing how many people are making a huge effort and lots of sacrifices.

I honestly thing some people are using the shop for essentials as an excuse just to get out

Yes I do think some are.
We are writing a list as things run out and not shopping until the page is full BUT...

We have to assume that others are doing their best too. An extra walk to the shops may be a breather from an abusive partner. They may have a family member with memory loss who doesnt understand the restrictions and will go out for small "unnecessary" items if they dont go for them. There may be people at high risk of DVTs for whom one our walking isnt enough. I dont know. I think its best to assume the best in people, what good will assuming the worst do?

The person who is shopping every 4 days so that they shop near their homes and dont use a vehicle is being judged by the person who goes in their vehicle to a bigger supermarket so they can do bigger shops less often, and is in turn judged for "unecessary car journeys" by the people walking to closer shops but carrying less at a time....

Some people can carry less than others. Some people are living with people who have no impulse control and would scoff a big shop in days etc..

There's an awful lot of people who think the rules just don't apply to them. I believe that many just find it impossible to change their habits - too set in their ways.

A friend of mine is (as always) spending half the week 'helping' her mother, who's in her eighties. Her mother is very capable, though, and needs no help, apart from having shopping dropped off.

I've come to the conclusion that, in fact, it's my friend who needs to visit her mother. She knows how much I disapprove!

Same here Washerwoman. My daughter is working in ICU too and is exhausted. Maybe, that is why my friend is driving me mad. Please tell your daughter how grateful we all are.
In reply to you Notanan2, I agree we shouldn't be judge and jury, and i'm certainly not saying that anyone is perfect. But as I stated in my post, under normal circumstances, my friend often point blank refuses to go back out again for her after shopping and is always commenting about what a selfish woman her mother is. Now when we are being asked to just stay home unless it's unavoidable, she is doing the absolute opposite. It's just baffling and odd for her! Maybe she just isn't coping.

Geminil7892 I am certainly wasting my time trying to tell her. She couldn't or wouldn't even accept that she had been panic buying either!

Jane10, I agree with you. I am going to tell her outright. My daughter is working like crazy in intensive care, like all the other health workers putting themselves in danger. The least my friend can do is think of others as well as herself and her mother's needs, and stop acting irresponsibly. Our doctors and nurses, shop assistants, postmen etc, are all doing more than their bit, we should be doing ours. Maybe, that's why the assistants have commented.
Thank you for all your replies. They are much appreciated.

There's an awful lot of people who think the rules just don't apply to them

I think actually its more a case of everyone thinking that their way of following the rules is the right way.

I have noticed the following "phenomenon" in the supermarket:

People who do wear masks and gloves out telling those who dont, that they should.
HOWEVER
Those that dont wear masks and gloves Ive noticed are much better at keeping 2ms apart.

The gloved/masked shoppers walk closer than 2ms to other shoppers. So in turn tell off the masked/gloved people for not adhering to 2m rule

Both parties think theyre right. Both think theyre BEST as following the rules, not that the rules dont apply to them IYKWIM

But as I stated in my post, under normal circumstances, my friend often point blank refuses to go back out again for her after shopping and is always commenting about what a selfish woman her mother is. Now when we are being asked to just stay home unless it's unavoidable, she is doing the absolute opposite. It's just baffling and odd for her! Maybe she just isn't coping.

Is it possible at all that the mother is saying "well if you wont go back for X I'll go myself"?

So in turn tell off the masked/gloved people for not adhering to 2m rule

who im turn..

Hetty58, I think you are probably spot on about your friend needing to visit her mother. I cannot say the same for my friend. It's the absolute opposite, they clash on everything and spend long bouts not speaking. Maybe, it has suddenly hit her how vulnerable her mother could be with this virus? I just don't know. Just like your friend, her mother is very independant and with no health concerns. Likewise, she would only have a problem with carrying heavy bags. A taxi was always ordered on the occasions they weren't speaking.

It may as you say be a peace keeping exercise, based on the fear that it may be their last conversation ever, and refusal usually ends in fall out?

Notanan2, it's possible I suppose, but knowing her mum, I think it is unlikely. I think her mum would just nip out to the local Spar a very short distance from her home. My friend would be non the wiser. Having said that, her mum is a very selfish lady, very strong willed and stubborn. It is probably a case that she likes having her daughter at her back and call. My friend just loves shopping full stop. They both live alone and maybe that is why they are, how they are. We are all different I suppose. At the end of the day we should all be doing all we can to help the people that are looking after us, at great risk to themselves, and if that means avoiding unnecessary trips out then so be it. It's not a lot to ask.

Sorry, just read my post back. I'm not suggesting for a second that all people living alone are prone to being selfish, far from it. I just know in this instance, I think they have become too self centered.

My children have insisted that I isolate, won't visit but will drop things off and wave through a window. They've done this since the beginning of March. I'm only 66 and in good health - but they won't risk infecting me.

My friend lives with her sons, sees her grandchildren, constantly shops - yet risks her mother's health. I can't help seeing it as selfish and irresponsible behaviour. She says that other 'carers' visit - but that's just an excuse, when no caring is needed.

Hetty58, I think your kids sound lovely. They obviously love you to bits not wishing to risk infecting you. Mine do the same, just text to say they are outside. I go to the door, but they keep a safe distance and won't come in. I bet you enjoy seeing their smiling faces through the window as much as I do. I bet there are lots of other Gransnetters and their kids doing the same. I'm 65 and just have high blood pressure but they won't take any chances. Hubby is in poor health so they wouldn't want to take chances with him either.

Your friend without doubt is being selfish. The 'carers visit' approach is just her trying to excuse her own behaviour. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people like her, my friend included. Stay safe and keep waving.

notanan, your posts don't reflect your usual take on abuse and neglect- You're defending it- What's changed?

A safe place live is at the top of the list of mental health and physical wellness every day and especially so during a global pandemic-

There will be no community to connect to if communication breaks down- Jones needs to speak the truth to her friend so together they learn to cope, with each other as friends, with their families, and strive to keep each other safe, their families safe and community safe-

It isn't judgy or witch-hunty to communicate-

Both my neighbours are acting selfishly, both have had lady friends visiting back and forth and both of them have been to and from their ladyfriends, one lives 60 miles away and the other 1 mile. I don`t curtain twitch but I see the cars. Seeing this happen has coloured my thinking somewhat. I brought all their bins in yet again this week, wearing gloves because they were both out in their cars, visiting

I think many people really cannot just be.

For me this is lockdown has some advantages, I don’t have to go to work, visit my mother, entertain or attend any groups/societies

For the first time in my adult life I can just be and I’m happy.
I appreciate this is possibly only temporary as we and all our loved ones are well and it’s only early days.

Some people cannot be alone or still and don’t have any hobbies or interests so this is a nightmare for them.

My 25 year old son is in CZ living and working alone from home and is on day 22, he can’t even get UK TV. I really admire his resilience.

At least those of us that are abiding by the rules can be safe in the knowledge we have done everything we can to reduce our risk of spread or infection.

notanan, your posts don't reflect your usual take on abuse and neglect- You're defending it- What's changed?

No Im not.
Berrating people who arent necessarily acting rationally/sensibly, perhaps because of unseen abuse, isnt going to make them more rational or less abused

A friend of mine has been out and about distributing cake to friends and family. I have bitten my tongue and thanked my lucky stars that she has chosen not to share it with me ??