millenials can't afford houses because they're brunching (or not)

All the people I knew who had 100%, and extremely low rate, mortgages, worked for the local building society, which was for years this area's biggest employer. They were the ones with the non-contributory final salary pensions and too. That building society is now a bank and has been very heavily subsidised by public money, so perhaps it counts as the public sector?

There were certainly no subsidies for public servants up here.

It was not everyone who worked for the council gilly you had to be doing a job it was hard to recruit to. They needed teachers in London & nurses,social workers, police and firefighters I think were also able to apply for the 100% mortgage. It had strings attached but was helpful for us as 2 young teachers in inner city schools.

I meant to say that I think that it would be a good system to reintroduce in areas where there are a shortage of key workers. Might not be London now..many coastal towns are ginding it hard to recruit and keep certain workers.

Finding..not ginding!

Gilly I am not pretending anything. I don't expect young people to struggle as we did - but it is a choice. If you want to have all those things you mention, and holidays abroad, regular meals out, etc- then you may not be able to afford your own home. A choice. Not worse, not better- a choice.

What some of us do not agree though, is that they should then somehow 'blame' us and keep complaining that their choices in some things, mean they then do not have the choice ot t'other. Simple.

btw this 'obsession' with becoming house owners is very much a British thing. On the Continent, it is the norm to rent- partly because young people nowadays do not want necessarily to spend week-ends decorating, gardening, etc- and prefer going out and having fun. Just a different mindset.

Yes, I think most of us know that, granjura. It's a cultural difference, and long may it remain that way.

Often it isn't a choice at all though granjura, neither do I think the "British are obsessed with becoming home owners" but when I see the cost of private rentals in this country I am so glad that I eventually did become a home owner (albeit still with a mortgage) and I am glad my two children were able to get onto the property ladder too. I don't think you can compare the UK with mainland Europe.

Oh I agree it is complex, as the rental sector is limited and prices and also quality often horrendous. However I feel there is a slow switch taking place. I always wanted to own my own house, and we only rented for a few years when we lived in London. But many of my Continental relatives found it bizarre that we chose to struggle to be house owners and make a lot of sacrifices, and work so hard, on top of our demanding jobs, to maintain and improve our house, rather than go out and have fun.

I remember when we bought our second house, with a toddler, me heavily pregnant and OH already working in new job living in digs - and we over stretched outselves as the market was so tight and we were in a hurry to move before baby was born- and the mortgage rate then shot up to 19.5 % - still sends shivers down my spine.

I have heard that granjura, but I think the thing is about home ownership as, when we retire, it is good to know that we don't have to find ever-increasing rent for a landlord. I will never understand my MIL who preferred to rent privately but spent her old age being worried about paying the rent (not that much in comparison to today's rents) and of being 'put out on the street' in favour of a young family.

But you own yours? Is that not the norm in Switzerland?
And another property in the UK?

However, one of my DC doesn't look likely to ever be in a position to buy (the millennial one who spends!) unless she wins the lottery or inherits .....

I remember the high interest rate too - we had just moved to London and had had to take out a bigger mortgage as well.

Me too, I was a single parent and had to take out a mortgage on a tiny house at 15% - just had to get on with it!

I know it's not the same all over the country, but house prices around here are ludicrous, proportionally far more expensive compared to salaries than when dh and I were young. Even with two reasonable salaries my dd and her dh would have no possibility of buying the house we bought when we were quite a bit younger than they are - and I wasn't even working.

And rents are typically so high that saving anything like enough enough for a deposit is just a fantasy for many, especially when the mortgage even for a very modest home would be unaffordable anyway. Very ordinary 2 bed flats in very non trendy parts of SW London like Tooting regularly sell for half a million pounds or more.

To be honest I do get cross with older people who say, well, if they didn't have iPads and didn't go out, they'd be able to buy. An awful lot of them just wouldn't be able to, however frugal they were, not unless they had a huge salary increase.

Should add, that renting in other countries is often different, in that tenants have much more security and long term rentals are normal.
Here I often read of people being given 2 months' notice because the landlord has decided to sell when they may have only been there a relatively short time. They then have to start again, find another hefty deposit up front before getting the other back, and often pay expensive letting agency fees, too. Never mind all the sheer hassle of moving. Certainly no fun, especially with children - it's no wonder that Brits prefer to own, and not be at the mercy of landlords.

I don't think there would be an "obsession" with owning a home IF rents were reasonable, leases were long enough so that people felt reasonably secure and accommodation was generally of a good standard.

I don't think we can compare the situation in the UK to countries like Germany and France where renting is much more common and the above conditions are more likely to be met.

There are many people in this country whose reason for renting rather than buying is not because they are frittering their money away on expensive holidays, meals out, fancy clothes, etc., but because they can hardly afford their rent and basic expenses, let alone save for a deposit on a house.

