Is wolf-whistling a sex crime?

* vampirequeen* you seem to bend over backwards to give the men the benefit of the doubt whilst doing just the opposite for the woman concerned. For instance you say 'she's had her 15 minutes of fame' which suggests the woman is motivated by the wish for publicity.

It seems like an automatic bias against women. Or at least this woman.

Absolutely petallus and Iam. I would be horrified and ashamed of any man I knew who even thought this behaviour was acceptable let alone participated in it. And I don't know any women who would accept this bevaviour let alone regard it as a compliment. As for the whole 'crime' thing. The police investigated and had words. This sort of behaviour is on a spectrum and didn't reach the threshold - that does not make it acceptable but it did make it worthy of reporting because left alone, escalation is always possible. VQ are you related to this young man?

If he is such a good family man, how come he is whistling at girls in the street. Showing off to his mates? Some men do revert to stone age hunting packs when in a group.

Yes, she should have contacted the firm sooner, to get it stopped before it went any further, but she didn't. Probably thought she would be considered a silly girl! She was right, and that is why women don't "make a fuss"

I think I would have felt intimidated by a group of macho males at 23 (or since) or even one lone one if he stepped into my path.

I suspect the video is a reconstruction. Artists impression and all that.

I agree with iam and GT but I also get where vamp is coming from. I can follow her reasoning and I find it rational even if I don't altogether agree and bits of it... no, bits of the case... leave me feeling uncomfortable. Some of the more angry-seeming posts from the other side of the discussion also leave me feeling uncomfortable.

The point, for instance that the company did not have time to do anything about the complaint before the police were involved is somewhat discomfitting to me.

Also, if the police are not charging the man or men it could be because they feel in law that there is no case, not that they are sexist twats. The law may be at fault rather than the police.

A month is certainly a long time to put up with something she hated so much before doing anything proactive about it. I'm not blaming her saying that. I can't know what she was feeling or how it affected her but a month is a long time if it was that bad. Which sows seeds of, not doubt, but puzzlement in my mind.

GT I too would be ashamed of any man I know behaving in this way and I mentioned in a previous post that I was surprised one of the other builders told him to leave her alone. It is a bit worrying that 'pack mentality' could take over.
DS attempted to remonstrate with a man once (when he was quite young) when a bloke was harrassing his own (bloke's) girlfriend. He got shoved against a wall and a black eye for his trouble. However, that wouldn't deter him from coming to the rescue of a girl or woman in distress.

To answer the OP , no I don't think a wolf whistle is a sex crime, annsixty but this yob (backward boy) went further than that and was harrassing her and preventing her going about her lawful business in a threatening way which is a crime.
He might be a 'family man' now but I wouldn't like him to be part of my family.

Just because the police do not investigate incidents does not mean that a crime has not been committed - as is reported in the media almost daily.

No I'm not related to him nor do I know him.

I'm just sad that the fight for equality has got to the stage where a wolf whistle can be called sexual harassment.

I agree VQ what next? Smiling at someone?

Correction: I was surprised one of the other builders did NOT tell him to leave her alone

I wasn't aware that he touched her though rosequartz ?

Silly of him. Even childish, I appreciate but hardly a sex crime.

A headmaster I once knew could never look you in the eye when he spoke to you; instead he stared - and spoke to - your bosom!

He didn't touch her, jumped in front of her I think and 'invaded her personal space and prevented her going on her way'. Quite intimidating and bullying.
I remember a beggar doing that to me years ago in a city centre, as I tried to walk past and around him he danced backwards in front of me, leering into my face and demanding money. DD was with me, she was only about 9 or 10. I gave him £1 to get rid of him and DD heard another little girl say to her mother 'see, that lady got caught just like you'.
Nothing sexual, but harrassment.

A headmaster I knew (actually he was mine in primary school) was vile. I remember he smacked a boy in our class on the bottom infront of the entire school causing the boy to wet his pants. The said headmaster seemed to take a strange delight in this. I didn't understand what was going on at the time but I can see it for what it was now. I was terrified of him.

I did say wolf whistles are not a 'sex crime' imo, gillybob, although harrassment is a crime.

If you think about how long it has taken for stalking to register as not merely undesirable but now be classed as a crime, there is a similarity. A "persistent admirer" was how a stalker used to be viewed, tolerated, and frequently dismissed regardless of the misery he or she caused. Lives were wrecked by the fear and stress even terror, generated by stalking but unless there was physical threat, little action was taken. We have woken up to this as a real threat, surely the time has come for wolf whistling, catcalling, sexist jeers and verbal as well as physical sexual harassment to be recognised.

I know you didn't rosequartz I was answering the OP in my second line.

gillybob

Oh dear, a post (mine I mean) can come over as snappy when they are not meant to be!

And a wolf whistle could come over as a 'sex crime' when it is just meant to be an expression of admiration (not in this case I hasten to add, it went further than a single one-off wolf whistle from a yob).

Just reread the BBC article which does not say anything re a timeline for Poppy contacting the owner of the building-who apologised, the building contractor-who sort of apologised,and the police- all of which led to an escalation of the harassment. Can we get an url for the article referred to by Ana, vq, Thatbags who say she did this all in the same day? Also the man in the machine was part of the blocking on the sidewalk and the harassment according to Poppy.The info that the main aggressor is a married man and a father sheds a disturbing light on the whole month long pursuit .The fact that he was put in jail for affray is more disturbing as many such cases do not end in jail terms. Poppy was definitely right to report to the police, even if they did not lay charges this time. I hope this man does not escalate his pursuit of her further. Poppy also says in her blog that she did not want this publicity'if anything i am an introvert'.

Poppy also says in her blog that she did not want this publicity'if anything i am an introvert'.

That's a contradiction to me.

Do you mean a contradiction between her saying she is an introvert and blogging, or between her saying she didn't want the publicity and being an introvert?

How has wolf whistling turned into a pursuit?

This thread is now going round in circles.

Wolf whistling etc seems normally to be something men in groups do, partly to show off to each other, without giving any thought to its effect.
Same with discussing page 3 girls and similar behaviour.

Whistling etc is an intrusion of privacy - the right for a woman to walk down the street, thinking her own thoughts and not being treated as an object of lust, plus have the attention of others directed to her.
Many men just don't get the fact that yes, they like looking at attractive women, but in publicising their attraction to all and sundry in this way they transform the woman (and all women) into an object that exists for the entertainment of men.

Yes JesM and invariably when women are walking along with their own thoughts minding their own business, the same sort of men who do all the whistling and cat calling then throw in "cheer up luv it might never happen!" Incandescent doesn't describe how I remember feeling, I got that comment thrown at me quite a lot in my younger days. I was never flattered, just irritated. My sympathies are with Poppy. One of the advantages of aging, the days of unwanted attention are long over