Is Jenni Murray right about transgender?

Taken to its logical conclusion this psychologist's advice could be used by a trans M who identifies as F but raped a woman, as defence because s/he was struggling with his/her identity.
It's like one step forward, three back for we women.

That's awful LumpySpacedPrincess, (your link to advice of TB) most bullying comes from a place of damaged vulnerability but thats no excuse.

I do fear for our young women, the world seems to be sliding backwards as regards protection rights and consideration.

I like this from Steven Pinker:

This advice, and I use the term very loosely, offered to a concerned grandparent is utterly disgusting, basically put up and shut up.

Another aspect of the subject, it's not just in the West that there's a conflict over gender identity:
www.killyourdarlings.com.au/2013/05/men-with-the-souls-of-women-indonesias-transgender-waria/
Nothing about F to M though.

I listened to half the link Baubles, hideous. I agree with the information from the psychologist quoted by an earlier poster, that many issues relating to sexual identity issues are psychological rather than physiological in origin. I read recently that more people with autism than those who aren't on the ASD spectrum, report sexual identity problems. That isn't surprising, given the challenges presented to young people in particular, when trying to understand their 'difference'.

I heard the news reports about the transgender athlete who attempted to murder the individual who reported she had not provided testosterone levels, she also injured two people who went to her victims aid.

Well, here's a nice one that will be logged in the female crime statistics - as MRAs love to say, "women are violent too".

So, will she/he be in a female prison?

This is about much more than bathrooms. MtoF trans retain the crime levels of men. It's just that they get logged in the female crime statistics. The world is a truly loopy place.

Insignificant by comparison to trying to murder someone, but worth noting that she/he had been running against females and winning and the row was provoked because she/he had not provided testosterone levels.

www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-39266777

So the last few days along has seen two reports of transgender rapists (bepenised) and an attempted murderer.

And still people say "move along, nothing to see here".

Well said Rigby46.

I think trans-women are focusing on the 'wrong' group, it isn't mostly women born as women who shape our society including violence or discrimination - its mostly men in power and who do this.

If there wasn't this blindness the TG lobby would spot this and focus on patriarchy instead f trying allegedly to make 'born' women's lives harder - or making born women justify their biology?

While watching the YouTube link posted by baubles, I noticed one entitled 'How to simulate a period for trans women'. Ffs! I didn't watch it. But why on earth would you want to go to that extent. 'Simulate' is right. Bet they don't experience the monthly cramps though.

Baubles, worrying!

I think this word "identifies" is significant. It seems to have become the norm that
"I am what I say I am" whether talented or not wannabe pop star, vanity publishing author artist (likewise) or now "woman".
If I claim I identify with an RSC class actor, a supermodel or multimillionaire, that doesn't make me one. Even people who are entirely of white European/Caucasian background claiming they "identify" as black?
Has the world gone mad?
And is this not profoundly disrespectful to genuine cases of misidentified gender at birth, children who are both?

Has anyone seen this?

m.youtube.com/watch?v=uzwMJAFWLtQ

Afraid I've come rather late to this thread and have read some but not all posts. Very interesting thread, imo with some very well informed points being put.

The article by Rachel Johnson made a lot of sense to me. I heard a discussion on R4 a while ago where one of the guests was a psychologist. In his opinion, many (if not all) transgender issues had a psychological rather than a physiological base.

I'm inclined to agree. For one thing, bodily mutilation is so extreme as to be unthinkable for most people. Secondly, it appears that many who have been through this process are still not happy.

And thirdly, many men who 'become' women (in whatever guise), still seem to prefer female sexual partners. So to all intents and purposes, they are true to their birth gender.

Maybe we should be free to accept whatever gender a person wishes to display at whatever stage in their lives. I'm thinking this is a spectrum which everyone is on, somewhere. Maybe the position on that spectrum can change depending on circumstance. There will always be extremes at either end, but a lot of people are somewhere in the middle, inclining to one end or the other most of the time.

Doesn't answer the ladies loos issue, though....

I appreciate that the very elderly may not use the internet as much as even our generation, but all my friends of my age /older/younger use the internet for emails to each other and family, shopping (groceries, clothes) online newspapers, interest groups, like dogs, of course, downloading books from Amazon onto their Kindles, pictures of grandchildren, Skype or FaceTime, some are on Facebook and Twitter and no doubt Instagram and WhatsApp (although that has as yet passed me by!)
However I would be interested to know more about what you said here though Ankers
They have not heard of words that are almost everyday language on the internet
.

Completely agree Rigby, it's the redefinition that is the most dangerous.

I think internet bubbles, fake news and confirmation bias are very real and very dangerous, we all need to guard against them.

That is, Facebook use to see what the children of friends are up to in the main.

Even amongst my age group, yes they use it for internet shopping, at work, and occasionally in the evenings, but they are not on chat forums, and as far as I know dont use it for online media such as newspapers, only occasional Facebook use.

I know a huge amount of old people petra. And in particular the very old. Not much internet use at all, even if they have one.

If you are a born biological male hanging on to your penis – literally or figuratively – claiming to feel like a woman, then you certainly don't feel like me, a born biological woman, wife and mother or, if you must, cis-woman, and I would hazard a reasonably accurate guess that you don't feel like the other women who are close to me in my life.

Pen as a vehement opponent of gender identity becoming a protected characteristic, I have to say that safety in toilets is actually pretty low down my list of concerns . The issue is much deeper and greater than that as has been well aired on this thread . We should not be sleep walking into a world shaped by TAs and penised self identifying transwomen who want to deny the reality of our lived experiences as biological women, who want to define us as not being trans by calling us ' cis women', who want to invade all our safe ( and not just in the physical sense) women only spaces and our rights to have certain services offered to us by biological women, who want to deny us our achievements as women, in sport, the arts and sciences. I've just emailed my MP about the bill - I have to say it's a first for me to write to my MP and use the word 'penis' twice

Ankers From what you have stated on here, your still a relatively young woman. I'm amazed that you know a lot of people that don't use the internet. And by the way, the internet isn't a 'bubble'

Anyone any idea what the figures are for assaults on women in non-sex specific toilets? Sometimes we get carried away with an 'issue' that does not really exist.
Any assault is one too many but sadly women get assaulted in many places and I understood it was usually by heterosexual men & less often by trans/gay/lesbian people. Are we being dragged down a path to distract us from the bigger issue here?

This I find hard to believe.

The internet is quite a bubble. In real life, I can tell that not many of the people I talk to, regularly use the internet at all. Certainly not for chat.
They have not heard of words that are almost everyday language on the internet.

The internet connects people and forms movements, it also grooms and converts with distorted version of reality, it can be amazing, it can be hideous.

Absolutely. I am concerned about this in general as well, not just about this specific issue.