Director General of the CBI's Bloomberg Economy Speech: Is he suggesting we go back to a mixed economy?

We stabilised the economic system immediately. Then for the long run, we stabilised the public finances. And we achieved modest economic growth. But our productivity growth flatlined. And our society divided rather than united.

We didn't 'stabilize the economy', George Osborne and the tories crashed it. And proved that cutting state spending, far from being a prerequisite for growth, actually stalled it. As well as leading to poverty, unemployment and people desperately taking micky mouse, zero hours jobs just to keep their heads above water. No wonder there was a drop in productivity.

While ever the CBI and 'business leaders' fail to recognise that state spending can drive growth, and cling to neo-liberal 'trickle down' theory we will get nowhere.

Mind you, tories are in a bind at the moment, it's state spending that is keeping the country afloat though it goes completely against the Chancellor's instincts.

None of our main parties have declared their fulsome support for public services balanced with a regulated market economy at any time in the recent past.

I think that Labour did try, but all the cards were stacked against them. People are so deeply attached to the 'household economy' myth promoted by Thatcher (despite most economists shouting, 'NO, it isn't like that'), backed up by the media, that it might take a major shift in belief to get them to vote for parties that understand, even imperfectly, that it isn't so.

And Brexit doesn't help...

Incidentally, I saw an interesting comment recently to the effect that when Adam Smith (thatcher's economist hero) spoke of 'free markets', he wasn't talking of an unregulated trading free for all, but of markets 'free from rentiers'; rentiers being people who don't trade in produce, but who make their money by speculating on the money markets and charging people for the use of their assets (land, houses etc).

Adam Smith was much more 'moral' than he's been made out to be..

P.S I have seen it suggested that a better phrase would be 'Build Back Fairer'. But of course, that depends on people's interpretation of 'fair'...

What I took from his speech is that he was advocating the sort of large scale investment that happened after the second world war.
I think that is the right way to go, to invest in our public services and our infrastructure, also look at what sort of manufacturing we could do in this country, not to compete with low wage, low regulation countries like China, but to manufacture high quality products, the vaccine manufacturers are a good starting point.

MaizieD

P.S I have seen it suggested that a better phrase would be 'Build Back Fairer'. But of course, that depends on people's interpretation of 'fair'...

I do think it says more than Better though; even if it only gives a sense of direction.

Ilovecheese

What I took from his speech is that he was advocating the sort of large scale investment that happened after the second world war.
I think that is the right way to go, to invest in our public services and our infrastructure, also look at what sort of manufacturing we could do in this country, not to compete with low wage, low regulation countries like China, but to manufacture high quality products, the vaccine manufacturers are a good starting point.

So when do you start that Party Ilovecheese?

I really don't think any of the parties have come out and said it clearly. I know what you mean Maizie, when you said I think that Labour did try, but all the cards were stacked against them. I thought it was interesting listening to what they had to say last time round but came to the conclusion that they would always be hogtied by their connection with the unions. Not that I don't think unions should exist; I do but they have had the problem of how they "fit" politically since Labour was created.

Talking of Adam Smith, I've just found my favourite quote from 'The Wealth of Nations'

No society can surely be happy and flourishing of which the far greater part of its members are poor and miserable. It is but equity, besides, that they who feed, clothe and lodge the whole body of the people, should have such a share of the produce of their own labour as to be themselves tolerably well fed, clothed and lodged

It is interesting that you thought I was suggesting that a mixed economy with plenty of investment by Government would only be possible by starting a new party PippaZ

Do most people think neither of the main parties are likely to go down that path and that both will be advocating more austerity and "handbag economics"?

I don't know that she's totally backing 'handbag economics', but Annalise Dodds has set out her stall, which does include investment in infrastructure and the Green economy (I'd have to look up her speech to detail more). But she's also talking about balancing the economy, which is worrying. Restraining public spending to 'balance' the economy is a growth killer.

But, on the other hand, talk of spending is pounced on by the media and the LP has a dreadful, media induced, spend, spend, spend, reputation. There was so much fuss over the 2019 manifesto and 'how are you going to pay for it?'. I think that the LP has to be cautious bout their spending plans.

Of course, the current pandemic has shown that there really is no limit on how much a government can spend, even though much of their spending has gone into the pockets of their cronies and donors. (and wars seem to produce the same sudden release from tightly controlled spending...) I wonder if people will will think about that come the next GE?

I think a large number of GNers benefited from the post war spending and I wonder why so many people were against the LP manifesto in 2019. Looking back at that, the Tories are now taking some of the LP's ideas for their own use. Johnson has been pledging to kick start the economy, to take on more nurses and police and the latest, is to make the NHS secure and to stop the NHS having to put contracts out to tender to the private sector. I haven't seen or heard anybody criticsing this policy and asking where the money will come from.

Improving the public sector will create jobs thereby putting money back into the system and helping to grow the economy. Johnson has talked about greening the economy but I'm not sure how the plans for a new coal field in Cumbria will help this. I thought that we were supposed to be moving away from fossil fuels.

Dinahmo There's already plenty of criticism of the latest plans for the NHS. It's not what it seems to be. There are already plans to cut the number of A & E centres and have fewer general hospitals. It's a way of centralising control of the NHS, so that there are fewer obstacles to cuts. The GP service is also about to be slashed with more online. remote consultations. Beware of the spin!

No extra money will be needed. We'll have a skeleton NHS, which will force people to pay privately for the services they're used to now.

growstuff

Dinahmo There's already plenty of criticism of the latest plans for the NHS. It's not what it seems to be. There are already plans to cut the number of A & E centres and have fewer general hospitals. It's a way of centralising control of the NHS, so that there are fewer obstacles to cuts. The GP service is also about to be slashed with more online. remote consultations. Beware of the spin!

Can you point me to anything I can read on this Growstuff? Changes may be necessary but this is not a government I would turn my back on at any point so would like to be prepared if they are about to turn the NHS into something akin to the American system.

I am aware of the spin. As far as I'm concerned everything Johnson says is either a downright lie or a promise never intended to be kept.

I am surprised that he is back at the top of the polls now.

I should have known Dinahmo. The man couldn't lie straight in bed. But no, there I was thinking "this sounds better" but there is always another agenda with this lot of Tories isn't there.

I think it's really the vaccine that's at the top of the polls. That could change.