Mridul Wadhwa - Male CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis

If you abuse or denigrate anyone in any public house the landlord and staff have the right to remove you, whatever the reason. I have no doubt that there are women who are abusive, particularly after a few drinks. Why should the staff be expected to serve them? If you don't like the atmosphere, the staff or the clientele then don't drink there.
You may be offended by the term TERF but transpeople are offended by being misgendered. And some women recognise that transwomen are amongst us and have been with us in every battle we've fought so we really don't regard them as a problem.
TERF isn't a term I would use but then I don't believe hatred and discrimination has any place in feminism.

Yes, I know, and I agree that it's worrying. I know several young women who won't buy Harry Potter books for their children because they (mistakenly, IMO) think that JK Rowling is transphobic. People are getting tied up in knots in workplaces because HR departments don't fully understand where Stonewall ends and the law begins, and nobody wants to be the one to do or say the 'wrong thing', and risk the wrath of people who think they are being supportive of minorities.

It's bit like back in the day when people thought they were being anti-racist by complaining when they heard anyone talking about black bin liners or whatever. It's one thing to be supportive of transpeople wanting to live 'normal' lives, and another to support those who are Hell bent on putting men's rights ahead of women's.

Just, if you're not Doodledog, you're basing your opinion on something you have no experience of and speaking for people you have no contact with. Which makes it totally theoretical.

If you have a strong stomach, have a look at wingsoverscotland.com/the-quiet-part-out-loud/

even more worrying is that the label TERF and the attacks on line and the ‘cancelling’ is being perpetrated not just by transgenders, but by some women.

Not just some women. If you live in Scotland, Alex Staniforth and Claire Miller of the Scottish Green Party (the same party who supports Mridul Wadwha) are in full support of a man who self identifies as a woman, describing natal women as "terfs and cunts".

Doodledog, even more worrying is that the label TERF and the attacks on line and the ‘cancelling’ is being perpetrated not just by transgenders, but by some women. My DD says the abuse at gatherings sometimes comes from women with young children in pushchairs or older.

Chewbacca

Yes Peasblossom and it's becoming increasingly clear that any woman, who dares to question the validity of a man, presenting himself as a woman, is a terf and can be subjected to any amount of abuse because, "they aren't people". The sheer aggression, anger and hatred displayed towards women is deeply concerning.

It is indeed, Chewbacca, and the fact that their views are becoming enshrined in law, or in the policies of organisations with far-reaching influence is setting back the rights of women immeasurably. Men can access all areas and there is nothing a woman can do, and there is nowhere that she can go to ensure that she is in a purely female space. For anyone to call someone else a 'non-person' is an act of violence, yet this sort of thing is creeping into the mainstream.

I fear for our daughters and granddaughters, and genuinely feel that if we don't step in to stop this misogyny in its tracks they will have every right to resent us.

Nothing more to do with my bias than yours trisher and I’ve been to polite to mention that. I probably know MW as well as you do. I know what I’ve read and what information I’ve been given by some of those closer to the problem. It’s still wrong that a person of the male sex is dealing with women’s rape crises but the remarks and the decisions that he did, endorsed how wrong it is.

trisher

She isn't a rape counsellor nor has she claimed to be. But the question is very valid. How will someone with her expertise being removed from the field of violence against women in any way benefit the communities she understands?
This thread was raised about her. Is it at all possible that she is of benefit to women in minority immigrant communities? Or do you simply reject her because she is transgender?

MW being removed from the field of violence against women is not what the thread is about, and I don't remember anyone saying that she should be. My objection is to her heading up a rape crisis centre, and being able to make policy decisions, when they include telling women who have been raped to 'reframe their trauma'.

It is clear from that, and from the fact that she lied on her application that she is not the best person for the job. I don't 'reject her' at all, and don't care about her gender except insofar as she has very clear TRA agenda which is not appropriate for someone in the role she holds.

Yes Peasblossom and it's becoming increasingly clear that any woman, who dares to question the validity of a man, presenting himself as a woman, is a terf and can be subjected to any amount of abuse because, "they aren't people". The sheer aggression, anger and hatred displayed towards women is deeply concerning.

Terf is a derogatory and abuse term given by the Trans community to anybody that raises the question of the erosion of women’s rights.

Not sick ..... dick. This trans woman has a deep hatred of women.

mebulous entity
I wish I was one of those trans girls who could slap her sick on your face but my sick is so smol. My bewbs on the other hand....

She isn't a rape counsellor nor has she claimed to be. But the question is very valid. How will someone with her expertise being removed from the field of violence against women in any way benefit the communities she understands?
This thread was raised about her. Is it at all possible that she is of benefit to women in minority immigrant communities? Or do you simply reject her because she is transgender?

