To think that a trend is starting here

Exactly Whitewave. I'm glad you got help and that you feel better.

BlueBelle

Not sure what that means timetogo are you meaning she shouldn’t have gone to the olympics at all when she was on top form ??? Do you mean she should have said I won’t go and take up a place because I might, just might have a panic attack or I might, just might have flashbacks that make me unable to carry on She couldn’t foresee how it would go before the day any more than Zola Budd knew she was going to crash into someone and become a hated character for years
It happened, to lose her attention, or her confidence for a split second could leave her injured for life so she sensibly said no I m going to stand aside let someone else get a medal I m not up to it at this point of time
What on earth is wrong with that?

Indeed. I didn’t understand either, especially the “I agree Lucca”

Kate1949

I don't usually post on 'serious' threads. However, I have suffered terribly with my mental health to the point where I really didn't want to be here. Mine was due to a succession of traumatic events.
When I first saw these athletes pulling out, I thought 'Oh come off it'. Thinking about it, maybe they are doing the right thing nipping it in the bud before they break. Maybe if I'd done something sooner, I wouldn't have got so ill. I used to be one of the 'pull yourself together' brigade until it happened to me. It's horrendous and frightening. I no longer judge.

Absolutely.

I had a complete mental breakdown at work, and looking back it was clear that the warning signs were there for at a number of years.

I ignored them. In fact I don’t think I appreciated what the signals were telling me. Stress headaches, anxiety, inability to stop working. Inability to say no, amongst other signals I should have recognised. I was also under pressure at home with my mother getting me to organise her house move and DH wanting to move to an area which made it extremely difficult for me to travel - I didn’t drive at the time. They were all there. One day I (apparently-I have no memory of it) I started to cry, and appeared to not know where I was or the people around me.

It took me 24 hours - the doctor said to DH x take her home and come back tomorrow after a rest- to begin to come out of the complete fog I was in. I requested that I not be given drugs and he complied with my request and organised CBT councillor for me. I was off sick for 8 weeks, and have never looked back.

I learned so much in that time and I felt mentally 100% stronger.

But the message to take away.

Recognise the signals - don’t ignore them. Take action to mitigate it as soon as you understand what is happening.

Oh thank you Moorland. Your post brought a lump to my throat. Once, when I was working, a colleague implied that I was 'weak' because I had no confidence, little ambition apart from giving my child a decent upbringing which I never had.
I had to smile. This person had no idea what I had been through. Why would they? I just think not everyone is tiptoeing through the tulips. We should never assume everyone has had the same life experiences.

Yes, we all inconvenience others at times. Of course we do, and yes, it goes with the territory of being human. I’m not complaining about that. Where I have an issue (and not with an athlete who realises that she can’t continue) is when colleagues regularly stay off work because they are not up to the job, or because there is something that they don’t like doing.

The idea that we should all protect our own mental health at the expense of others’ is never going to end well. There will be a snowball effect as if I stay off when the gizmos need feeding**, you have to feed both mine and your own, so the stress gets to you. You prioritise your own MH and stay off, so Miss Muggins gets to feed three lots and so it goes on. In the end either the gizmos die and no-one has a job, or someone has to step up and do it.

That’s not discriminating or being unsympathetic to people who can’t tolerate stress. What would you say to someone who developed an allergy to gizmos? Go and work with the grommets? That’s all I’m saying - just don’t cling to a job you can’t do and expect others to cover for you on a regular basis.

**insert any relevant stressful activity relevant to your line of work

Kate1949

I don't usually post on 'serious' threads. However, I have suffered terribly with my mental health to the point where I really didn't want to be here. Mine was due to a succession of traumatic events.
When I first saw these athletes pulling out, I thought 'Oh come off it'. Thinking about it, maybe they are doing the right thing nipping it in the bud before they break. Maybe if I'd done something sooner, I wouldn't have got so ill. I used to be one of the 'pull yourself together' brigade until it happened to me. It's horrendous and frightening. I no longer judge.

