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Tafida Raqeeb

(25 Posts)
Namsnanny Thu 18-Jul-19 15:14:22

For those who haven’t read about her (and I was one until today) she is being held in hospital against her parents wishes, in intensive care. Her doctors say there is nothing to be done for her and she should be left to die.
Her parents have found a hospital in Italy who says they have the expertise and have offered to care for her.

My question is is the hospital liable to pay any financial costs her care in Italy would incur and is this why they won’t let her go?

pinkquartz Thu 18-Jul-19 15:17:13

I also wonder why won't they let her go?

EllanVannin Thu 18-Jul-19 15:36:53

They'll have to threaten to do the same thing as the parents of the little boy who needed Proton beam therapy for his brain tumour. The parents took the child to the hospital who offered the treatment, abroad.
I don't see why costs should come into it when one hospital is refusing further treatment when another has offered care.
Why does there always have to be legal challenges when it's a child in question ?

Namsnanny Thu 18-Jul-19 15:44:56

Ellenvallan....I don’t disagree, I just can’t find any info explaining their POV, and as most things come down to cash in the NHS I wondered if it was the case here?

JenniferEccles Thu 18-Jul-19 15:56:26

I don't know anything about this case, but it all boils down to whether the child's case is hopeless (as clearly the British doctors think it is) or whether there is a chance the treatment in Italy may work

As for costs, then without a doubt the parents will have to fund the treatment and assorted costs themselves, and that's how it should be

It would be totally wrong for the NHS to have to pick up the bill for treatment in a foreign country which may well not work.

Gonegirl Thu 18-Jul-19 16:07:11

I think the doctors caring for her in this country feel it would be too traumatic to move her.

JenniferEccles I find myself looking at your posts recently just to see how bad the latest one is going to be.

Feelingmyage55 Thu 18-Jul-19 16:13:51

I hope they let her go to Italy. After all Great Ormond Street in particular treats children from all over the world, both to the benefit of that child and to advance medical practice. If the hospital in Italy is offering help, is it not in the same spirit? Prayers for the whole family.

JenniferEccles Thu 18-Jul-19 16:16:25

We disagree in some opinions Gonegirl and that is perfectly ok.

These posts are all about folk giving their various thoughts on a variety of topics.

Wouldn't it be terribly boring if we all thought the same about everything?!

Gonegirl Thu 18-Jul-19 16:28:42

Ashya King appears to have benefitted from the Proton Beam therapy. This child's case could be quite different though.

JenniferEccles Thu 18-Jul-19 17:11:43

Or it could be similar to the poor Charlie Gard case.

EllanVannin Thu 18-Jul-19 17:21:32

Or is it because our hospitals are already facing billions for operations that have gone wrong ?

M0nica Fri 19-Jul-19 10:27:53

I think these cases are tragic. Many of these children have suffered throughout their short lives and really do have life limiting illnesses.

I can see both sides, the parents who will do anything to save the life of a much loved child and cannot face the idea that there is no hope for their beloved, and doctors, who know that the condition is incurable and very life limiting and that the child is in pain and feel it is best to let the illness follow a natural course to an imminent death.

Ashya King's case was very different to the other cases in the paper. He had cancer, an illness where treatments are available, even though their success rate is low. Many of these other children have been born with disabilities that are not amenable to such cures and will not be until doctors can change a childs whole genome.

Deedaa Fri 19-Jul-19 10:33:46

I've not read anything about this case, but if the child is in intensive care moving her to another country is going to be a huge operation and who is going to cover the cost? Will the Italians pay?

GillT57 Fri 19-Jul-19 11:33:35

Maybe I am in a picky mood, but I agree with Gonegirl about your comments. Jennifereccles,twice you have started by stating you know nothing about./have not heard of/have not read the thread and then give your opinion based on what? We are all entitled to our opinions, and hurrah for diversity and difference, but it really does help if you have at least got a little bit of information about what is being discussed, even if just by clicking on links which most people kindly and helpfully provide! grin

Gonegirl Fri 19-Jul-19 11:40:22

article here about this little girl


GillT57 Fri 19-Jul-19 11:56:35

Truly heartbreaking, thanks for the link

Namsnanny Fri 19-Jul-19 12:05:21

The problem for me is I’ve read all the newspaper articles and they all say the same thing.
If the parents wanted to pay fully for her transportation and care, would the hospital still refuse to let her go?

