The NHS should not be above criticism.

Many years ago DH went for an interview for the head honcho job at our local hospital.
Asked how he would run it and take it forward into the future, his comments were pretty much what we are all saying on here, he didn't even make the short list.
They were looking for someone from within the organisation, of course they were

Totally agree. Life saving treatment should not have been so readily halted. Even issues that are not critical will become so without treatment. How the already depleted services will ever cope I don't know. There's a lot of duplication of management in what is actually a regional health service. Salaries for management roles are huge. However Trump and co have their eyes on the money to be made. The chances the current government doing anything apart from making things whole lot more difficult are small.

I just wish the NHS would get back to doing the basics well. For instance, Yes, have a vasectomy on the NHS but not a reversal. The procedure ought not to be undertaken lightly and it should be pointed out that any reversal has to be paid for (done privately). It’s too easy for patients to flip flop around (ooh perhaps I could have used a better description there!) when they’re not paying the tab!

Just because science says ‘you can’ doesn’t mean ‘you ought to’. A consultant paediatrician I worked with said ‘saving’ some very tiny scraps of babies created huge interventionist problems further down the line for life.

Maybe it’s time to dial it all back a bit and make what we do more robust.

The question of nightingale hospitals I heard on the news are to be used for those mostly needing intensive and critical care and that’s their main purpose to be ready for that purpose. Not for overflow I am open to a more understandable account of why they were built thank you in anticipation of more clarity

Exactly Elizabeth1 so why are they lying empty ? It seems that the NHS is all but closed to anyone other than CV patients. Can you imagine the what they will be facing when everything goes back to normal ? So many people who are being ignored and left to become more and more ill (or worse). Going back to my DH’s own personal battle he was ignored for almost 2 years and then became so ill he ended up in ICU on life support . It’s happening all over again right now.

Our local hospital, very large, has just been downgraded as “inadequate” both in A&E and lack of safety on the wards.
Anyone being treated there over the last couple of years could have said that without inspections being carried out.

My H spent much time in there during his last 18 months, some care was exemplary, some so bad I had to keep asking to speak to ward managers, they were seldom available.

Older people with no visitors were neglected at times to a point I intervened.

The stroke care, acknowledged at the time as the best in the country, really was and I was very grateful for it but general care was mostly HCA’s, some of whom were there for the money, certainly not for love of the job.
Some though were very compassionate and were a credit to themselves.
Isn’t this true though of every walk of life?

I had elective surgery cancelled. 4 days before my op , due on March 27th, no way life threatening but leaving me in a lot of pain and certainly impacting on my life.

A friend has had follow up treatment after cancer surgery postponed, it may have been “belt and braces” but she can only see her cancer returning and progressing and is extremely distressed.

Let us pray Covid is soon under control and that “lessons have been learned” in all our hospitals, management and medical staff alike.

This is flippant but if it’s anything like education the nightingale hospitals will end up as more office space for more administrators.

Sounds about right Harri they would hate someone like your husband to go in and do the job as it should be done . Much prefer a yes man who ticks the right boxes than someone right for the job .

At last a thread which is not dedicated to praising the NHS sky high!
I have often felt that the NHS has become a religion, a god to be worshipped and appeased. The sooner we realise this is not the case, the sooner it can be improved.
Westminster treats it like a political football.
The turgid management is ineffective.
Front line staff are of variable quality so that treatment is often hit or miss.
The NHS needs a top down makeover, no more tinkering around the edges.

Not be me Gaunt47 I would like to see the NHS taken out of politics all together with all parties working together to make it the best possible . But that is never going to happen is it?

My own thoughts echo those of other's posting here. My son has suffered chronic, continual pain for nearly 4 years after an accident, his mobility is poor and at the age of 37, his life had been thrown into chaos.
We have had to "fight" very step of the way to see consultants, a referral to a pain clinic etc.
On an individual level we've had some great support but the system is a disorganised minefield.

