The Capitol Riots, how on earth did they happen?

Just watched the footage on Al Jazeera- that mob was brutal. the disorganisation in there was obvious but those vandals meant business and were intent on getting in with brute force. Luckily, they didn't succeed in their occupation but it was a real lesson to the American people. Democracy is fragile and has to be cared for.

I’m sure some of the people defending the Capitol were pro Trump. Haven’t some of them lost their jobs because of it. It’ll be a travesty of justice if Trump isn’t impeached over this.

Agree with you Maybee but I bet he gets away with it or at least it will be in name only and he will escape without penalties. Odious man.

The worrying thing is, no matter what happens to Trump now, America has thousands of angry, violent people who are prepared to go to extreme lengths to support him, whether he's in a position of power or not. The organisation for such levels of violence and aggression hasn't gone away and, as the footage of that film said, January 6th wasn't the end of it; it was just the beginning. Trump is the most dangerous man on earth imo.

Politics in the US is far more polarized than the UK, Republicans really do hate the Democrats and vice versa . What the Republicans are complaining about is that a large increase in postal voting was introduced at this election which benefited the Democrats, security of votes and verification was disputed. Then Trump addressed a fairly small rally that were already angry and told them to fight for what they believed in, which they took literally.

It’s the culmination of a turbulent presidency Trump is no statesman and used subversion throughout his term. Thankfully no long term serious harm has taken place, he has not started a war or collapsed the economy, only the hardline red necks will mourn “the Donald”.

Hope we have seen the end of it but as chewbacca says, there are a lot of angry people there. I’d be quite nervous if I lived in one of those Southern states.

I read that the Capitol Guard was instructed not to be armed, wear riot gear or deploy extra forces. The 'justification' was that they'd gone too far in policing BLM protests.

I'll try to find a source for this.

Yes I was puzzled by the poor response from the security services MaizieD. They were aware of the unrest so should have been prepared. Does make one question why.

Trump was still in charge. And given that he’d been encouraging his supporters to ‘fight, or you won’t have a country any more....’

Łthose poor policemen. Just watched some if the footage. Terrifying!

Trump really hoped and believed that this riot would result in him being kept on as President with a coup. He is totally insane, and believes that he is some sort of god= (I call it Roman Emperor syndrome).
Problem is that he has somehow convinced so many of the his beloved 'uneducated' American citizen to believe him.
It s very, very frightening, and really shows how very fragile our so-called democracties are.

We sleepwalk into these things because we don't believe people will behave in this way.

So far we have handed over a great deal of parliamentory democracy and we appear to be going to allow our NHS to be decimated.

I would be screaming "let me out of here" but no one would be listening. After all, Johnson could not behave like Trump, could he? [ironic smile]

MaizieD

I read that the Capitol Guard was instructed not to be armed, wear riot gear or deploy extra forces. The 'justification' was that they'd gone too far in policing BLM protests.

I'll try to find a source for this.

The official copy of this memo is online but I couldn’t copy it. It was issued 48 hours before the storming of The Capitol.

Issued by Christopher Miller the memo approved the use of only 340 National Guard soldiers and imposed extraordinary limitations. It stated:

“This memorandum responds directly to your January 4, 2021 memorandum regarding the District of Columbia request for District of Columbia National Guard (DCNG) support in response to planned demonstrations from January 5-6, 2021. You are authorized to approve the requested support, subject to my guidance below and subject to consultation with the Attorney General, as required by Executive Order 11485.

Without my subsequent, personal authorization, the DCNG is not authorized the following:

* To be issued weapons, ammunition, bayonets, batons, riot control agents or ballistic protection equipment such as helmets and body armor.

* To interact physically with protesters, except when necessary in self-defense or defense of others.

* Prohibited from sharing “equipment with law enforcement agencies” or seeking support from any non-DC National Guard units.

* Forbidden from conducting “searches, seizures, arrests, or other similar direct law enforcement activity.”

* Forbidden from using “Intelligence, Surveillance, and Reconnaissance assets” or to conduct “Incident, Awareness and Assessment activities.”

* No helicopters or “any other air assets.”

And the fact that there were difficulties in calling in more members of The National Guard exacerbated the problem. It’s a wonder many more didn’t die.

The reason the vast majority of Republican Senators will vote against conviction is because of the power of Trumpism amongst their voters. Vote against Trump and risk losing your seat at the next elections ( and maybe risk physical danger as well - look what happened to Lindsey Graham). It’s nothing to do with whether Trump is guilty of encouraging insurrection.

They’re also scared for their own personal safety. Of course they know that if they don’t vote to impeach him the democrats don’t pose a threat to that. Which sums it all up really.

To be really accurate, he has been impeached ( as was Clinton) the Senate vote is about conviction. Trump will remain a twice impeached President #watcheslotsofCNN

Not many Republican Senators are going to vote Trump guilty, they are not going to antagonize their voters, Trump is now history, he is out of office and will never be in a position of power again. Impeaching him is just a political statement by the Democrats, it would probably have been more effective to simply charge him with inciting a riot.

There was never any question of a coup, there have been much greater crises over the years, the rule of law has prevailed, as it will in the UK

There wasn’t a coup because it didn’t succeeed.The intention was there. It had been planned for weeks.

Katie59

Not many Republican Senators are going to vote Trump guilty, they are not going to antagonize their voters, Trump is now history, he is out of office and will never be in a position of power again. Impeaching him is just a political statement by the Democrats, it would probably have been more effective to simply charge him with inciting a riot.

There was never any question of a coup, there have been much greater crises over the years, the rule of law has prevailed, as it will in the UK

They have impeached him and he is charged with incitement of insurrection. Imo that is the right thing to do if only for the history books - it’s much more than a political statement - it’s a statement of the truly egregious nature of his behaviour on 6 January. Sometimes ( and not often enough in politics) people do the right thing even if they know they won’t win because sending the message is what matters. If he really were history however,I don’t see he would have most Republican senators supporting him. Imo he’s still therefore got enormous power even if he doesn’t hold office again.

Thankyou, Jane43

he is out of office and will never be in a position of power again.

Is that certain?

I thought that the only way he could be absolutely an irrevocably banned from taking public office was by being found guilty in this trial?

Yes Maizie you are right. If he were found guilty he couldn’t even stand for his local school board. But as we know .....

We definitely haven’t seen the last of Donal Trump and his power games. In the unlikely event of him being found guilty in the current trial the senate would have to have a further motion that would prevent him from holding office again and that would have to be voted on.

Having seen the first episode of Trump Takes On The World on BBC last night the prospect of him being a world leader again is truly frightening. They constantly referred to the advisors who tried to counsel him out of doing stupid things like withdrawing from NATO were referred to as ‘the adults in the room’. When speaking to Macron he called Teresa May and Angela Merkel ‘losers’ and at a G7 meeting about gender equality he turned up 20 minutes late.

I agree that many of the Republican senators fear losing voters who are Trump supporters and also fear for their safety and the safety of their families but sometimes you have to put such concerns aside and do what is morally right. Look at the way Georgia Secretary Of State Raffensberger, a Republican, resisted Trump’s intimidating phone call about the election results in Georgia. Subsequently he had people demonstrating outside his house, he received abusive online messages and even texts and his wife of many years received disgusting, threatening texts of a sexual nature.

I still don’t get how those rioters were able to break into the Capitol building in one of the most security sensitive countries in the world

They could not have got in if the security guards had doen their job properly.