Mother's Day

Oh, I just saw your post about wanting them to make an effort for dh. I understand, but I don't think their rift is about you and him. You say you don't know what caused it and haven't asked and that's wise, imo. But it might be deeper than you can imagine and not something they can overlook for a day or even an afternoon. Even if they tried, there's bound to be tension, the "elephant in the room" thing. Would you and dh really want that?

If we were talking about a huge celebration like a retirement party or a wedding vow renewal, then I might think they should try to put their differences aside for the day/evening and just stay as far away from each other as possible. People do it for weddings and such all the time. But for every holiday and birthday, etc. No. If you and dh were planning a huge shindig for his birthday, then, again, yes, I could see expecting that. But otherwise, I think you both need to forget this idea. It's not likely to happen.

I haven't read all the posts yet, but my first reaction is that I don't see the big deal. Yes, I know it hurts to see your dss (dear sons) so at odd with each other, and I'm sorry if you find having 2 events so stressful. But perhaps you could work it out so you and dh don't always have to be the hosts or make the plans? If your dss and their families can't see fit to take the bull by the horn themselves for some events, then that's a different matter.

I also don't see anything wrong with alternating holidays, etc - Christmas with elder ds, for example, Mother's Day with younger ds and so on. Mds would get to be at everything, but that's because no one has any issues with him.

That doesn't mean I think you have to do these things for every event. By all means, go away for dh's birthday if you want to. Your dss can still call him or send cards and gifts.

I just don't think the whole family has to be together for events. That's the ideal, but it can't always be. If you ask me, a lot of your stress comes from hoping that this division will come to an end. It won't. Stop hoping for it and I think you'll find things less stressful.

Floriatosca, maybe it's not an occasional token effort that they would be performing for him. If they truly hate each other it may be too difficult for them to be together. That is less reflection on DH's fathering and more on their relationship.

Thank you ican! These are my thoughts exactly. I respect their wishes and now accept they don't want to be part of each other's lives. I would be happy for them just to make an effort for our sakes. I don't expect them to fall into each other's arms but a civilised social manner would do. As you say there would be other people to chat to/sit by at special events. An additional problem is their wives have never met although I am aware the eldest son and his wife momentarily "bumped into" each other in town but nothing was ever said to me. My husband did speak at great length to our youngest son (they both went out for a drink together) and asked him to really think about the hurt that was being caused to no avail. This news distressed my husband very much. Sadly there will never be any reconciliation on his part. The subject of their father's 70th birthday will soon be discussed. I think at this point (for the first time) we will say that as it is a special "milestone" birthday we do not want to celebrate it as a divided family and will therefore not reduce it to two occasions and we will have a weekend away on our own. My husband is not well, awaiting a life changing operation and has already been told that if he has another heart attack "it will likely prove fatal". He continues to be a spectacularly good, caring and supportive father to our three sons and I know it is a bitter blow for him that they won't even make a very occasional token effort for him.

I've fallen out with my sibling and I know it breaks my Mum's heart at the rift but making peace with my sibling in order to make DM happy, it would make my DD feel betrayed by me. As soon as I realised that it was going to make everybody else unhappy, I wrote to my sibling telling her that for the sake of the everybody we loved, I would be civil at family events and I hoped she could be too. The first time we met up after the rift was the worst but it was easier after that. It takes so little to be polite and then I just gravitate towards other people to make conversation. If she joins us, I wait quietly for a while and then just see someone else I just have to talk to. My DM knows how I feel but is appreciative of the effort we make.
Is there one son who might be predisposed to reaching out and offering civility for you and your husband's sake? They don't have to love each other, they just need to respect that they are denying you the pleasure of having you family together. You never know, if the ice was broken, old grievances may disappear.

Floriatosca Good for you ...and ofcourse you should be doing what suits you just like your sons are.

Thank you Madgran - what sensible advice - and I will definitely take it. I will let each of them know the upset that is being caused but we respect their decision. I will then say they must respect our decision in not wanting to always host two sets of celebrations. Thank you so much. I just knew worldly wise advice is out there on Gransnet. I feel one (!) of the advantages of getting older is that you can see "the bigger picture" as to what is happening around you and the possible consequences of people's actions. Sometimes we just need a gentle push into a new direction. The reality is for me is that after looking after my family (siblings/parents) before I was married, then my own sons and their many varied partners/children and now grandchildren (first great grandchild on their way too) I feel it is about time I looked forward to whatever time we have left generally pleasing ourselves and perhaps this is why we feel stressed with ongoing concerns of adult "children" who should, even out of kindness, not to be still causing us concern.

Floriatosca I am glad that you have drawn your own conclusions about what you are going to do ...but I really do think your sons should be aware that this situation makes you sad. Not in anyway as emotional blackmail towards them and making it clear that they must do what is right for them . But they really should understand the impact of their actions and take responsibility for that rather than everyone just tiptoeing around it, making arrangements around it etc with no openness about how they feel!!
I speak as someone who has a daughter and son who although still speaking have some very deep lifestyle/philosophy and life choice differences that are gradually creating a wider and wider rift in terms of us all getting together. They know that I love them both, they know that even if I don't agree with them I will still love them, they know that I expect them to do what is right for them but they also know that they have to take responsibility for the impact of their differences on others. Also that I will also do what I feel is right for me, take responsibility for the impact of my choices on others and that whatever I choose has no bearing on how much I love them!