Well I hope all those who are commenting on the NHS realise that the biggest spend of all time was Cameron's top -down reorganisation which was expected to cost £1.4 billion probably cost nearer £4 billion and has never worked the way it was supposed to. That many of us have been posting and campaigning for a properly funded NHS for years but unfortunately the government in power have never really been interested and have been preparing it for something to be on the table during the US trade deal talks.
And yes waiting lists will be longer, elective surgery will be at the back of the queue and some services will just not be available for some time. It's a result of a shortage of resources, lack of facilities and a limited number of staff . You can't do an operation in a theatre where a Covid patient has been treated without deep cleaning. You can't do dentistry without proper PPE and you can't open a Nightingale Hospital without enough staff. And all of that costs money. So perhaps those who voted in the Tories should realise this is what happens when you don't really fund or suport a proper NHS, but make your money from private contractors and vote against decent wages for NHS staff. You know like Mat Hancock.

A few years ago a member of my family suffered abuse by a member of the NHS nursing staff. It was witnessed. Despite going through a complaints procedure nothing was done. If this person had worked anywhere else disciplinary action would have been taken and probably dismissal would and should have been the outcome. There's was some sort of denial and a cloak of invulnerability. They are not all saints.

No Gillybob sadly it can't happen.
Howls of outrage would greet the person brave enough to suggest it - Privatising the NHS! Selling out to Americans! End of civilisation!

Yesterday,I was talking to my daughter, who is a nurse, about this very subject . We are hoping that the break in routine behaviour ( that’s putting it mildly) will lead to a more streamlined , efficient way of doing things in the NHS. I have long thought that we have put the NHS on such a pedestal that we tolerate long waiting lists and lack of communication. Why should we?
There is no reason why it can’t be as efficient as any other health service. We pay for the NHS and we need to stand up for it by pushing the politicians for better management and proper funding.

Totally agree the NHS isn't perfect and has let down many for years. Too many managers and admin staff. Nurses don't need degrees. That decision incensed many of my relatives that nursed in the NHS for years and finished as Sister's and in one case a Matron. We should follow the model of much better systems such as France and if we have to pay more so be it. my sister died of bowel cancer and I had to pay for a private check up, my brother in France, saw his local doctor and was treated by a consultant the week later to remove polyps that might be dangerous in the future. We must reform it. This crisis has highlighted its weak points.

Gaunt47 How many people do you think would have died in this pandemic if we hadn't had the NHS?
Why do you think private companies want services? How do you imagine making a profit will provide a better service?

I don’t think that’s what Gaunt was saying though trisher.

Of course the frontline staff are doing an absolutely wonderful job with those fighting CV and saving many lives too. I have the small ICU team at my local hospital to thank for saving my own DH’s life. But I cannot forget or Indeed forgive that it was the sheer negligence of the NHS that put him in there in the first place .

There is another side to the NHS (or there was) and that’s those people currently being ignored , left in pain or worse.

@Urmstongran. Ooh err......your description has me laughing. Thanks for that. ?

So perhaps those who voted in the Tories should realise this is what happens when you don't really fund or suport a proper NHS, but make your money from private contractors and vote against decent wages for NHS staff. You know like Mat Hancock

Now, now trisher let’s agree to disagree regarding politics. Remember Blair and the PFI fiasco that hospital Trusts are STILL paying back? Some 20% of their budgets in some cases. Truly Shocking.

I’d like to think that going forward better cooperation between Labour & Conservative could make a real and lasting difference. It’s a huge ask but it’s long overdue!

trisher I don't imagine anything. And I am not advocating privatisation of anything.
There is an argument the fewer people would have died, without the NHS.

Good post, trisher

The increased waiting times under the Tories can easilybe seen here.

Urmstonegran Those would be the buildings that were desperately needed to replace the ruins the Tories left after years of under-investment wouldn't they? You know the last time waiting lists got so long.
You can't cooperate with people who want to destroy something.
Gaunt47 any evidence for that? Some people think the earth is flat.

Well, if soit was a scam and a very expensive way of replacing said buildings trisher. Someone made a fortune out of it. I wonder who?