Would you support the doctors' strike.

I support them , for our safety and theirs

We must all support them.

Yes, absolutely.

I support them, but I still hope that a strike could be averted, since I am sure that not one of them would wish to harm a patient, and not one of them will take the decision to strike without a great deal of heart searching and anxiety about how a strike would affect patients.
It is preposterous that this and previous governments have used junior doctors' professionalism and commitment against them to make them work dangerously long and unsocial hours.

Does anyone know what the twenty-three points are?

Here are the main pints in a government publication.

They earn their money..... junior doctor newly qualified starts at approximately £25k.

NO!
We worked much harder and longer hours for much less.
Today's graduates don't know they're born.
They're also taught how to run a practice and maximise profits more than hands on medicine

You tell 'em, Galen!

I've read that link I posted. It looks quite reasonable to me.

Newly qualified doctors and pints, thatbags ? They seem to go together naturally.

Galen don't forget that unlike in our day, most junior doctors now graduate with debts of >£50k.
A salary of £25K is not generous when you consider that they not only have to repay that debt but fund further study and examination fees.

I don't know enough about it.

However, I do know that about 15 years ago DGodD was a junior doctor working extremely long hours. Her Consultant was very unsympathetic, saying all junior doctors had to go through it, he had had to do so years before - which didn't make it right.
However, this new proposal seems to limit the number of hours they would have to work which must be a good thing - who would want to be diagnosed or treated by a doctor who had had no sleep for 36 hours?

Yes this looks OK to me. As long as they don't have to do crazy long shifts like in the old days. I agree with Galen

Absolutely I would support them but hope that it never comes to that for everyones sake.

It looks ok to me too! Is everyone sure it's not just because they don't want any weekend work! It doesn't seem to add to their hours at all, or affect their money.

Just because i taught classes of over 35 kids when i started teaching does not make it right Galen .

If we want enough doctors so they do not need to work stupid hours without a break, so that they are on best form to treat/diagnose etc. in a climate of greater expectation and less 'respect' then we should be looking to make the job both socially and financially attractive. Successive governments have undermined public sector workers by negative press and meddling in the minutiae of professional work and so now there is a crisis in recruitment across many areas (education /health/law) whilst demanding more and more 'accountability /targets met'

I would support the doctors if they do strike.

It is swings and roundabouts.

My OH (who is probably roughly contemporary with galen) worked very long hours indeed as a junior doctor. I hardly saw him when our first two children were small; and I was basically a single mother. This was not a good thing. He would come home occasionally, but all he did was sleep. I would not wish that new young doctors miss out on family life in that way. He was very tired indeed, did not have proper meals and it was not a positive experience on a personal level.

But .......... he always says that, if he had not done all this work, he would not have been able to gain the necessary experience to function as the GP that he eventually became, and is concerned that new junior doctors do not have sufficient learning and experience under their belts to be safe. But neither are they safe when they are suffering from sleep deprivation.

I would hope that they do not strike - but, times have changed, and, quite rightly, workers' rights (in any profession) have been improved and we cannot turn the clock back on that, and I would not wish to. The good old days were not really very good and I support the idea of better working conditions.

I support them. What is forgotten is that a junior doctor is often in his 30s or 40s, and has a family and a mortgage.

www.hospitaldr.co.uk/blogs/dr-blogs/letter-that-sums-it-up-hunts-pay-rise-offer-is-nothing-of-the-sort

It sounds good when Hunt says he is offering them 11% pay rise, but initially he offered them 15%.

This is an article from a junior doctor.

www.opendemocracy.net/ournhs/nick-carpenter/not-fair-not-safe-6-reasons-junior-doctors-are-preparing-to-strike

Because previous generations of doctors worked very long hours is it still acceptable ? We use to send ten year old children into the pits and mills

I agree, Anniebach.

Another thing that seems to be forgotten is the fact that nowadays it's easier to travel and get a job in a different country, working with better pay and conditions. Work/life balance is considered more important now.

I have read the government publication which thatbags posted and find it is really difficult to comment on the fairness or otherwise of the new contract.

Unless you are actually a junior doctor and know how the present system works and how the new contract would work in practice (not just on paper), I can't see how you would know whether they will be better or worse off in practical terms under the new contract.

However, much of the medical profession is very concerned about the new contract and the fact that the government has not shown itself willing to enter into proper negotiations but appears almost to have assumed it to be a foregone conclusion.

I can't believe that such a large number of doctors, both at junior and senior level, have no reason to be very angry about this contract. Surely junior doctors wouldn't consider the very drastic step of striking unless they felt it absolutely necessary.

Something I hadn't realised was that junior doctors' starting salary is currently only £22,636 which I think is quite disgusting. I was earning a lot more than that as a legal secretary and yet these doctors, even at a junior level, take on the sort of responsibility and stress that many other people would steer clear of, however high the salary might ultimately rise to.