On Twitter the member of staff who asked the women to leave described them as "TERFs"
(trans exclusionary radical feminists, a term regarded as derogatory by those who oppose gender reforms) and said: “I had to call the police because they were making my staff and other customers feel uncomfortable

His Twitter name is mebulous entity" and this was one of his posts:

mebulous entity
'^'mother of fucking god you'll never believe who i just had to kick out my bar^
literally terfs. i had to call the police because they were making my staff and other customers feel threatened''

Lt. Aldo 'Chel' Raine (respondent)
''You can call the police on terfs because they aren't people. It's ethical.''

mebulous entity
Terfs are now barred fae doctors. If you come in at any time I will call the police. You're a hate movement and you cannot behave in a pub. You're a fucking disgrace. I pity any poor cunt that has to deal with you in the future.

Have your own space, just not in my pub yo
It makes my pee pee hard

Rather worryingly, he claims that he's a ""trained archaeologist, a bartender, a DJ, burlesque and child entertainer.

His Twitter profile says: AGP porn addict male, cumbrained, submissive, moisturised,

“Any terfs see this, I tried to be civil with you and you failed. You're the worst customers ever. You dinnae belong in pubs... or society... you made my staff and other customers uncomfortable. I hope you understand just how much normal society despises you.”

trisher

Doodledog In view of the fact that MW is one of the few Asian women working in the field of violence, that she speaks several languages and has experience of minority immigrant cultures and expertise on forced marriage I find your or doesn't speak English very well hilarious. How will getting rid of someone with her knowledge and experience help such women?

Are you serious?

I was not talking specifically about the Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre, but about anywhere where a woman may be examined or intimately touched by a male-bodies person. I would have thought that would be obvious, as there is never a need for counsellors to intimately examine their clients, and in any event, the CEO is unlikely to be on hand to deal with every client in a city centre RCS.

If that post wasn't you being determined to pick holes in mine I don't know what is.

Has MW in anyway been agressive to anyone Mollygo? Or is that a perception based on your bias against her?

Did anyone see the news item yesterday about the group of women, who were asked to leave an Edinburgh pub, because they were "transphobic"?

Copied from Edinburgh News:
The women, who allege they were threatened by bar staff, left after officers were called to Doctors, on Forrest Road, on Saturday night. However one of the pub’s employees, who describes themselves as an “AGP porn addict male” on their Twitter account, said it was staff who felt threatened by the women who were “belligerent”.
The employee’s account also states they identify as they/she.
Now Greene King, the chain which runs the pub – and 19 other premises in Edinburgh – has launched an internal investigation and police enquiries are also continuing.

The pub's member of staff, who asked the women to leave has a Twitter account and his comments there are astonishing.

‘Deep seated and an integral part of a patriarchal society’ which some transwomen are trying to use against women’s rights. The fact that the person in the title of this thread is sexually a man is a good example.

Doodledog In view of the fact that MW is one of the few Asian women working in the field of violence, that she speaks several languages and has experience of minority immigrant cultures and expertise on forced marriage I find your or doesn't speak English very well hilarious. How will getting rid of someone with her knowledge and experience help such women?

Of course I "get" the cartoon Mollygo I simply don't see how targetting a minority group in any way advances feminist aims or indeed does anything but play to the tune of patriachy which has always been to seperate and divide.
As for the "Reframe your trauma" I think it is deeply offensive to anyone who has been subjected to any violence and I think you should read MW's words which I posted earlier
What we can do, when they are ready and if they are interested, is to help them take part in wider discussions about how violence against women is a cause and a consequence of a deeply unequal and sexist society. Seeing it through this lens can, potentially, empower survivors to not feel alone (which is so important when they may be feeling blame or shame) and to understand and progress their recovery. These conversations can happen as part of support, if survivors are looking to have that conversation with their support worker; or they can join groupwork or workshops. This is what is meant by “reframing trauma
What I see emerging is a lot of disagreement and argument about things that actually haven't been said or meant whilst the actual roots of agression and violence which are deep seated and an integral part of a patriachal society flourish and prosper.

“I expect there are extremists in any group”.

If you’d like to Google terms like ‘lesbian erasure” “gay erasure” trisher you’ll see that it’s not just a few extremist, but a stated trans policy that has led to demonstrations throughout Europe, America and Australia.

Sorry, that was to trisher.

I'm honestly not trying to find fault with your solution, I just don't think it is viable. The fundamental difference I think, is that I see women's rights as paramount here. That is not to say that I don't think that transpeople have rights - it's just that I don't think that women should automatically have to put their own feelings second.

However much you or anyone else feels that TWAW, the fact is that there are women who have perfectly valid reasons to have their rights not to be touched by male-bodied people respected, and you just don't seem to accept that. Saying that women can refuse etc etc just doesn't cut it. If someone has been raped, or is otherwise traumatised, or doesn't speak English very well, or is just not very confident, they may not want or be able to make a case for something, particularly when it is not immediately obvious that there is a case to be made.

A choice women shouldn’t have to make.