Gonegirl Fri 19-Jul-19 12:14:55

They are certainly fighting against it Namsnanny. It will probably go to the Courts.

Gonegirl Fri 19-Jul-19 12:15:44

Crowd Funding would most likely be on the cards.

Fennel Fri 19-Jul-19 12:34:30

Another aspect - if the parents are religious Muslims perhaps they don't accept removal of life support.
My FiL was in a coma after a stroke and husband managed to persuade the hospital not to withdraw life support. For religious reasons. FiL regained consciousness and lived another year, in reasonable health.

suziewoozie Fri 19-Jul-19 14:29:04

Such cases are incredibly sad. My starting point is that costs do not come into it at all so far as the hospital’s decision making is concerned. Their first duty is the best interests of the child and sometimes ( but actually very rarely) this is in conflict with what the parents want. I believe the parents have started legal action and now the courts will decide. It’s a pity when such cases go public - dreadful things happened with the Charlie Gard case - staff were harassed and sent death threats and parents with very sick children in the same hospital said the massed protests disturbed and upset the normal running of the hospital. Political figures and American lawyers and preachers from extreme ‘pro-life’ Evangelical groups came over and I believe really exploited his very young and grieving parents.

M0nica Fri 19-Jul-19 14:32:39

I do not think there is any question but that the NHS will not be expected to pay for any transfer to or treatment in Italy, I understand the doctor's argument is that the transfer itself will put incredible strain upon a terminally ill child and to no purpose. so that the best thing for her is to live her short remaining life in the hospital she is now in with staff and doctors who know and understand not just the illness but the child.

librarylady Sat 20-Jul-19 10:05:00

I don't often post but have been following this for a few days. I have signed the petition to let Tafida be taken to Italy. The parents are apparently covering the costs (there was a GoFundMe type page but it seemed to disappear) and although the Italian hospital only seems to be offering to keep her on life support until she wakes from her coma (?) I don't see why she should not have that chance IF it is safe to transport her.

Unfortunately this is shaping up to be another Gard/Evans case, with Steadfast Onlus already manouvering themselves into position to 'help'. The parents in this case are clearly highly intelligent people who both hold down responsible jobs - but I think where one's children are involved, any threat to their well being (let alone their life) means any rational judgement will go to the wall if there is even a tiny glimmer of hope.

GabriellaG54 Sat 20-Jul-19 10:43:46

May I, with respect, correct a minor point?
The hospital in Italy did not say they had expertise lacking in the UK.
They admit that there is nothing they can do that cannot be done in the UK to help the child.
What they are prepared to do is to look after the child until she wakes from her present state, something doctors in the UK say is a fruitless exercise.
I am quoting (not verbatim) what has been published in the press and copied online.

suziewoozie Sat 20-Jul-19 10:45:26

Of course we only get one side in stories like this as the hospital is bound by confidentiality. The parents give what they perceive to be the ‘facts’ but in situations like this they inevitably hear what they want to hear which is understandable. These disputed cases are very very rare - every year parents and medical staff work together to ease the death of children without court action. I truly despise those who jump on bandwagons like this.In the Charlie Gard case the doctor so full of promises never even examined the boy and there was some talk of his having a financial interest in the experimental ‘treatment’ on offer. Nigel Farage also used the case to illustrate the evils of state power. And of course Trump jumped in - president of a country where children’s lives are so precious that lack of affordable health care results in shockingly high infant mortality rates in poor southern states. I don’t think any of us have got the right to interfere in cases like this and stoke hatred towards the medical staff and hospital concerned. Let the courts now decide and leave them all in peace in this sadness