Name change didn't work OLYMPIA... Thank you for all your thoughts and suggestions - I really do appreciate them. As one GN'er said our sons do not want to be friends and I accept that now. I did not intentionally make Mothering Sunday (not Mother's Day oops!) a pivotal occasion it is just another happy family occasion like birthdays, Christmas, personal celebrations days where it would be nice to be together with loved ones. The funeral situation has long been a thought of mine. The scenario where it would be my husband's funeral and having to deal with the meeting of my sons for the first time in years would be just too much for me. I now intend to remain neutral, see each party separately and to "do our own thing" for my husband's 70th birthday. Thank you all again. gransnetters - what sensible caring people you are!

I am sorry you are in such a sad situation. Just to give the other side of this, my husband is in a similar situation, but in reverse. His brothers really dont get on with him, and it has now reached a situation where they avoid him (we are regularly missed out in family dos) There is a lot more to this than I am writing, as it is not about us, just to give a different perspective. My FIL will be ninety next year, and as we live abroad, we have thought of suggesting that we visit before or after the event, to avoid making the brothers uncomfortable at a family get together, as they clearly dont want us around (it has been made crystal clear, in so many words)
Our suggestion is to make life easy for his parents, not for our convenience. Maybe your sons have not thought about how unhappy their never meeting makes you, and think that by having separate events, they are making your life easier? As you have gone along with this all these years, they may think it is for the best in your eyes. I dont know if i have made much sense - it is early morning and i am not fully awake - but I know what i mean!

Mother's Day is for the mums raising children. I can't understanding making MD into a big do. Are the DS married, with children? Your sons can sort MD, you sort your milestone.

I Have never made a thing of Mother's Day. I list it alogside other money making events. I used to get the home made cards from Infants School of course, and they were great. Then as he got older I had a card( Bought), and a little personal present, earrings, scarf, something like that. Since he got married I get a card, end of

I would take note of your unhappiness at the situation, which is trying to tell you something. Both sons might benefit from knowing how you really feel so maybe, when you feel like the mood takes you, write explaining how the rift has made you and your husband feel. It won't hurt them to know.
Then as it's your special day, I'd go and spend it however you like. Sometimes when we show a rare streak of independence and a break from how we do things normally, it can start a welding process. I hope you enjoy a lovely Mothers day.

A mother does not enjoy observing her children at war with each other.I had to accept that my two children did not like each but I would not take sides and let them know I would always be there for them.

I don't know if this will help.
A good few years ago I had a party and invited my brother and sister. They both accepted the invitation but my awkward sister said she wouldn't come if my brother's wife would be there,
I replied to her that my brother and his wife had been invited and if my sister chose not to come, that was her choice.
My sister came - she wouldn't want to miss out - and the party was a success.
Sometimes you have to be very straight talking with waring siblings.

I agree with Jinty. Send each of them a message from you and their father based on your OP along the lines of:

In the past I we have said nothing as I we did not want to "blackmail"/force them either of you into speaking to each other on our behalf. We respect they you have their your own opinions and they are old enough to live as they you want to. It is my husband's your father's 70th birthday this year and this rift will again cause a problem in a family celebration. Neither my husband your father nor I want to have two birthday parties and have decided to have a weekend away to "celebrate" on our own. I We do not really feel unreasonable in not wanting to always host family occasions twice over and feel that this is the happier outcome for us both.

You are entitled to enjoy your special days and they should respect that. If they cannot put personal vendettas to one side to make you happy, then it's time to celebrate in the way which will make you happy doing what you enjoy. Spend the cash saved on a special treat for you both.

juney64...what great advice!...brilliant solution...

My assumption: each of your 3 sons is married, there are 7 mums involved for MD. I feel that your sons have enough on them planning for their wife, mil and you, so leave MD alone.

The other days, the days you do 'own', have one event when you wish. Advise each of your sons (separately) of the date you select and be done.

This really is a problem with an easy solution, in my opinion. Do as you wish, let others do the same.

Jaycee of course this is about the OP, she and her DH have been tiptoeing around their warring sons for years. Each son must be well aware the unhappiness and expense it is causing their parents and yet cannot be bothered to do anything to resolve the issue in any way.

I suggest henceforth the OP and DH just have one family party for every event, (including their funerals)and offer no guidance or advice as to who is on the invitation list or who has accepted. Leave it to their sons to sort the issue out. If neither choose to turn up, send them photographs after the event of everybody else having a lovely time.

P.s they dont have to speak to each other just be in the same room

Surely the are both big enough and old enough to be in the same room ?

It has gone on too long to change , just give notice that you will be around on whatever day/place /time and whoever turns up greet with no comment on Mothering Sunday , and book the holiday for the next occasion

Olympia, so sorry to hear that you are in this situation. I too am the mother of three adult sons and they have had their moments over the years.

I've thought long and hard about your post today and have tried to put myself in your situation. I think the difficulty you have is that you don't know what caused 'the major falling out' ten or more years ago. The reason may be fickle but on the other hand it could be major. You don't actually know what you're dealing with here. I'm not suggesting that you attempt to become involved at this late stage.

Personally, I would send the same email to them both saying how difficult you are finding double celebrations. Ask them in the email if there is any possibility of them reconciling and say that as their Mum and given that you love them both very much, you feel you would be failing in your duty as a mum if you didn't at least ask while you still can. No pressure - no ultimatums. It's just a question.

From there, you can decide the best way forward.

I think you've been amazing to accommodate these double celebrations for so long.

Best wishes to you and I hope you find a way through this that is at least easier for you.

How aweful for you. You have certainly gone above and beyond. I have children that don't get on and the last time they were together for my milestone birthday it was awkward and the tension was palpable.

My advice is what I do now. I do not have two of anything but invite them both on the day and one child comes in the morning and one in the afternoon with a buffet lunch. They seem happy with this arrangement and it is less expensive for me.

I wish it was different but have to accept it.

Good luck

Well said