Thoughts please ...

My daughter gets help towards childcare costs under UC. Its paid one month in arrears so doesn't really benefit her as she has to pay childcare in advance. At the minute its 2 mths in arrears. She has to submit her earnings every month and every month they query it and keep her waiting. She is f/t civil service. Her pay never changes. She spends hours sorting it. So very stressful. I'm sure there are many others in the same situation who don't have mothers to help. Our wonderful tory government!

Exactly the point I was making Pammie1 .

Calmlocket

I think the fuel payment should be a voucher to pay your energy supplier and not monies paid into your bank. I know people that have used this money towards holidays, xmas presents etc and not for heating.

I don’t see how it’s actually possible to ‘use this money towards holidays, Xmas presents etc and not for heating’. The allowance is paid directly into a bank account and presumably that’s where people will either have a direct debit to their energy supplier, or make withdrawals to pay the bilks when due. So the money does go towards contributing to the energy bill, thereby freeing up some funds for other things.

Lincslass

Calmlocket

I think the fuel payment should be a voucher to pay your energy supplier and not monies paid into your bank. I know people that have used this money towards holidays, xmas presents etc and not for heating.

Shall shall we give benefit claimers and child allowance beneficiaries to have their money in vouchers too. Or is it just pensioner bashing that suits. ?

@Lincslass. I couldn’t agree more - and the same could be said for a lot of benefits but they seem to concentrate on bashing the most vulnerable people who have no real voice to fight back. The government are once again looking to reduce the most expensive benefit expenditure , which includes disability support. DLA was replaced by PIP but didn’t give the expected savings even though it rendered millions of disabled people either ineligible or on a lower rate, so now they’re looking at it again with a view to trying to replace disability extra cost benefits with vouchers for ‘services’ instead of cash. Disability is wide ranging and complex, and the view has always been that funding for extra costs incurred by living with a disability is best funded by a tax free, non means tested allowance for the person to spend in whatever way supports them best. Apparently that’s no longer the case. So all you parents out there who think the same way as ‘Calmlocket’ beware - because if they’re successful, it’s only a matter of time before they’ll come after child benefit recipients too.

Whatever people say they spend it on, it's still helping to cover the extra heating costs that most older folk have in winter.

Calmlocket

I think the fuel payment should be a voucher to pay your energy supplier and not monies paid into your bank. I know people that have used this money towards holidays, xmas presents etc and not for heating.

Shall shall we give benefit claimers and child allowance beneficiaries to have their money in vouchers too. Or is it just pensioner bashing that suits. ?

@Dickens. I think the same goes for their attitude towards disabled people. When the Tories took over from labour, there was a promise on their election campaign website, not to disturb DLA for disabled people, as they knew how much people relied on it - Cameron claimed it for his own son. Less than three months later they announced plans to replace it with PIP, so they had obviously known from the start that they were going to replace it. Boris is no better - he made noises suggesting he was in favour of more support for disabled people, but here we are, faced with more reform designed to take away more from the most vulnerable in our society, and it’s dressed up as ‘support’. Talk about a wolf in sheep’s clothing !

Pammie1

... thanks for the post - I'll go look at the site.

I've long believed that successive governments have tried to cut public spending by reducing the number of claimants eligible to receive benefits, and changing the criteria in order to do it. And in the process creating more layers of admin and cost. In the end, it will only be those who are virtually destitute, or so disabled that they literally cannot survive without help that will receive any money.

But, it seems to be the kind of society that people want - they keep voting for a party that is dedicated to 'small State'. Either they simply don't give a damn that people are suffering hardship, sickness and disability, or they think it won't happen to them. And I really don't understand why so many pensioners continue to vote Tory... a party that courts them, but impoverishes them at the same time. I can only guess that they believe anyone who is on a State pension and has no other means of support, is the author of their own misfortune and deserves to suffer because they didn't "provide" for their old age... it makes no sense otherwise.

I could do with a cutting from that money tree.

LesLee7

I applaud those of you who donate the Winter Fuel Payment to charity. I maybe don't need it but accept it as I was one of those 1950's women that missed out when they changed the pension so feel it goes some way to correcting that. Expect fuel bills to be high this year anyway the way things are.
I donate all year to other charities and our local hospice anyway so feel I do my bit on that front.

Exactly my thoughts. I too missed out on retiring at 60 and received my State Pension at 66 - 6 years of lost State Pension because of a change in the law. So I’ll take my Winter Fuel Payment, thank you very much. I regularly give money to various charities so I help in that way.

Dickens

Whoever made the suggestion that the WFP should be removed from Pensioners and given to those struggling on UC - needs to give his/her head a wobble.

Hardship is hardship whether you're old or young, and plenty of pensioners are suffering under it.

Or, perhaps the suggestion was to remove it from those pensioners whose income is over a certain level, and that bit's been forgotten in the OP? I mean, does anyone in the UK really believe that those reliant only on the State pension are not impoverished?

The whole system of pensions and benefits, credits, etc seems to be a cumbersome mess - goodness only knows what it costs to administrate. I realise that 'one size does not fit all' but wouldn't it be better to simply pay every pensioner a reasonable level of income and do away with all the add-ons? And those on UC who are working - should they not be paid a wage they can reasonably live on? How much money are we actually saving by trying to save money?

