Am I doomed to be a burden on my children?

Re clearing the house, I’d say the same to dds, MOnica - take what you want (plus I’ve made a list of anything of value, in case they don’t realise) and get the house clearance people in for the rest.

I was involved with clearing my mother’s house after she finally moved to a care home at 89. In a way it was worse than after someone has died (I’ve done both) - you feel as if you’re throwing their life away. There were so many items with some sentimental value, but which none of us had room for.

My sister IL had the great idea of advertising an ‘open afternoon’ on the local Freecycle - we put a lot of stuff that didn’t seem quite good enough for the charity shop, but wasn’t quite bad enough for the tip - in the sitting room. It was amazing what people came and took away.

We were amazingly lucky with the old aunt’s flat, though - she had not been a hoarder, and the flat was a nice one close to the sea on the S coast. The people who eventually bought it, as a holiday home, asked us to leave all the furnishings, crockery and cutlery, etc., they would replace it as and when. So it was just a case of removing anything strictly personal, or of value, not that there was much of that at all.

When I suggested to DC that when we die, they take what they want and then get house clearers in, they went ballistic, told me that slwoly unpacking and disposing of house contents was a part of the mourning process.

As for all this thinning down house and contents ahead of death to make life easier, I can think of no good reason for that, supposing you do thin down and chuck out etc etc and then live for decades after?

Admittedly, I am not a hoarder, I am a by nature a chicker outer. All we have in our loft is suitcases and Christmas decorations, the car lives in the garage, I have half empty cupboards and empty drawers in every bedroom. We do have an awful lot of books and pictures, but DS wants most of mine as his job and my main interest are the same.

You're lucky you have children, especially if you all get along together really well and they might be happy to look after you as you get older. If you don't want to be a burden, look after your health especially your bone health. A broken hip in your 60s (even if you pretty spritely now) could have a terrible impact on your whole family. Save whatever money you can (forget about having the 'latest' this, that and everything else). Get you funeral arranged in advance, get LPA's arranged. If you're a bit of a hoarder or collector, get rid of it now because your kids will not want it, no matter how much it means to you. I say this because in the last 18 months I've cared for a parent, watched her die, cleared their rented house (mum and dad) and arranged a funeral. Now I'm being hit with the sadness, the depression, the hopelessness and the guilt of not being a good enough carer. If I didn't have much in the way of mental health problems two years ago, I've certainly got them now. I know this all seems pretty doom and gloom stuff but I've news for you. It's real life (and death).

The most demanding one we had was not a parent but a childless old aunt of dh. She had plenty of money but loathed spending any of it, so once she became less able to manage she expected friends and neighbours to do the honours. They should do it ‘for love’.

But most of her neighbours were themselves elderly and decrepit, so I’d have them on the phone half crying that they couldn’t cope any more. And we lived a 2 hour drive away, but that didn’t stop her expecting dh to drop everything and go down when he’d just come off a long night flight for work, and was exhausted.

Her ‘best’ was expecting a bridge-circle friend to drive 20 minutes each way every night, to fill her hot water bottles!
More than once dh arranged carers for her, but she always rejected them - too loud, too ‘common’ etc.

Eventually a care home was the only way, but boy, trying to get her to accept it….. On the final day, when there was a place just across the road waiting for her, dh was with her all day until gone 9 pm, and it was only when he finally said he was going home now, did she give in.

And even then, she insisted on dh paying the fees (and she’d pay him back) ‘because if they realise that I’ve got money, they’ll find a way to steal it.’

I hope cases like hers are rare, but I suspect not!

We have a large bungalow and fair sized garden. Soon we hope to downsize to somewhere quite small. It is partly because, if I am ever left on my own, I want to be able to cope and not have to ask my AC to do things for me. I'm trying to be forward-thinking and am also getting rid of lots of stuff which I know my children won't want. As for being grumpy etc, yes I will definitely be. It's already happening!

