elderly in hospital

The link has been sent to my MP. My mother is now terrified of going into hospital - reckons it is the "Workhouse for the old, kill them off asap as we are worthless" What sort of society have we got if this is the way going into hospital is viewed.

My elderly sister-in-law went into a local home for a few weeks respite whilst my brother went into hospital for an operation. It was the start of her demise. After falling several times resulting in sprains and finally a broken ankle, she succumed to the trauma of it all and died. Dealing with the multi layered socialwork, medical and careworker staff was an eye opener to the inefficiency of many of them, the same old 'one hand didn't know what the other was doing' scenario. Falls seem to account for a large number of deaths in the elderly whether it be in care homes or hospitals. As with all other in-care horror stories it is time we of the 'healthy' older generation stopped 'talking the talk' and started 'walking the walk'. We have tremendous voting power which I believe isn't utilised to the full. I know there are organisations dealing with elderly issues but the same old grievences seem to trundle on year in year out 'nay, decade in decade out' without change. Will it finally take 'us Grannies' to roll up our sleeves and sort out this mess? I think if we put our minds to it we could do it with one hand tied behind our backs, don't y'all ??

Hi sixtiesgirl and hi there RAF. Glad to see that other people have started harassing their MPs.
Do you all know about the site WritetoThem which is very easy and quick to use.
I have been thinking about why we, the great British public, seem to feel rather powerless these days. Do you think it is an aftermath of thatcherism? I think the babyboomer generation, currently in the process of retiring, could be a force to be reckoned with if we did but realise it.

I have recently retired [big big thanks to Gransnet who I have found invaluable] Reading through this forum and reading of people's experiences of how elderly people are being treated in hospitals, care homes and services is truly appalling. Surely those people responsible for treating anyone in hospital without respect and care should be named and shamed. We have just returned from caring for my mother in law who had a fall just a day before her 100th birthday. There are of course no books written to prepare you for this very emotional time. What else can be done?

I've finally sent my MP an email and the gransnet link and in his encouraging letter of support he tells me that he has tabled and Early Day Motion in parliament suggesting the appointment of a Minister ofr Older People and so far 79 MPs have signed it. He says the Governement has refused to take action but Ed Miliband has appointed a Shadow Minister for Care and Older Peole who attends the meetings of the Shadow Cabinet.

Also...thanks Geraldine for your article in the Independent last week which I welcomed so much especially since you made the point very forcibly that old people are loathed and if we treated children in schools like we treat old people in Care homes and Hospitals what an outcry there would be. I heard or read someone saying we need a campaign like Children in Need to heighten awareness, and Elderlyline, like Childline. I'd like us to take to the streets....tomorrow it's outrage about pensions......what about a bit more outrage about pensioners??

Meanwhile I will personally try not to obsess about whether to dye my hair, buy age-defying creams! I'm only 61, but you know, I feel sometimes as if I should apologise for blighting the landscape with my saggy face. it's pernicious as you said Geraldine, this sense that old = ugly so please don't spoil my day having to look at the evidence that youth doesn't last. Actually, lets take great pleasure in terrorising the youth!! Rampage through Boots to upturn all the shelves of anti-ageing creams anyone?? I've just got to make an appointment at hairdressers first for my Christmas Colour tho, so will meet you after that!

Yes, I had a reply from my MP Paul Goggins, to the same effect. I think we are gradually starting to muster strength and Gransnet could prove to be a force to be reckoned with, rather than a benign organisation like AGE UK who don't appear to put enough 'oomph' into the cause, unless someone knows differently?

In all fairness Age Cymru did sterling work in Cardiff a couple of weeks ago organising a rally to make public toilets in Wales a legal requirement. I was there with my banner on TV to prove it As a representative of two organisations in which toilets play an important part I've been asked to provide written 'evidence', so don't judge too harshly. Has anyone contacted Age UK for their stance on the subject of elderly in hospital?

