An ethical question

This is going to sound really cynical but priests are people, they are not on a pedestal in fact many are lower than average folk, bearing in mind how many lies have been told over child abuse.

When I volunteered in a charity shop we had someone on board to go though the stuff for anything with any value if something got through I think that's just good luck, if someone bought the item fair and square and didn't steal from the shop, why is it any different to buying from a car boot or a second hand shop or inheriting, you could say if you bought from a car boot stall and sold for 10x the amount should you give it back to the car booter, no of course not you have gained from your knowledge or you ability to take the time to find out about the item. Good luck to them

nowt wrong with digressing..

there is a thread on loo brushes so why not have one JUST for loo paper?
[joke.]So please don't start one.

Well, that got the ball loo paper rolling. Well done, @rogertb.

No smile on my screen Jen

Sorry, Kitty, I thought it was all a joke, except of course, you not using recycled loo paper, and I did not assume that you felt bad about your choices. Can't you see my smile?
Having been vegetarian for over 35 years I know better than to try and change people.
We had a guest house in York for ten years, and I could not believe the number of people who had to have recycled loo paper explained to them.
Our environmental credentials were written on our literature, in case you're wondering.

With you there, Kitty

As you were, those of you who were not sidetracked by the rivetting topic of my loo roll choices.

Sorry, Nellie but back to my toilet paper!

Jen I do not feel bad about my choices so please don't assume that I do. I make enough good choices to be allowed the odd bad choice.

I hope you were joking about 'someone of my sensibilities'

Well I am not arguing with the figures, but this is a gross over simplification of the way it all works. How much do you think it costs to get the aid to the right places? The cost of chartering aircraft, running warehouses and buying in equipment, shelters, medical equipment, water purification equipment? Much of this is high tech and expensive.

More from snouts in the trough.
"Its shops raise £89.9m, but cost £67.6m, leaving just £22.3m for charity. Not great, considering the people working in the shops are mostly volunteers. "

Charity shops have to pay rent, and a business rate tax, even if it is reduced.
They have to insure and heat and maintain premises, pay transport to get goods from central collection points to their locations.

Each shop has a paid manager and some assistants and volunteers who do have to be trained and managed.
www.theguardian.com/voluntary-sector-network/2012/aug/21/get-ahead-charity-shop-manager.

"Oxfam has a clear career path for the managers of its 700 UK shops who start on a minimum salary of between £15,840 to £19,489 depending on store turnover."

More snouts comments.
" Of the £229.1m available for charitable work, £90.6m is handed out in grants to other charities. As they will certainly have managerial and administrative costs of 20% or more, that’s another £18.1m not available for real charity."

There are a large number of UK charities who give grants to other local charities.
The DEC (disaster emergency committee) pool resources for urgent aid. If there is a need in a particular area and say Oxfam doesn't have workers there but another organisation does, then they should of course support those groups who know the local situation.

How do "snouts" judge what is real charity!
One thing "real charity" is not is just handing out emergency aid. All the big agencies promote projects to improve health, education and community development

It is all too easy to it a spin on the "figures" if you do not bother to analyse or mention what the actual costs are.

The basic administration costs for Oxfam as I stated earlier, with the link to the report, about 12% of their income. That is pretty good.

A report on charity admin costs seem to indicate that within reason its counter productive to spend too small a proportion on administration.
giving-evidence.com/2013/05/02/admin-data/

And,I suspect Aka knew I knew

Sorry, Kitty, but Andrex bamboo toilet paper is 90% recycled and 10% bamboo, so no good for someone of your sensibilities.

I do buy recycled printer paper and all sorts of other 'good' things Jen but, as I said, there is a balance to be struck. Loo paper is such an integral part of life that I am not prepared to compromise!

I think Kitty knows that, Aka; she just cannot get the idea out of her head, once planted. I think the Andrex bamboo paper has aloe vera in as well, Kitty. Or you could always make sure you buy recycled printer paper, then you will not feel so bad about it.
The thing about buying recycled paper is that the more you buy, the more choice there will be from manufacturers.
After all, nothing to do with paper, but even Nestle have started using fairtrade chocolate.

Aka silly me

kitty things are recycled INTO toilet rolls not...

Our local Salvation Army takes nearly anything as long as it's clean and unbroken. What isn't good enough for resale they sort and sell for recycling. There's a group of ladies who unpick buttons and reclaim usable zips, a sort of reverse sewing circle.

It's the connotations of ' recycled' and 'toilet roll' together,Jen !! .

I feel there is a balance to be struck between doing the right thing and doing the thing that suits one best!

I have just read about David Craig, who wrote "Snouts in the Trough".
He has written an amazing number of books criticising everyone with titles like Squandered, Greed Unlimited, Fleeced, Pillaged, Plundering the Public Sector.
A lot of Snouts in the Trough he admits is guesswork rather than fact, so his figures cannot possibly be accurate. At least he criticises both sides of the political spectrum, but as the only comment on snouts-in-the-trough says, 50% of a lot is better than 50% of nothing.

thanks ana i didnt know how to do that..

Is your kitchen roll not a bit squashed, Kitty?
I think Andrex do a toilet roll with bamboo in which I get if there are no recycled in the shop, although I tend to buy a dozen rolls at a time and try not to run out.
"Cannot buy" is a strange statement to make. Why not?

Interesting!

www.snouts-in-the-trough.com/archives/6022

(blued it to make it more accessible)

@ nellie did post it earlier but didnt get all the addy in...heres the link....

http://www.snouts-in-the-trough.com/archives/6022

I'm sorry but I cannot buy recycled toilet paper, although I do understand how they make it. Anyway, we like the aloe vera stuff. We use little kitchen roll but I buy the one with the elephant on because it works better.

I would point out that this doesn't necessarily make me a bad person as I do recycle and buy recycled when I can.

Thanks, Nellie, that's what I was looking for. I like the opening ad. We do not want to make them angry, do we, by misquoting either.
One thing aqbout recycling. I have been looking for sportswear using recycled plastic bottles. I think I have discovered that the biggest company in this country has just gone into liquidation, probably because, although people give articles to be recycled, they do not continue the cycle and buy recycled. The same goes for paper recycling. How many of you actually make sure you buy recycled paper/ toilet paper?
My loft insulation is made out of recycled plastic bottles.