A beautiful and brave post Kate 1949. I hope you stay well.

Germanshepherdmum said "But I do expect that if you aren’t the sort of person who can take stress, you find a less stressful occupation."

Sometimes the stress is not caused by the occupation. Sometimes the mental health problem is not stress.
Sometimes a young woman can sit in a concert hall and look beautiful but be quietly and painfully wishing herself dead.

We don't know do we.

Maybe much lifelong mental health is caused by the 'toughening up' process we endure as children inflicted by parents who operate in a compassion vaccuum.

To battle on is not always the wise or brave way.

I don't usually post on 'serious' threads. However, I have suffered terribly with my mental health to the point where I really didn't want to be here. Mine was due to a succession of traumatic events.
When I first saw these athletes pulling out, I thought 'Oh come off it'. Thinking about it, maybe they are doing the right thing nipping it in the bud before they break. Maybe if I'd done something sooner, I wouldn't have got so ill. I used to be one of the 'pull yourself together' brigade until it happened to me. It's horrendous and frightening. I no longer judge.

But how do you sort the wheat from the chaff. You said previously you didnt know anything about Simone, so do you somehow magically 'know' about the circumstances of the other people you are talking about. Basically what gives you the skills to decide this.

And who are we to decide what is wheat and what is chaff?

Anybody who uses the word "whine" in a post about mental health has lost all credibility for me, I'm afraid.

Can I play my "don't think much of people who judge others" card?

‘there’s no such word as can’t’? - There is, though.

There are times in all our lives where we inconvenience others at work and elsewhere. In times of bereavement, illness, accident, maternity we are less able to give to others and we put ourselves first. When others are in the same position we support them, as Simone Biles team mates seem to have willingly done.

That's what it is to be human isn't it? We don't consider us inconvenienced, we help.

Perhaps the lack of compassion shown by the 'you've just got to push on through and not play the mental health card' view expects us to be machines and not humans. I strongly believe that contributes to our mental health problem.

Stephen Fry has endured lifelong mental health problems. Would we really rather he'd sat in a room with a blanket over his knees for fear that he might one day 'inconvenience us' by not being able to perform? Or would we rather he worked within his own boundaries and producing us with 40 odd years of brilliant comedy.

Just a little compassion allows people space to do their best.

Perhaps it takes someone who has experienced genuine mental health issues, either themselves or in a close friend or family member, to recognise that there is a big difference between those issues and the sort of attitude displayed by MOnica’s American flatmate and a great many today who whine about their mental health because it has become a fashionable thing to do. I’m not saying that genuine mental health problems shouldn’t be talked about and sufferers appropriately supported, because they absolutely should. I have always been open about my depression and also the epilepsy I suffer from because it’s important that people realise these things can happen to anyone and that the sufferer, surprise surprise, is an entirely normal looking person who with the correct treatment is holding down a pretty high powered job. Another expression I might use, equally as unpopular as the mental health card, is sorting the wheat from the chaff. Very often those with real problems don’t talk about them, sometimes with tragic consequences. Those who refer constantly to their mental health are in my opinion less likely to be genuine sufferers. And I agree entirely with Doodledog - if you can’t handle high levels of stress, and not everyone can, then you shouldn’t be in an occupation in which stress is unavoidable and then disappear leaving your colleagues to pick up the pieces. I can handle stress, therefore continued to honour my obligations leaving the black dog at the office door. Not everyone can do that, nor do I expect them to - a favourite phrase of my mother was ‘there’s no such word as can’t’ and I’m sure that toughened me up. But I do expect that if you aren’t the sort of person who can take stress, you find a less stressful occupation.

Not sure what that means timetogo are you meaning she shouldn’t have gone to the olympics at all when she was on top form ??? Do you mean she should have said I won’t go and take up a place because I might, just might have a panic attack or I might, just might have flashbacks that make me unable to carry on She couldn’t foresee how it would go before the day any more than Zola Budd knew she was going to crash into someone and become a hated character for years
It happened, to lose her attention, or her confidence for a split second could leave her injured for life so she sensibly said no I m going to stand aside let someone else get a medal I m not up to it at this point of time
What on earth is wrong with that?