Having recently retired from 45 years nursing I can totally and honestly agree with fellow nurses that nursing has steadily gone downhill. since the powers that be thought it was a good idea to train nurses in university, there is no bedside nursing,how can you have observational skills when you sit at a computor to 'manage your patients'. you are allowed to mentor student nurse but they are supernumary and do not handle any patient care. Please don't suggest bringing back Matron,they are managers and nothing else.. I am afraid the days of real nursing have gone.The only people who now are listened to in hospitals are P A L S (patient advise liason service ). I have had a fulfilling career but nursing is not what it used to be and it saddens me greatly

It is so sad anniegrannie that nursing has come to this. It was my chosen career and I loved my job but I could not work in the NHS now. We were taught in the classroom in PTS and we had lectures all the way through training but the greatest knowledge was gained at the patient's bedside whilst watching more senior staff carry out procedures.

My son is currently traing to be a mental health nurse, but has been doing general nursing placements in his first two years, and he has reported giving very hands on care and support with patients on kidney wards and A and E in his last two placements, which he really enjoyed. I wonder how come student nurses get to give such close care to patients but not so much when qualified?

I find it worrying anniegrannie if the PALS are the only people being listened too. I have occasional contact with our local one and the people are lovely but rather ineffectual.

The hospital managers would be much better to talk to the families of the older people in hospital who are presumably fairly mature themselves and are more likely to have a reasonable take on the dire state of care for the elderly.

Carol, my daughter said the student nurses were great when she was in hospital, treated her with respect, made eye contact and tried to help in anyway they could. Perhaps they become jaded and worn out over time or.....can of worms coming up......they don't have young families draining their energy levels before they even get to work......or does the system just slowly grind them down and burn them out? And to think they will have to work until they are nearly 70!!! The elderly will be nursing the elderly. I feel a sit -com coming on!

My MP has responded again and sent me a detailed reply to my concerns from Paul Burstow Minister for Care Services. Things seem to be happening but actions speak louder than words of course ,but I feel quite heartened as my MP Iain Wright has certainly taken up the cudgel.

Now I'll go and see what all those on the I Hate Christmas V I love Christmas forums are up to! Then Carol Singing gransnetters on Wednesday.
This site really is great. Gonna try a smiley now

That smiley has really cheered me up. Sad life you know

I am now so very cynical as life has taught me to be. I think that the treatment of the elderly, in particular, in hospitals is to encourage them to welcome euthanasia. This option is being actively encouraged now by some very outspoken and well known people.

The baby boomers are a drain on the nation 'they say'. The elderly do not contribute to society 'they say'. Life expectancy is at its hightest ever 'they say'.

Most people have such a short stay in hospital these days that they would rather say nothing of the treatment they have received and just try to put it behind them. I have spent one night on three separate occasions in hospital in the last few months and it was only on the third occasion that I took the time and trouble to write a letter of complaint. When I received a reply, following a lengthy investigation, it was to the effect that it was an overflow ward, had all new staff, and the matron had been informed of my concerns.

She apologised that I had had a 'negative experience' - not the word I would have chosen.

The bottom line is that they do not care. Any and everything is ruled by money. The worse that the National Health Service is allowed to become the more the businesses can earn/make out of the sick.

I have not read all of the messages on this forum and may be repeating information you already have but has anyone thought of asking if this is a campaign that www.38degrees.org.uk would take up?

There is an article in the Daily Mail today about a granddaughter who nursed her grandmother back to health. The hospital staff told the relatives she was dying and they should say their goodbyes. GD was having none of it and slept on the floor and fed her and gave her fluids. This lady, who was written off by the NHS is now back at home with her DH.

Message deleted by Gransnet.

