Is Jenni Murray right about transgender?

The recorded article said that both women had now been excluded permanently from the shelter, they were looking for somewhere together. As I said, they could both be asshats but I still believe that women have the right to sex segregated areas.

By the way I Love Cheese too! Great username!

Not what it says in the newspaper article
"“If that is to happen, people are typically given multiple warnings before they're asked to leave, and then there is always another resource that's made available,” she said.

The woman who says she was kicked out for 24 hours spent her night out of the shelter at a local hotel.

Note "her night"!

I think it comes from a scientific term that means matched, or aligned. the idea is that your gender matches your body but to a lot of women that's really insulting as they believe that gender is the way you are socialised by society, which is why it changes over time and place. The transgenderists believe that gender is innate.

I have a female body and a personality which is my own, I don't believe in gender.

What really gets my goat is that language is Very Very Important to trans activists. Respect the pronoun of choice, do not talk about female biology, burn books that mention female biology, well, they broke into a library, intimidated the female volunteers and poured wine on the books but you get the picture. So, the Words we use must be policed lest we offend, but the trans activists, indeed it's common everywhere, rename women as cis which is so deeply offensive to many.

The term cis confirms their whole theory, that everyone has an innate gender. So it is like telling a non Muslim that she is a Christian, even though she doesn't believe in any god.

What does CIS stand for? I know is is used to describe what I would describe as "a woman", but I don't know what the letters mean

She was vilified, yet Caitlyn Jenner receives a woman of the year award even though she had just been involved into an accident which killed a woman.

LSP, your comment 'Imagine if it was the first trilogy filmed by black directors and they were white when they filmed it then chose to black up at a later date.' made me think of Rachel Dolezal who identifies as black despite having no black genetic background. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Dolezal

and as for "cis" they can poke that. It's like being forced to choose a religion with no room left for people who aren't theists.

Yes, respect material reality but make provision for transmen and women. Surely that's better than expecting society to live in a permanent state of cognitive dissonance.

LSP - I'm absolutely with you. How very bloody dare they? It's exactly what the TRAs do - they want to eradicate the successes, safety and achievements of girls and women. Deny our very existence. And they have hardly started. There are transwomen who really disagree with this approach and some are brave enough to speak up - you can guess the abuse they get. WTF is wrong with a specific category of transwomen / transmen ( although the latter are not the problem and anyway men wouldn't let them take over even if they wanted to). Did you see Gaby Hinsliffe's article in the Guardian yesterday? She used the phrase 'cis women' as though it were non problematic . Liberal feminists - I've left that sisterhood thank you

This is the sort of thing I am on about.

Bridget Jones trilogy is the second movie trilogy to have had all female directors, quite an achievement.

When the article was first printed it was hailed as the first trilogy to be directed by women, until trans activists kicked up a fuss.

See the first trilogy with all female directors was the Matrix series, directed by The Wachowski sisters Except they were both men when they filmed the series, so there was no struggle to be taken seriously or all the other obstacles that women face in Hollywood.

They were men when they directed the Matrix. The bridget jones article was reprinted and first changed to second.

Now I think that's awful, really awful. Imagine if it was the first trilogy filmed by black directors and they were white when they filmed it then chose to black up at a later date.

She was trisher, then she was permanently excluded.

To be fair she could be an absolute asshat, they both could, but I still think that a woman should have access to female only space.

This is one example but the truth is that when the law changes we lose all access to female only anything as female is now impossible to define.

That's my concern, women can't compete with each other, meet without male bodied people, have girl only clubs, see female doctors, access correct sex based crime stats, use language to describe ourselves. It will all be gone.

That really, really concerns me. When I see a male rapist described as female, or a male cyclist winning a women's cycling event it makes me cross.

It's not fair and it could be dangerous.

But she wasn't kicked out on the street as some have said. She was removed for 24hours and accommodated in a local; hotel. With a shelter for 20 housing 26 it must be difficult to move people around.

There should be more places for anyone in trouble, all the people in this need a safe house and access to support. I do feel that women have the right to access sex segregated houses but there must be adequate provision made for transwomen escaping violent relationships, even if it's a separate bedroom.

www.castanet.net/news/Kelowna/191040/unease-over-shelter-guestShe did ask to be moved, or to have someone else to share with. That is concerning.

Also, the Kelowna women's shelter IS a shelter for abused women, it offers a safe place for women and children who have had to flee intimate partner violence, their motto is Ending abuse, building hope.

It probably was Penstemmon, they may well have knew that when they spoke out but still felt compelled to do.

A refuge, that I have had a working relationship with, has very strict rules about residents talking to the press. It makes the refuge more vulnerable to identification and puts all residents at risk of being traced. Many have gone there to escape from abusive or other unhappy situations.

Is that why the women were asked to leave rather than on their stance about a transgender residnet that may or may not have been a valid one?

Good point. But that is why they were thrown out.

I think what they should have done was waited until they were out. And then talked about it in non specific terms.
Though whether the newspaprer would have taken the story in that instance, I dont know.

If the principle is agreed then what would you do about someone who went to the press and spoke about a resident in the shelter Ankers just ignore them? If you did so it would send a signal that you can earn money by selling stories to the press.

The issue of transgender is irrelevant.

No it isnt! It is the whole point of why they spoke out.

The women could have asked to be moved

Well yes, but would it have been done? I dont know.

It doesn't require names for someone to identify people, just some small references to personal details can identify women to people who are trying o trace them. The principle of safety in a refuge or shelter is never give information to anyone about any of the residents, if it is waved in one case a precedent is set which could cause real difficulties for others.

True.

It doesn't require names for someone to identify people, just some small references to personal details can identify women to people who are trying o trace them. The principle of safety in a refuge or shelter is never give information to anyone about any of the residents, if it is waved in one case a precedent is set which could cause real difficulties for others. The women could have asked to be moved if they were uncomfortable without going to the press. The issue of transgender is irrelevant.

The women only exposed their own identity and they lost their right to safety, they were only putting themselves at risk because they felt strongly. I think it's unfair to think that they would go to the press and reveal the identity of other women in the shelter, why would they do that? They were both concerned about having to share a space with a male, that's all.

If someone will go the press with a story about transgender people in the shelter then perhaps they would also tell the press about other women in the shelter, making it easier for an abuser to trace them. You simply can't have someone who does this sort of thing in a place where people come to find shelter and safety, the story doesn't really matter, the principle does.

It isn't just safety is it, it's dignity, the females in the shelter have the right to dignity, at least I think so.

Maw - of course not all men are abusers, most men are bloody lovely.

However 98% of sexual violence is carried out by men, so I feel very strongly that women have the right to sex segregated areas.

Jessica Hambrook gained access to a women's shelter in Canada and sexually assaulted 4 vulnerable women so it has happened.

Women campaigned long and hard for sex segregated toilets and shelters, they weren't given to us, we fought for them and it took decades, centuries even.

I would march for trans facilities, or separate rooms for transgender individuals.

I am sure the transwoman in the shelter has suffered, obviously not Jessica Hambrook he was just an abuser, but the other lady. She doesn't get to trump someone else who is vulnerable though, they should both be respected.

That is just my opinion though, you're welcome to yours.