to resent the census requiring details of employer from years ago

M0nica

That's life.

Exactly.

But a 'That's life' approach would have meant no old age pension system, pay to visit the doctor, no nhs hospitals, no education, no votes for women nor for many men, slavery continuing, no council houses, perpetuation of the discrimination of The Statute of Apprentices blocking progress for many.

True, but it may well come round again, and again, and ... for the rest of your life.

Is that why I've had phone calls informing me that I have an unpaid tax bill and that the police will shortly be arriving at my door to arrest me unless I press 1 on the keypad NOW?

I thought it was a scam.

What is it that distresses you, ElderlyPerson? Clearly you are upset about the way in which you retired, but the information on the census is simply recording what happened, not treating you differently because of it. I'm not sure why you think you are being branded or 'followed for life' with this information, but something has obviously got under your skin that the rest of us can't see.

I had to do it for elderly relative with dementia, I only have the vaguest idea of her last job 30 years ago. I explained somewhere on the form. I can't tell them what I don't know.

I just filled the thing in. Thought some of it was a bit odd, but nothing to get my knickers in a knot over!

That's life.

M0nica

I think I had the question. In my case my last job was a brief fill in. so obviously this job, did not reflect the high exalted status I occupied during my main career

I too was one of the millions of over 50s, who in the 1990s, in particular, were made voluntarily redundant into early retirement.

As I said, all the retirement detail that causes you such distress, ElderlyPerson, will be reduced to basic facts of date, place and time and of no interest to anyone until diluted by several million other people's data. You, like the rest of us are merely statistics.

And some over 50 got several years of enhancement so got a pension as if they had worked for longer.

And those who were under 50, even by a few days, were involuntarily out with no early pension.

Excellent post, M0nica. As an amateur genealogist and data geek, it's the social history and demographics that the censuses reveal which interests me including employment numbers, the rise and decline of certain industries, the movement of people and why.

Sorry, I don't see the problem. With the internet and social media these days there is very little that can't be found out about anybody.

jaylucy

Branded? I didn't see that problem!
As someone that has been made redundant in the past through no fault of my own, it didn't in the least bother me that I had to complete those details - part of my past, can't change it!
Do you think that people in the past were bothered when they had to complete their job details and within a year had changed from a navvy to a company owner that it would be part of history for ever more?
The question I found that was strange was about my ex husband - what sex he was and was he straight, gay etc seeing as we divorced over 30 years ago!

As a father's occupation at the time of birth is recorded on someone's birth certificate it can have a lasting effect on the child.

It seems that in some British colonies that when victims of slavery were allowed their freedom in 1835 that they were registered with the surname of their until then oppressor as their own surname.

The census people seem to think in the same way about people who no longer are in paid employment.

I think I had the question. In my case my last job was a brief fill in. so obviously this job, did not reflect the high exalted status I occupied during my main career

I too was one of the millions of over 50s, who in the 1990s, in particular, were made voluntarily redundant into early retirement.

As I said, all the retirement detail that causes you such distress, ElderlyPerson, will be reduced to basic facts of date, place and time and of no interest to anyone until diluted by several million other people's data. You, like the rest of us are merely statistics.

Aaah, ok. I see now what you are getting at. Maybe an end of employment date would help then?

It's obviously about data not nuance though.

greenlady102

ElderlyPerson

Dear greenlady102 Maybe you retired 'normally' so it did not bother you. But it was asked online, threat of a £1000 fine if not answered- told that in a letter with 'Yours sincerely' at the end, no date information with the answer. Branding doesn't wear out.

I don't remember getting the letter either....I did get the lettter about how to register for the online return but it had nothing in it about my last job address....it might have asked me what i did when I worked but not who for.....

I didn't know there was abnormal retirement

That was the letter with the threat that ended 'Yours sincerely'.

There was nothing about last job in the letter, that was in the online part that one had to fill in.

By normal retirement I mean reaching pension age, or occupational pension age, if earlier, and retiring with the pension.