I agree wholeheartedly with all that has been said. Unfortunately this disgraceful non-caring attitude is not new. My mother died 10 years ago now and my sister and I had to fight every step of the way. The hospital care was appalling and degrading. Just one example my mother could neither speak nor move and was fed through a tube. She broke her hip whilst in hospital (thats another story) the Dr prescribed pain killers to be give on request. We had to fight to see the doctor concerned and when we asked how my mother was supposed to indicated that she needed pain killers he had no answer. We demanded painkillers to be given throughout the day just in case she was in pain. His answer was that they were addictive. The condition she was in did it really matter, would she live long enough to get addicted. Then he prescribed solid tablets OMG SHE WAS FED THROUGH A TUBE what was the matter with them. At that point I really wanted to hit him. We did finally get what we wanted. All I can say is god help any elderly person who has no relatives to speak up for them. This story has a good ending she was transferred to an intensive care Care Home paid for my the NHS. It was a wonderful place and the care was second to none. There are good people out there, we just need more of them.

I am increasingly angy at the stories I read in the press regarding the current state of the NHS. I have just read the thread on Gransnet and already signed the TWG petition. What the hell has happened to the health service? As a recipient years ago of general surgery, (at least three ops); I received the best care ever. Now as I enter my middle 60s I dread the thought of going into hospital. I am fed up reading and hearing about individuals not receiving appropriate care and compassion. The stories about our NHS would disgrace a third world country, and whilst I have absolutely no doubt many hospitals and NHS staff are doing a wonderful job it is shameful that first hand accounts of poor and sloppy treatment are so common.

I wrote to my MP here in Cornwall, and though I have not received a reply directly from her I have received a notification from her office that, with my permission, they would like to direct the following to our Gransnet thread on the subject of care of our elderly in - and out - of hospital.:

Adult Social Care within Cornwall, the Chief Executive of Cornwall and Isles of Scilly PCT and also the Health Minister.

This is a bit of positive news, especially with the live webchat with Paul Burstow coming up on 1 March.

We are making our voice heard.

By the way, if you want to contact your MP below is a great website through which to do this. And....they come back to check after a fortnight to see if you've had a response!

www.writetothem.com/about-contact

Get lobbying ladies....Go Gransnet.

Carosanto

Having read all of these stories & having commented on this very subject in a different thread?
I notice one thread running through them all, that allmost with out exception no one has complained officially in writing, with a copy to their MP.
Take it from me it makes a world of difference, I used this to complain over my wifes appalling treatment in a modern hospital, & my son used it to coplain over mine much later.
Words mean nothing in one ear & out of the other, the written word ah thats different, register it get a signature, show you mean business.
Hand wringing will get you no where, if enough do it eventually it will alter, the system will never be perfect, but it will get better.
IF by some chance you get no result send it to your local paper, & then on to all the dailys, MPs do not like being asscosiated with that sort of publicity.
A word of warning double check your facts'
Go on try it.

I don't want to be curt with you smike but I do think you might have missed some of the postings and threads that show exactly what Gransnetters have done to get some changes.

smike have you read the post directly above yours?

I am new to gransnet so have been wandering round loking at different topics. The correspondane re hospital care etc has outraged and hoorified me.
I trained as a nurse in the 60's. Florence Nightingale wards meant that we observed every patient as we worked on the ward. We had bed pan rounds, back rounds. Checking fluid intake and of course 'have you been today?' recorded in a bowel book!
Patients stayed in hospital much longer so wewere able to get to know our patients. Sadly because of the fast turnover this is no longer possible.

Gradually nursing began to move towards academia. They did not want to be 'doctors handmaids' but recognised and validated as professional. Training moved out of nursing school and on the wards into university.

What has happened is as a result of this.
Whilst not denying that there are many dedicated nurses, the correspondance shows there are too many bad ones. I can site the treatment of my husband and of my mother, at which I complained.

Nurses seem to think it is beneath them to see that a patient is given food and water and is kept comfortable.

Prthaps they should no longer be called nurses. Some other name perhaps not naughty ones!

Alone we can do nothing, united we could probably be listened to. I see the Daily Mail is doing its best. We need to shout loud and clear. We need to speak to the Prime Minister. It is not a question of money. Its returning to the caring attitude instilled by the teaching of Florence Nightingale. We need to rally round for the sake of thoose who can't speak up for themselves because one day it will be our turn.
Life is becoming increasingly difficult for the elderly. They are being marginalised and sidelined. Treated as a nuisance instead of being respected.

How can we go ahead?