Germanshepherdsmum

Moorlandmooner you cannot compare that statistic with joining up during wartime.

To join the British armed services at any time is to willingly put yourself in the way of danger in order to benefit others and defend our country.

All of our service men and women are prepared to be the first one there wherever and whenever there is conflict.

Between 2000 and 2014 454 British forces personnel died in Afghanistan. Their average age was 22. 3,560 were wounded many suffering life changing injuries.

In 2020 37,000 student nurses enrolled during a pandemic which which was killing medical professionals daily and before a vaccine was available. Now that is bravery.

Then there are all the incredible young people who have made lifelong sacrifice and are now stunning the world with their achievements at the Olympics and the Euros?

Or the fantastic young people working in our care homes, caring for our grandchildren, volunteering to help during the pandemic and generally making our world a better place now and in the future.

It is easy, but not accurate, to dismiss a whole swathe of society with a throw away line about wimps.

timetogo2016

I agree Lucca,some poor soul would have loved the chance to be in the Olympics.

Sorry I don’t understand ?

Gwyneth

I’m just surprised that with the support top athletes receive from various professionals that mental health issues are not spotted before the athlete is selected to compete. Surely coaches etc would realise that something was not right?

I am surprised at this also, Should be spotted much earlier in my opinion

Navratilova has been such a champion of women in sport.

I agree Lucca,some poor soul would have loved the chance to be in the Olympics.

Typos… I’ve included….look at the bits ….

https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202108/medium-301887-fcbc67a0-36b0-4c71-a6a6-3c3446c6bfdb.jpeg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202108/medium-81860-b5c83bd7-75bf-40db-b940-a55876199223.jpeg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202108/medium-280304-b9448ff4-d783-44ab-8071-2ad5d151af8b.jpeg

There’s an article in the Sunday times today about Simone Biles. I’ll included it here . Well worth reading it all but at the least have a look at to it’s I’ve (rather clumsily) highlighted.
It’s written by Martina Navratilova.

M0nica

Lucca The fact that you do not like phrases like, 'playing the mental health card' etc, and I do share your distaste, doesn't stop some people doing everyone of those things you mention. Unfortunately this devalues the very real problems of other people who are mentally ill, or discriminated against for any reason.

Yasmin Alibhai-Brown had a very good article in the i this week on the subject of women who are incompetent in their jobs and seem to get away with it because it is considered sexist to be honest and call them out. While not being political, this has been very visible in some recent appointments to high profile jobs in the public sector.

For some people playing these cards is a form of passive aggression. Many years ago before mental problems were fully recognised I had an American flatmate, whose great get out of gaol card was claiming 'that she wasn't 'emotionally' up to doing things. Things she wasn't 'emotionally' up to doing included her share of the housework and cooking, being welcoming to any friends I or my friend, the third flatmate, invited to visit, or anything else that didn't appeal to her. In the end I decided I wasn't 'emotionally' up to living with her and I moved out. No doubt today she would play the mental health card and tell us that her mental health was too fragile for some reason to cook, clean and be polite to visitors.

Monica, of course there will always be people who take advantage, just as there have always been malingerers. I just find the use of that particular phrase tends to allow the user to lump many genuine sufferers in that description.
I don’t have a huge extended family by any means but within it there are 6 who have suffered from mental health issues either temporarily or, in the case of two people, long term.

She probably doesn’t care what Piers Morgan has to say or her fellow competitors. When you go into meltdown you go in to meltdown. I should imagine it’s like a panic attack where you just can’t help yourself. She will now be scared of it happening again.

Alegrias1

Can I play my " human being who recognises and supports others in difficulties" card?

Or else my "believes the youth of today would be as likely as any others in history to do their duty if needed" card?

I’ll join that card club

If Jones is playing the class card.

His snobbery fails to understand his title.

It is not Sir Digby Jones.

It is Digby Sir Jones.

Stupid man.