Being made redundant with a deferred occupational pension not arriving until reaching the occupational pension age is not normal retirement.

But the census wants the name and address of the former employer, even though there is no longer any contract of employment.

Branded? I didn't see that problem!
As someone that has been made redundant in the past through no fault of my own, it didn't in the least bother me that I had to complete those details - part of my past, can't change it!
Do you think that people in the past were bothered when they had to complete their job details and within a year had changed from a navvy to a company owner that it would be part of history for ever more?
The question I found that was strange was about my ex husband - what sex he was and was he straight, gay etc seeing as we divorced over 30 years ago!

But they are not interested in anything you have done since or how someone thinks of themself.

I know.
It's designed for a different purpose.

I don’t remember it either, and I filled it in on line.

Callistemon

Too late, I filled it in, sent it off by the deadline.

No good crying over what's done.

True, but it may well come round again, and again, and ... for the rest of your life.

ElderlyPerson

Dear greenlady102 Maybe you retired 'normally' so it did not bother you. But it was asked online, threat of a £1000 fine if not answered- told that in a letter with 'Yours sincerely' at the end, no date information with the answer. Branding doesn't wear out.

I don't remember getting the letter either....I did get the lettter about how to register for the online return but it had nothing in it about my last job address....it might have asked me what i did when I worked but not who for.....

I didn't know there was abnormal retirement

The census collectors are not remotely interested in your employment history as an individual. As soon as the form gets back to the office or you click 'send' on your computer your personal details become an anonymous set of numbers added to millions of others and analysed in bulk.

The first time your personal data is likely to see the light will be in 100 years time when the detailed figures are released. By which time you, the census enumerator, and anyone dealing it will be long dead. It will be accessed by a grand child or great grandchild, and if you have no descendants probably will never be accessed.

Why do they want the data? They need it for a variety of analysis for emploment statistics needed in planning, where people worked, what industries they worked in, whether their employment moved them round the country, the speed of decline in some industries, the rapid growth of people in new industries.

These figures and analysis then feed into housing planning, health planning, education planning, transport planning and all the unconsidered trifles of everyday life.

In a previous life I ran a regional market research department in a public utility and the company ran a huge national survey of household energy consumption every couple of years. We asked questions about every single heating source in every room and details of every single domestic appliance in the property and basic details of members of the household.

These details were turned to numbers in a computer and gave us really useful information about heating trends, ownership of appliances that drove long term energy planning.

I cannot tell you how profoundly uninterested we were in any individual person's data. What could one form tell us about the growth of cwntral heating or the purchase of combi boilers or central heating servicing contracts? Nothing at all. but the data from 10,000 forms all added up were really informative.

I know we all feel that information about ourselves is going to be of great interest to someone when we complete a survey, I do as much as any, even though I know how, the chances of anyone ever reading the form, other than to enter the data on it at speed into a computer,is as close to nil as is possible. They probably do not even enter name details. You will just be reduced to 'male, age 72, living alone, 5 jobs, dates and industries.' Or whatever your information is.

Then in 100 years time a great grandchild, will be excited to find that they had a great grandfather who started as a coal miner and ended up an astronaut.

NotSpaghetti

I think it will maybe skew quite a number of job descriptions this year.
It probably should just say occupation.
That way, if for example you see yourself as an artist but hold body and soul together by accountancy, you would be able to say Artist.

But they are not interested in anything you have done since or how someone thinks of themself.

I don't remember that question either. I either didn't fill it in or it didn't matter that much to me.

Dear greenlady102 Maybe you retired 'normally' so it did not bother you. But it was asked online, threat of a £1000 fine if not answered- told that in a letter with 'Yours sincerely' at the end, no date information with the answer. Branding doesn't wear out.

Too late, I filled it in, sent it off by the deadline.

No good crying over what's done.

I think it will maybe skew quite a number of job descriptions this year.
It probably should just say occupation.
That way, if for example you see yourself as an artist but hold body and soul together by accountancy, you would be able to say Artist.

I did my census online and don't remember that at all.