Of course, there are people who are doing very nicely for themselves - those that are in reasonably well paid jobs and whose parents have helped them with deposits and other expenses. It my experience it is often people like that who feel superior to those in private and social rented accommodation and who kid themselves that their own comfortable position is all down to them.

Frankly, I think the housing situation in this country is a national disgrace.

It is an utter disgrace - and the worst think about it is the state of the properties that are being rented out. And hardly any obligations on landlords to provide decent standards.
Someone calculated that if food had increased in cost at the same rate as housing has since the 70s, a loaf of bread would now cost £70.
Buying a house of any kind is now beyond the reach of the majority of younger people. So why not enjoy life if they can afford it?

Couldn't cope with brunch. Do you have to wait around all morning for breakfast?!

It seems to be the trend these days. We ate out once, maybe twice a year for birthdays. Mini holidays were unheard of, as in fact were major holidays. People complain of being broke, but nail bars and tattoo parlours doing a roaring trade. I just bite my tongue now. I suppose it's a generation thing.

Neither my late husband nor me were brought up with the idea that our parents would help financially, we knew we would be on our own. When we got married we did without (like most of us), luckily I had friends who were in similar circumstances so it didn't feel like we were the only ones struggling. I have worked full time most of my life and worked in a Nursery when my children were little until the were at school and I could go back to office work. Even today I think twice about buying something new - I love rummaging in second hand stores

My two children have both saved hard and bought their own houses. They did both have help with the deposit from a grandparent's will. DD and SIL about to move into a bigger one. They seem to have an inbuilt saving system, only goodness knows where they got that from. Certainly not me! The thing is that when we go and stay there is nothing in the cupboards to eat, whereas mine are full of things that looked good at the time but are still in the cupboards months later. Am I the only person who wishes they were more like their children?
They do go out to eat and have takeaways but that is included in the very tight budget they allow themselves.

The cost of housing has risen such a lot, years ago it was roughly 3 x salary, now in many places it is 11 x salary, the only people making money there are the banks, they effectively sell the same product over and over again, at ever increasing prices.

Now that the gov are beginning to look at equity release as a means of people funding care int heir old age, with hindsight, I would have preferred mini breaks and some tattoos. Why work hard unless you can benefit your family ?

I have seen people in care homes lose their homes to fund their care while sitting next to them are people who enjoyed their lives more by coasting along..........letting other people provide for them.

I watch my own kids making decisions I don't really respect and yet, I know that the worry of a mortgage and a life with little leisure/pleasure was a hard slog for me.

We can't expect much else from the young when we have created a world for them where appearances are everything, and indulgent parents facilitate their lifestyles.

Being bankrupt used to be an embarrassment, now its practically a rite of passage......everything in life is a social construct, we have seen the banks bailed out time after time, people feckless with money given knighthoods, footballers and other celebs paid well beyond their worth, who can blame the young if they are tainted by these skewered values?

I too believe that the young are living while they can, because ahead lies all sorts of terrors...........

Agree that the rental sector is very different in UK to the Continent, and os is the attitude to being an owner or rentor.

Jalima no it is not the norm for people in Switzerland to own their own home- as in the UK, changes are afoot too- with more people now buying their apartment, rather than renting- but with few owning their own home. Where I live, land prices are very low, and lots of space available, so it is the cheapest part of Switzerland. We bought a very old house in need of renovation at much lower price than we would have paid in the UK in the Midlands. We have done the major renovation work- the one you can't see, electrics, plumbing, heating, treatment for woodwork, etc- and were about to start on cosmetic work- like a new kitchen as the 1960s one is in dire need. This won't happen now- but never mind. And yes we were able to buy a small flat in the East Midlands with the rest- in case we ever need to come back. And yes, I know we've been lucky to be able to do so. Thanks.

Has DESDEMONA actually pointed out to her daughter, ("still living at home but trying to save for a house deposit",) who indulges in a £3 coffee every day at work, that this mounts up to something over £675 p.a. ??
And that is assuming she ONLY buys coffee,which I am willing to bet is not the reality.

My Mum, in the 60's, worked with a girl who had struggled to buy a house. When she came to work during the day she drew her curtains as they had no furniture only a bed. She did not want anyone to see she had nothing. Those were the days. I think the younger generation should be given the true facts. No holidays until you were established and had paid the bills.

Very sensible, granjura, which is what DH's cousin has done, I expect they are thankful they bought a flat in the UK - mainly to come back to see the DGC but could be needed in future, who knows.

It worries me that my own millennial is renting, most of the available rentals are short leases and insecure (not in this country either).
But their way of life is quite different to that my older DC too.