Mother's Day

olympia, I'm feeling rather sorry for your middle son who seems to be the meat in the sandwich. Where does he stand on this ridiculous ongoing rift between his brothers?

If it was me I would stop straight away having 2 of everything because it has now become the norm, no one is going to make amends whilst this situation carries on.I would write the same letter/ email to both of them and word it like you did this post and tell each of them they both have a letter and how hurt you and there father is, and add the old cliche you are not getting any younger. In the meantime do what you want on Mother's Day until you get a reply, then go from there. Let us know how you get on. I have 2 daughters so no experience of sons.

I think it's your time to please yourselves, and be more 'unavailable'.

I might be worth saying to both sons how it makes things difficult for you so they at least know your feelings, but be selfish and do what you want to do.

Great advice from mumofmadboys... tell them that is the gift you want most of all and that the pressure is making you both ill. I hope it all works out and you have the best Mother's Day xx

Oh dear. There is no simple answer to this problem.

You do not know what they fell out over. Perhaps it was something so fundamental that it cannot be mended or set aside.

I don't get on well with my brother, We haven't 'fallen out', we are just completely different people with diametrically opposed views on everything. I find him boring, bigoted and a mummy's boy, so I would rather boil my head than spend much time in his company.

I've always gone with the view that you can choose your friends but you can't choose your family.

So, either find out from them what the problem is/ was and try to mediate a way through it, or accept the situation, get on with your life, and have parties with your friends, not your family.

I feel for you so much because we are in the same position with our two boys. We have come to terms that there probably will not be a reconciliation because they lead such different lives and have very different values. It doesn't help that only one son has children because children can help to heal situations like this.

The last time we were together was my husband's 70th birthday tea at our house, nearly four years ago, and it was very awkward. It was my 70th birthday a few months later so, like you, we did two separate meals out but it broke my heart. We were also unable to celebrate our 50th wedding anniversary as a family which would have been our wish but instead of doing the two separate celebrations we went away on holiday instead. No more double celebrations for us, as you say it is exhausting.

Although I am very soft hearted I can feel my heart hardening about the situation and as they are joint executors of our will we have recently told them that we will either instruct our solicitor to act as executor, which will cost us money to change the will and will cost them money as the executor will obviously have fees which will have to be paid from the estate, or be men enough to shake hands and get on with what has to be done together. The choice is theirs as far as we are concerned.

I think it goes with the territory of having sons, as my husband says, it is usually the wife who calls the tune and we know which wife has majorly contributed to the problem, although the other one is not without fault. Things were fine when my older son was married to his first wife and we were all able to get together and have good times.

I have a friend with two sons and they were in the same position until last year when my friend was hospitalised for a while; the two wives' paths crossed at the hospital and they decided to talk things over and now they are able to socialise together which my friend is overjoyed about. So there is always hope.

Until I joined this forum I felt such a failure over the situation with our sons and the fact that we are estranged from our two oldest grandchildren, but now I realise our problems are not unique which is very comforting. Part of my heart however is broken beyond repair and it was devastating to hear my six year old grandson say recently that he didn't know his Dad had a brother. I had mentioned something we had done together when our boys were small. Similarly, he and his seven year old sister don't know they have two half sisters.

As for the way to proceed, your situation is unique and dependent on the personalities of those involved and, if there are grandchildren, whether you want to run the risk of being estranged from them. Don't do anything in haste and tread carefully but it seems very unfair that you are unable to have your say. Is there anyone other than your other son who can act as mediator?

Two old sayings come to mind:

When they are babies they break your back but when they are grown they break your heart.

A son is a son 'til he takes a wife.

I sincerely hope that things work out for the best for you and your husband.

Tell them the only gift you want for Mother's Day is to have your family be 'whole' again. If they can't give you that, there is really nothing to celebrate. Having said that, YOU shouldn't have to plan and payroll YOUR own birthday or Mother's Day celebrations (twice, no less). If they truly want to honor you on your special day, the obligation is their's, not the other way around!

Olympia your sons are adults so very much their own people and who knows what originally caused the falling out. You can choose your friends but you can't choose your family as they say.

My husband fell out with his brother about 16 years ago. He also stopped all contact with his half sister. When their mother was ill 4 years later it was very stressful as everyone did their utmost to avoid contact with one another when visiting her. Then when she died I dreaded the funeral, expecting tempers to flare, but it was almost like watching a play with the family being the actors as everyone played their part. There was utmost civility on the day, definitely not warmth by any means but not even a cross word. Afterwards there was very little contact, just what was unavoidable as her estate was sorted out.

Since then nothing, no contact whatsoever.

You should do what makes you happy. I see no problem with letting both sons know how you and your husband feel. They should be aware, why not? If it can be resolved then wonderful! But if not, then sadly that's life.

I think you should tell them how much it is upsetting you and your husband and give them the chance to think about that and hopefully realise that they really are grownups now and need to start behaving like it! If they won't then say there won't be anymore double celebrations and try to do something lovely with your husband.

