Petrol queues reported now on BBC news

vegansrock

Maybe all those people just getting on with their lives oblivious to the news manage to avoid huge energy price rises, shortages of petrol or medicines, collapse in the supply chain, difficulties in getting a doctors’ appointment or nhs queues, nowhere to get support for an elderly relative or a family member with a mental health crisis, - no they just “get on with their lives” - do they never wonder or question how such things occur?

We can question how such things occur vegansrock but when it comes down to it we do just have to get on with our lives because at this moment in time there is no choice on that
The country did have a choice back in 2019 and regardless of the rights or wrongs of the fptp system (it’s been there a while) they made that decision.
Should we blame the Conservatives for winning or the opposition for failing miserably

We 'really not allowed to blame anybody, I've been told. Nobody's to blame. Just one of those things. Could have happened to anybody.

We certainly mustn't blame those people who voted an incompetent PM and a gang of useless ministers into power. No no, nobody's fault.

Alegrias1

We 'really not allowed to blame anybody, I've been told. Nobody's to blame. Just one of those things. Could have happened to anybody.

We certainly mustn't blame those people who voted an incompetent PM and a gang of useless ministers into power. No no, nobody's fault.

What would be achieved by blaming them anything?

I've already got into a discussion about the word "blame" on another thread, so I'm going to avoid that.

Much as the people who voted this Government into power with such a large majority, have avoided taking any responsibility for putting the worst government in my memory into power, by saying "oh the other guys were worse" or " Get Brexit Done" or some other platitude.

We're not allowed to say that the people who voted for Brexit didn't know what they voted for, that's implying that they are politically ignorant, so not allowed. So equally, we can't say that the people who voted Tory didn't know that this government would take us to the brink of disaster, then go our of their way to make it worse.

If by "blaming" those who voted this lot into power, they realise that their actions have consequences and that they are the ones responsible, we'll have achieved something.

Lincslass

varian

Why should any of you be rejoicing when you can access petrol - something which was freely available before the brexit nonsense devasted our country?.

Petrol crisis: How an extra five litres of petrol helped cause the country to grind to a halt
'Just-in-time' supply chains can help keep costs down, but a sudden upsurge in demand can leave them unable to cope, leading to shortages.

This is the article Lincslass refered to.

Out of their way

My typing is getting worse.

Alegrias1

I've already got into a discussion about the word "blame" on another thread, so I'm going to avoid that.

Much as the people who voted this Government into power with such a large majority, have avoided taking any responsibility for putting the worst government in my memory into power, by saying "oh the other guys were worse" or " Get Brexit Done" or some other platitude.

We're not allowed to say that the people who voted for Brexit didn't know what they voted for, that's implying that they are politically ignorant, so not allowed. So equally, we can't say that the people who voted Tory didn't know that this government would take us to the brink of disaster, then go our of their way to make it worse.

If by "blaming" those who voted this lot into power, they realise that their actions have consequences and that they are the ones responsible, we'll have achieved something.

I voted Conservative.

Our constituency MP (Conservative) is currently battling the Government on behalf of us constituents regarding an extremely contentious planning issue. If they/we win I will vote for them again. (The opposition candidates were conspicuous by their absence during the pre election campaign)

If blaming me makes anyone feel better about themselves, feel free…

Would you vote for him again if it was clear he constantly voted against his conscience and yours?

But surely the picture is bigger than what is happening at a local level?

PippaZ

Would you vote for him again if it was clear he constantly voted against his conscience and yours?

Good question.

I have in the past put local issues upper and foremost, this MP has fought tooth and nail for our local issues.
I will make up my mind depending on a mixture of the above and their voting record.

Actually my point was not about blaming individual citizens for their vote I don’t believe that would achieve anything you might get a few to change their minds but on the whole people don’t like being told what they should think or do
My point was about holding the only viable party that could have won the election in 2019 to account why did they fail so badly leaving many of their supporters to vote blue

GG13 makes a good point; I'm sorry if this seems like backtracking or protecting myself, but I have said before that voting Tory and supporting Tory values is an honourable position.

So what does a person like that do when faced with the prospect of the current government? The current government which is intent of ruining any gains this country has made in the last few decades, just to make themselves look big and clever? If the values shown by the current government must now be considered "Tory values", then who in all conscience can vote for them, except people who think they are doing the right thing?

Whitewavemark2

But surely the picture is bigger than what is happening at a local level?

The local issue is massive for all local residents.
As I said above, I will make up my mind nearer the time taking all things into consideration however, the opposition really need to U.K. their game when choosing candidates, a knowledge of local issues and be seen out and about.

* U.K. should be up ?

With devolution and the transfer of powers and funding from national to local government, I can see why you would feel that about voting for local government. Such devolution is something Johnson approves and has said we should have more of in England.