And, before anyone points it out - I understand that higher wages mean higher prices and increased benefits mean increased taxation, but I would argue that we've been virtually indoctrinated to believe that taxation is an evil we must continually fight against. But the ridiculous thing is, we still expect the same level of services from the NHS and other service 'providers', we still want our roads, highways and byways to be maintained... we want the whole infrastructure to function at its best - but we don't want to pay for these things. And we want our cheap goods, our 'stuff' from Amazon at low prices... but complain about our low wages... We just cannot simply pay little and expect more.

Of course, this is purely a personal POV and I respect that others will not agree and see the issue quite differently. But, the fact remains that the pensions and benefits system is unwieldy and cumbersome and therefore costly in both time and money.

Some excellent points here. You may want to visit the YouGov page and have a look at the green paper on disability benefit reform - the government is proposing yet more far reaching reform to the structure of disability benefits under the guise of ‘providing more support’ while trying to reduce the cost. They’re even looking at merging PIP (an extra cost benefit and currently not means tested) with UC/ESA, thereby means testing it by the back door and putting millions of already disadvantaged disabled people into more hardship. If they’re honest they know that the only way to reduce the cost is to make more disabled people ineligible to claim, but they continue to dress it up as ‘support’. As you pointed out @Dickens, if we want a proper NHS and a robust welfare safety net, then among other things, increased taxation and encouraging employers to pay better wages is the way forward, instead of constantly putting the squeeze on the most vulnerable because they’re an easy target.

Calmlocket

You only get the £10 if you claim benefits.

Yep. Obviously !!

Whoever made the suggestion that the WFP should be removed from Pensioners and given to those struggling on UC - needs to give his/her head a wobble.

Hardship is hardship whether you're old or young, and plenty of pensioners are suffering under it.

Or, perhaps the suggestion was to remove it from those pensioners whose income is over a certain level, and that bit's been forgotten in the OP? I mean, does anyone in the UK really believe that those reliant only on the State pension are not impoverished?

The whole system of pensions and benefits, credits, etc seems to be a cumbersome mess - goodness only knows what it costs to administrate. I realise that 'one size does not fit all' but wouldn't it be better to simply pay every pensioner a reasonable level of income and do away with all the add-ons? And those on UC who are working - should they not be paid a wage they can reasonably live on? How much money are we actually saving by trying to save money?

And, before anyone points it out - I understand that higher wages mean higher prices and increased benefits mean increased taxation, but I would argue that we've been virtually indoctrinated to believe that taxation is an evil we must continually fight against. But the ridiculous thing is, we still expect the same level of services from the NHS and other service 'providers', we still want our roads, highways and byways to be maintained... we want the whole infrastructure to function at its best - but we don't want to pay for these things. And we want our cheap goods, our 'stuff' from Amazon at low prices... but complain about our low wages... We just cannot simply pay little and expect more.

Of course, this is purely a personal POV and I respect that others will not agree and see the issue quite differently. But, the fact remains that the pensions and benefits system is unwieldy and cumbersome and therefore costly in both time and money.

Each year I choose a different charity to donate my Winter Fuel Allowance to, like to think I am helping others in doing so.

I applaud those of you who donate the Winter Fuel Payment to charity. I maybe don't need it but accept it as I was one of those 1950's women that missed out when they changed the pension so feel it goes some way to correcting that. Expect fuel bills to be high this year anyway the way things are.
I donate all year to other charities and our local hospice anyway so feel I do my bit on that front.

You only get the £10 if you claim benefits.

* I do think the Christmas bonus should be dropped, though. £10 is irrelevant, really - and somewhat insulting.*

Not irrelevant if you’re on the bones of your bum though. You can buy a lot for a tenner in Lidl !!

Maria59

The winter fuel payment was introduced to offset a lower state pension increase it has not increased annually with state pension therefore more cost effective than adding to pension payments.

Good point - the WFP has remained the same for some years, despite the rising cost of fuel, so much more cost effective for the government.

The winter fuel payment was introduced to offset a lower state pension increase it has not increased annually with state pension therefore more cost effective than adding to pension payments.

There wasn't a UC debacle. It was made quite clear at the start that the £20 uplift was temporary during the Covid-19 crisis. People conveniently forgot that fact. It was always a temporary thing. It lasted a lot longer than was originally thought.

There are many who really need the WFP and given the debacle with fuel price increases now some will need it even more so. There are thosr who don't need it, those who live in well insulated accommodation and those who don't usually experience cold winter months. I think it should remain. The £10 Christmas bonus though could be withdrawn but as it is unlike the WFP,an actual law this is more difficult to change. It's like the bus pass if you can afford to sure you pay your full fare!

Bijou

MissAdventure. It was hard enough applying for the lower end. If I have to have more help will attempt to do so.

I do hope so, and age concern could help you with your application.

JaneJudge

Pammie1, you are right. I am getting mised up. It was for ESA It is listed here it is apparently £25 per 7 days of cold weather between 1st Nov and end of March

Yes, ESA qualifies, but only the income related (means tested) allowance - the means tested ESA component of UC also counts. Interesting that Scotland pay a fuel allowance to people on PIP/DLA/AA if they have children, and are planning to expand on this. The rest of the UK have no plans at present to follow suit.

MissAdventure. It was hard enough applying for the lower end. If I have to have more help will attempt to do so.

It’s still jolly cold at night in most of Europe.