B****y dogs

That's interesting Nightowl as we only know the dogs in our lives - our own, our friends' and family dogs.

Having said all this about children not being 'part of the pack' there are many, many foster carers who have dogs which cope admirably with different children coming in and out of their lives. The dogs are subject to assessment from the very start, but I have assessed families with German Shepherds, Rottweilers, and the much maligned Staffies, all of which have gone on to live with strange children and be an important part of those children's lives. I would go so far as to say that the right dog has sometimes been a lifeline to a child who has had damaging and dysfunctional relationships and has learnt to relate to the dog before building trust with adults. So I guess this brings us back to the starting point which is good owners make good dogs, whereas bad owners can do the opposite.

Each to his own Jane! I couldn't stand it - your description makes me cringe!!

Oh luckygirl I too used to do lots of home visits and particularly enjoyed meeting peoples pets! Many a time I've taken notes with a large creature on my knee. I specially liked it when Border Collies sat next to me and leaned the way they do. I'm a cat person really and lost count of the times I'd be told that the family cat wasn't friendly only for said pet to climb all over me purring. Typical contrary cats!

Dogs do get jealous if they're treated like baby substitutes for years and then their owners have children. The happiest dog is a dog that's treated like a dog and knows it's a dog.

And I do think that training and socialising a dog which might have aggressive tendencies is best left to fitter younger people.

Oh dear - I really am so anti-dog. Sorry to all those dog lovers out there, but from my point of view they are a b****y nuisance and a potential danger. I know that some people adore their dogs; but many dog lovers do need to understand that there are those who do not share their views and who are sick and tired of being told "Oh- he's just being friendly" when he humps your leg, licks your face (yuk), covers you in mud, knocks your GD over...... etc. I have very poor balance and hate it when dogs are jumping around.

I cannot bear it when these poor children get mauled by these wretched dogs - it just makes me sick.

I speak as a social worker who did a lot of home visiting and has had it up to here with the wretched things - one even lifted its leg and pissed in my handbag!

I used to contact people before I visited and tell them that I expected them to shut their dogs of of the way when I visited.

Why should other people have to be hassled by other people's pets?

My Sis-IL used to expect us to have her dog in the house when she came to stay - I just said No Way! And would happily have paid for kennels in order to avoid a dog in the house.

Sorry again to the dog lovers - I am sure you are lovely people - it's just your blooming dogs that I don't like!

Jealousy and confusion can be a lethal combination. Dogs understandably get jealous if their adored owner lavishes attention on something or someone else. If they are well trained and confident they are less likely to feel insecure which can have awful consequences.

We are shocked when we hear of these tragedies but we must remember that many dogs are loving and gentle around small children.

I said the same to DH tonight. Grandparents dogs again. Mind you, we knew someone a few years ago who had a Labrador which had been her dog at home. She took the dog with her when she married. The dog was old and placid. The lady had a child and one day when the little girl was about 18 months old the lady was hanging washing out and heard a terrible scream. The dog had the child's face in its mouth. The little girl was scarred for life. I think maybe dogs get jealous.

I guess that it's a combination of so many grandparents looking after their grandchildren and the child not being part of 'their pack' and is probably regarded as subordinate and a threat to their food. My friends child was bitten on the face by a bulldog . I suppose that these breeds go for the throat [other than, say, terriers that are more likely to nip at legs and heels]. Whatever the reason, it's still tragic

And why does it seem to be lately that it's the grandparent's dogs?

I do think the breed is important though and any dog bred to 'lock on' will not let go once it does attack.

Poor little lass

Another poor child in the news today having had her face ripped apart by a Staffordshire bull terrier. What is the matter with people?

Tricia your parent's Border Terrier was not 'under control' by the sounds of it. If the child was walking past the house where was the dog? Loose in the front garden? Did the child come into the front or was there a gate open?

It's easy to say 'dog are unpredictable' (so are humans) but some kind of control must have broken down for the dog to have been able to bite a child under those circumstances. And that control rested with its humans. It sounds like another irresponsible owner.

As for telling a 'little fib' - I think you mean lying bramble to make the child's reaction to the regrettable incident sound worse than it is? Why not say it as it is, that this irresponsible dog owner needs to either put her apparently unmanageable beast on a lead or get off her backside and train it to behave.

Lucky girl. I had a thought. It might be an idea to leave matters for a few days then have a,chat with your neighbour explaining that your gd had been screaming with nightmares after the incident. A little fib i know but who cares. After all a large dog to a child must seem like the size a horse would be to an adult. You could gently say that maybe other parents would report the dog. It should make her realise that when dogs are not on a lead anything could happen. She might even thank you for this!!!

"Any animal can suddenlt bite" -
My parents had a border terrier which bit a little girl on the face as she was walking past the house.
It was an awful situation - Dad had the dog put to sleep. Not sure how badly the child was wounded as I was living away at the time.
Dogs are unpredictable, however well trained or apparently placid.

A friend of mine worked with Canine Partners, training dogs to help people with mobility problems. Maybe there is a group in your area Luckygirl and if so, they sometimes hold coffee mornings or show training sessions. Might be worth taking your little gd along to see them? Good luck.
I often take my Gd to a park and hate seeing dogs running loose around the place, not under control. I don't like to let GD run ahead because of this and keep her close by me.
Although I am a cat lover and have always had cats, I also teach Gd not to stroke cats unless a grown up has first, and shown her how to give a small gentle stroke. Any animal can suddenly bite.

PAT dog helps child

Seriously though, there are good, calm dogs about and if you are serious about helping your GD get over this quickly, you'd do well to seek one out.

My old fellow was a PAT before he retired due to age and bad breath and some PAT dogs are used to help little ones get over their fear of dogs.

Ah yes - maybe that is what I need - a toothless dog!

Wash your mouth out lucky my old fellow is child proof and besides he has hardly any teeth left. His bark is pretty pathetic but he does an impressive snore.

Is there such a thing?! I always find that little dogs are worse than big ones - yappy and go for your ankles!

Introduce her to a small, fluffy, quiet little dog

DD tells me that little GD heard a dog bark today and ran to her Mum to be lifted up. How long will it take I wonder for her to get over this incident? It does make me cross.

Oh spare me having every word nit-picked.

Just a wine addled thought.....they are Irresponsible people full-stop...who just happen to have a dog. Using the term 'Irresponsible dog-owner' somehow muddies the water. People who 'own' a badly trained dog that is not socialised and kept in check ruin it for the rest of us. We know our dog's limitations - she was not socialised as a puppy and is a silly, hopefully never to be repeated, designer cross (Springer spaniel/Viszla) but she lives a happy life here amongst a very dog orientated and tolerant environment. We would not have considered re-homing her if we had lived in a less rural place.
At the moment she is trotting around behind her 'Daddy' a la Monty Don's Nigel whilst he mows the lawn a picture of doggy happiness. However if the average family in a typical urban setting had taken her on it would have been chaotic and quite possibly dangerous.

Owning a dog, of any sort, is a full-time job and you need to understand how a dog sees the world. Its not a four legged child or a animated cuddly toy. Its a full-blooded animal (albeit with a penchant for human company) and it has drives and instincts that are very powerful.

Dismount Soap box and pours another class of rose.