However, this changes the position of the MP in parliament. So I would ask again. Would you vote for him again if it was clear he constantly voted against his conscience and yours?

My point was about holding the only viable party that could have won the election in 2019 to account why did they fail so badly leaving many of their supporters to vote blue.

This is an excuse, I think. The move from voting labour to voting conservative led to a huge, unassailable majority. I think it was as much to do with "getting Brexit done" and Johnson's personality as it was an anti-Corbyn vote. My personal opinion, could be wrong. It was probably a perfect storm.

However the willingness of people to switch to a right wing, Tory vote when they had never done so before, without really understanding the consequences, is what got us where we are. Labour might not have won, but we could have avoided the huge majority. (Sorry, that might be blaming...)

PippaZ

With devolution and the transfer of powers and funding from national to local government, I can see why you would feel that about voting for local government. Such devolution is something Johnson approves and has said we should have more of in England.

However, this changes the position of the MP in parliament. So I would ask again. Would you vote for him again if it was clear he constantly voted against his conscience and yours?

I will make up my mind when the election is called.

As I have said previously my decision will be multifaceted, I do look at their voting record, if powers are going to become more devolved that also will be taken into consideration.

One thing I know for definite is that I will not vote for a faceless opposition candidate just because they are the opposition . They will need to have done their local homework and be opposed to the planning proposals. If they are for the proposals I would have to see a guaranteed plan of upgrades to local infrastructure.

(I very nearly voted for Tony Blair, thank goodness I haven’t got that on my conscience, I would never be able to look our AC in the eyes)

I don't want this to start to be a pile on GG13. But at what point would the potential effects on the whole country of having an extreme and incompetent government in power, overwhelm the fact that your local guy doesn't have an agreed, costed and detailed plan for your town?

I mean, there might be a pandemic and then your local guy's guarantees could be unachieveable....

Alegrias1

I don't want this to start to be a pile on GG13. But at what point would the potential effects on the whole country of having an extreme and incompetent government in power, overwhelm the fact that your local guy doesn't have an agreed, costed and detailed plan for your town?

I mean, there might be a pandemic and then your local guy's guarantees could be unachieveable....

I totally get what you are saying, I am not a fan of Mr.Johnson, I am rather underwhelmed by many things the Government are doing or not doing…

Unfortunately I have yet to see anything inspiring from the opposition, to much fighting between the die hards and the more centrist members who might have a chance of being elected or at the very least slashing the Governments majority and being in a position of having more sway/power in Westminster.

As I have posted repeatedly I will make my decision at election time, taking many things into consideration. I agree it is a dilemma, difficult to unseat an MP who works tireless for their constituency.

Lib Dems?

Green Party?

Monster Raving Loony?

Other candidates are available.

Alegrias1

Lib Dems?

Green Party?

Monster Raving Loony?

Other candidates are available.

Unfortunately all those would be a wasted vote in our constituency ??

I firmly believe that no votes are wasted. Vote for the best person for the job. As long as we say that its not worth voting for that person because they'll never win, then they'll never win, will they.

We have Green politicians in government in Scotland. Irrespective of whether or not you think that's a good idea, voting for the person/party you want to win can have its effects.

Alegrias1

I firmly believe that no votes are wasted. Vote for the best person for the job. As long as we say that its not worth voting for that person because they'll never win, then they'll never win, will they.

We have Green politicians in government in Scotland. Irrespective of whether or not you think that's a good idea, voting for the person/party you want to win can have its effects.

Vote for the best person for the job (Our constituency MP)

That is what I did Alegrias1 difficult to oust someone due to the actions of their boss and no one can tell for certain who will be the leader of the Conservatives at the time of the next election nor the leader of any other party.

Alegrias1

I firmly believe that no votes are wasted. Vote for the best person for the job. As long as we say that its not worth voting for that person because they'll never win, then they'll never win, will they.

We have Green politicians in government in Scotland. Irrespective of whether or not you think that's a good idea, voting for the person/party you want to win can have its effects.

There's another way votes are not wasted.

Parties receive "short money" which correlates with the number of votes cast. It's a major source of income for LibDems and Greens, neither of whom have the number of seats which represents the number of voters.

growstuff

Alegrias1

I firmly believe that no votes are wasted. Vote for the best person for the job. As long as we say that its not worth voting for that person because they'll never win, then they'll never win, will they.

We have Green politicians in government in Scotland. Irrespective of whether or not you think that's a good idea, voting for the person/party you want to win can have its effects.

There's another way votes are not wasted.

Parties receive "short money" which correlates with the number of votes cast. It's a major source of income for LibDems and Greens, neither of whom have the number of seats which represents the number of voters.

That’s true. I’d forgotten that.