Would you consider it to be....

em ...precisely!

Don't know when I last heard the expression 'it's a sign of breeding' !! Thought both the expression and the concept had become obsolete.

Butternut and GoldenGran... to you, I'm feeling a whole lot chirpier. I rarely get my knickers in a twist. Just happens to be one of those days...
Awful cold outside. Did our duties at 'Bleak House' earlier today. Was pushing the vacuum around whilst still wearing thick coat, hat and scarf. Not a whole lot of laughs. Miss the days when the house was warm and filled with laughter.

supernana, sorry your fragile,ga spot on as ever

Oh supernana . Take care of yourself.

GA I meant to say

grannyactivist [fthanks] I'm feeling a little fragile and quite a bit ruffled at the moment.

"Its a sign of breeding not to talk about money"

As Biker would say, lolololol!!!!!

super anyone who frequents GN regularly will understand that you are truly a well-mannered inspiration to many.
Skewing the discussion slightly - the whole notion of 'breeding', in the context of what is, or is not, good manners leaves me cold. I am responsible for my own behaviours; NOT my parents.

elizabethjoan I may not give a hoot about 'sharing' cash-flow problems [with people I respect]...it's a fact of life [like having jippy knees or drop--bot!] And I certainly do not presume that others would wish to be as forthright as I. However...no matter...I shall never consider myself to be ill-bred!

This is a typical New Zealand thing which started in the pioneer days wher you had a bed for everybody and had a bed wherever you visited. As to accepting petrol money. That is common here in Germany and you offer it or share a car or fill up if you have borrowed a car.
When eating out each pays for their own meal and no one has to get in a round of drinks. It makes life easier, and doesn't affect the warmth or not of a friendship.

I wouldn't dream of asking anyone else about their finances, even my daughter and SIL, but I am quite open about my own.
A friend told me about a group of women she met through her son's school. They began to have coffee mornings, then one woman introduced little cakes, then another produced sherry. My friend could not afford this and felt it was not appropriate anyway, so she dropped out of the group. Later, she found out that several other women felt the same way but did not want to risk social exclusion. One of the things my daughter loves about NZ is the total lack of envy or comparisons - dress is always informal and nobody is trying to keep up with anybody else. When a Kiwi asks 'What do you do?' they are not asking about your job, but your hobbies.
A regular complaint on my ex-pat forum is about guests who expect to be met at the airport, chauffeured around and fed, and offer neither money nor help in the house. My daughter has suffered like this in New Zealand, mainly from her daughters' friends who expect free accommodation for a week or so whilst they take a break from back-packing. Just because we live in beautiful places, it does not mean we have huge incomes.
I am very happy to let friends use my flat whilst I am in NZ and I ask them not to leave me any money, but they usually leave something for the electricity they have used, plus small gifts of luxury food and my favourite wine.

This is an interesting thread. Growing up in poverty I remember many, many family conversations centred on money. My mother, when there was no money for food sometimes borrowed money from family and occasionally close neighbours and we had a 'tick' man from whom clothes and shoes were bought. We knew pretty well how much our neighbours and family earned and what it got spent on and financial matters were openly discussed in our home and in our community. My mother and siblings have continued in this vein and think nothing of asking highly personal financial questions. So, when I married my husband I was really very surprised to discover that he had absolutely no idea about his family's finances. When the subject was raised you'd have thought we were discussing something as personal as their underwear; such was his embarrassment. Fortunately I recognised that there was a bit of a culture clash and so I never tried to pry etc.
Interestingly, after 25 years of marriage, I am so close to my in-laws that we are happy to share our financial situations with one another.

Its a sign of breeding not to talk about money. Some have, some don't, and the thing is to value the person not what they have materially or don't.
I love what Hilda says. I am careful about what I spend and consider professional waxing and hair colour essential. Wouldn't dream of ready meals except in emergency........every other wednesday on busy schedule.......M and S gastropub lasagne! Also v keen on left-overs. Some friends however, do their beauty bits themselves and eat out endlessly. I reckon to get better value. They reckon otherwise I assume. Each to her own, and Happy Christmas to all!
Off to look for good potted xmas tree in morning. Will try to track down the one I rented last year. Can't believe B and Q charging £44.95 for tree!!

supernana - Yes, we are on a limited income, too. Partly self imposed because I insist upon saving every cent for travel tickets to see the kids and grandkids - and of course that is a choice we are happy making (and can make) - but it does restrict us quite a bit.
We have some great friends, all with different life styles and incomes and I would say without question that they certainly enrich our life, too.

My husband often says he feels like a millionaire with the life he leads. Having enough to cover essentials is important, but having a positive attitude goes such a long way.

I'll look out for that dahlia - sounds interesting.

Love the thread running through this topic. Funny the attitude we have to money, but we also don't discuss our finances with anyone else. There is a new series entitled "Money" on BBC and some of the questions asked have proved enlightening to the couples concerned, leading, I suspect, to some kind of confrontations later on!

Butternut Your considerate friends sound a lot like ours.
Fact is, we really are "struggling" with our finances at the moment. The majority of our closest friends [especially those who live nearby] are "well to do" - big houses - several cars - good pensions etc. They are the sweetest, kindest friends anyone could wish for. We needed to explain why it is that we won't be giving the usual "biggish" party this year. We needed to explain why we would rather not have gifts [because we can't afford to do likewise] and it is a weight off our shoulders, to have those we respect, tell us that come what may, they are here for us. It goes without saying I trust, that we do not EXPECT anything beyond their friendship. In that, we are SUPER-rich indeed.

Case in point:

We are taking friends to the airport today, and petrol money was offered, which we declined - so they're insisting on making us a packed lunch picnic to enjoy on our way back. Lovely and thoughtful - no wonder they're good friends.

Next week I'm taking s-i-l to the same airport.

Guess who is the one who thinks my financial situation is up for discussion and just happens to be loaded!

bagitha - the person in question (s-i-l) thinks she has 'breeding'. My husband would disagree!

My German husband who has lived, as I have, in both countries came to this conclusion. The British would rather talk about their feelings than about money. The Germans would rather talk about money than about their feelings.
It seems each culture has its 'private sphere' And yours has been violated.

A lot of people both sides of the North See don't want to talk about either. Whether your friends meant well or were being rude only you can judge.

I don't discuss money with anyone - especially Mr.Gally

Feel the same as you, susie. I only discuss money with my husband. It's nobody else's business. I don't expect or want to be told about other people's money either and I think it's disgustingly rude to make assumptions about others' finances. Maybe it's a sign of 'breeding' to talk about money, but it isn't a sign of good manners.

I was brought up not to discuss money with people outside your immediate family. I have several very rich friends because I play golf and it attracts people with money. They talk money all the time and I just don't join in. When invited to go to something I go if I think its worth spending money on and if it fits in with the budget. I really dont like the habit of discussing money other than in a macro sense - e.g. how much prices have risen that kind of thing. Is this an unusual attitude?

I think, it is incredibly rude to assume that someone can or cannot afford something . If someone sugested that to me I would put on my ''Queen of Endland '' face, as my children call it and tell them in no uncertain terms that what I CHOOSE to afford is my business and no one else's . I am on my high horse for you butternut !!!

Yep, bang on, HildaW.

Hilda Well said.