Surely it's time to make it clear that this is stressing you out and not healthy. You could either
a. Choose a date for a celebration and tell them that's when it will be - no doing it twice, it's too expensive - if they want to celebrate WITH YOU then great, but it's about you not them. Whether they opt out to avoid the other family is up to them.
b. arrange a holiday for you and your husband and leave them to it.
Sadly I have to agree with others that you can't choose your relatives but you can choose your friends. If they are old enough to be grandfathers, they are old enough to choose their own friends. BUT surely once or twice a year is not asking much for them to be civil to each other. How does you third son interact with them all?

Sometimes, when elderly parents die, the sibling rivalry vanishes and the adult DC do have a truce, or even become closer.Sometimes they don't and choose not to see each other.Not all families are The Waltons.

Forget about the funeral! They will all have to attend that, and then go their separate ways and......you won't be in a position to worry about it.

Agree all the way Jaycee and have never thought that I am such a wonderful Queen Bee that my three adult children all have to get on with each other just to please me.We still see them all, just not all at once.

I had a major falling out with my sister which involved our DM but neither of us let it affect our relationship with each others' children and we were always civil to each other when we met up at parties etc. It wasn't her fault we fell out, after all (actually, on second thoughts it probably WAS her fault but she was in her 90s so was cut some slack).

It wouldn't hurt the 2 sons to put on a brave face IMO.

My thoughts were along the lines of mags1234. Same message to both sons. Tell them you don't like celebrating events twice, you did it just to 'tread water' but it's gone on so long now and nothing's changed and you're tired of their relationship impacting on your life and your choices. So, you are choosing to go to an exhibition for Mothering Sunday and their father's upcoming 70th will be celebrated with a holiday. As for future celebrations, they will happen once not twice, and they can decide whether they both come, take it in turns year and year about, or not bother. When you die there can only be one funeral, so since they'd have to make that decision then, you'd rather they made it now.

This isn't blackmail. You've accommodated their wishes for over a decade, and have now decided that you're going to put your own wishes first now, and you'd like your life simplified.

Jaycee5, I couldn't agree more.

I decided long ago that my own health and happiness were far more important to me and to DH than anything the descendants may get up to. I could have had my heart broken by things that they've done/not done, but I refuse it.

My lovely stepdaughter, and a long-term friend (who was best friend of my deceased daughter and was my matron-of-honour) are the two people who make the effort to find a Mothering Sunday card for me. Very, very much appreciated. As it's the 4th Sunday in Lent, usually there are little bunches of flowers at church which the children present to every woman there, whether she's a mother or not.

I would arrange to meet them both on Mother's Day somewhere just your sons and you, say you piece, your Mother's Day wish is that you can enjoy an event as a united family or going forward there won't be events - actually ending with the two funerals is quite a punchy thought to leave them with.

My heart breaks for you.

Olympia it is not down to you to organise Mothering Sunday/Mother's Day.
They are supposed treat you.
As for the rest I should tell them that you are fed up of walking on eggshells and are happy to visit them in their homes celebrate your husband's birthday with your one son and your friends.

rosared that is exactly it. People seem to be saying 'bang their heads together until they do what you want and play nice'. They are no longer children and insisting on them behaving in a particular way will just alienate at least one of them.
When we went out in a group my dog used to run around everyone every so often and seemed to be doing a kind of head count. Mothers seem to be a bit like that. There can be 20 family members at a gathering but mothers fret about the one that is missing. Enjoy time with the people you are with at the time. Then see others at a different time. It is not the end of the world. Better than forcing people together and making them unhappy.

Hi Olympia, I would let both sons see your posting on gransnet, as all of your bottled up feelings have been expressed, I dont think either of them are seeing it from your point of view, as it is very stressful being in the middle of it all. Enjoy a lovely break away from them all on hubbys birthday, give them food for thought.

That should be MinniesMum

Minnimies I don't care about my father as he is an abusive bully who is now bullying his wife who has Altzeimers.
I care about my mother. She is not someone who would put her own feelings before mine and expect me to do something that she knows would upset me. There comes a point in life (quite late for me) that you realise that you have to protect your own mental health and be tough if that is necessary. If my parents were the kind of people that would use emotional blackmail it wouldn't work. Parents don't have the right to tell adult children who they should have in their lives.
You don't know enough to be so judgmental although I was aware that at least one poster would be. My sister has had bullying complaints from staff at work which she thought were funny.

You must get on with your lives it's been stressful for you it seems for years. You and your h must come to an agreement that is best for you.

I have no siblings so can't really understand conflict like this but although my SIL doesn't really have much to do with her eldest brother (my husband is the middle one) - they do tolerate each other at the odd family get together so it must be very upsetting for you to have this constant rift with your sons. My main thought is not so much the here and now but what will happen when the inevitable happens one day and they have a funeral to attend. Unless one family stays away which would be devastating for whichever parent is left behind they are going to have to bite the bullet and be in the same place. How sad would that be for it to take a bereavement to mend the breach. I would ask the question of them both now - then tell them that you are too upset by the whole estrangement to arrange any more family get togethers unless they can be sensible and be civil to each other. Presumably they both have children so do they know their cousins at all? Tell them you will be going away for your husband's birthday - if they want to arrange a meal to celebrate you would be delighted but you are not hosting it yourself. You are not responsible for your children's behaviour so it's not fair that you should be feeling so upset by it all.