I too , especially having seen this . I definitely don't want to be a " problem " for my children. X

I think that we are the first generation to do the both ends of life support. Elderly parents and helping with our children's offspring. Therefore double end guilt. It's so difficult and personal life limiting. X

Buffy if your SiL is now in a care home, you will soon be able to stop running backwards and forwards getting things for her. I expect her home will now have to be emptied and sold. Will all of that be down to you too? I hope she has other relatives who can help.

I am glad your SIL is somewhere safe Buffy and you can relax a little.

Just settled my sister-in-law in a Care Home - assisted living. She’s not ill but says she wants babying. Though older than her we have been at her beck and call, running errands, searching for things at her home an hour away. We never get so much as a thank you. I’m becoming more than a tad resentful,

I bumped into my very fit and healthy gardening lady today - her husband, also very fit and healthy, had a stroke about eight weeks ago. I think they are both mid 40's. He is back to work and on statins and not feeling at all well. Bad health can strike so unexpectedly.

Reading these posts makes you realise health is wealth. I don’t want to get really old.

My mum was probably the most active person I knew, but also ended up with the most terrible arthritis I've ever seen.

MoorlandMooner

Mattsmum2 When you say 'Get moving now and do it constantly' do you mean move house? That sounds exhausting!

No move as in walk, bend, stretch, stand on one leg, keep active. ?

Granny23 for a short intense period I was the carer for an elderly aunt and uncle, both with dementia.

I experienced almost everything you mentioned, including social workers who would not make home visits because the village was too far from their office, 25 miles, but were very grateful that I was prepared to make the same journey up to twice a day. They wouldn't make hospital visits either because instead of being taken to the in-county hospital 30 miles away, they were taken 5 miles and half a mile over the county border, and SW didn't visit out of county and so it went on and on. Thankfully after 3 months they went into care.

What made it worse was that, at the time I was a volunteer Home Advisor with Age Concern (as was) and another cousin, a NHS hospital Consultant, was also involved and even with our joint professional expertise and her medical clout, we were also defeated by the system.

I'm determined not to put our DCs through my recent experiences with my very elderly, frail mum.At every step of the way she has resisted any help because she 'can manage'.That has been her mantra since her early 90s with failing eyesight and mobility.But she has only managed because between us we have run backwards and forwards.DH and I found some sheltered accommodation for her to consider a few years ago and she was for once open to the suggestion-until another relative put their spoke in and told her she should stay put.Consequently my mum has remained in her own home but anything but independent.And now we're at crisis point wading through social services trying to get help.It really has made us both think about forward planning for extreme old age-old we reach it.I feel I'm ageing rapidly at present with everything!

Monica You have been fortunate indeed and I must stress that I am glad for you and your family.

But here comes the However Until you have had to wade through the vagaries of the "system", particularly if you do not have substantial spare cash to mitigate the problems (almost all our savings went on care for my DH) then you can have no idea of the stresses and strains involved. e,g, - Waiting for a place to become available, Social worker going on extended sick leave, refusal to accept POA because it had been registered too late (person had lost capacity) promises of adaptions for house which never materialise, no available respite care to allow you a break,uncooperative siblings, a fall and broken hip which changes everything overnight, etc.

No amount of preplanning, nor the ability to save up for your old age can guarantee an easy ride through later years for the elderly nor their families although it is still wise to consider the future and make whatever preparations you can

Why is everyone assuming that if they get old and a bit frail, they will be a burden on their children? In most cases you are only a burden if you make yourself a burden, and I am not talking about any heroics of the 'I never bother my children' variety.

Whether we are a burden is entirely up to us. Dementia is difficult, we do become dependent, but once in care, we are as dependent on our children as we are demanding, but if you do not have dementia, then sensible living decisions, accepting or purchasing care as needed, not expecting our children to run their lives round us and being adaptable and flexible and most of all talking to your children about things, should do much to avoid being a burden.

We have no history of older people being a burden in our family. We are fortunate to not have had to deal with dementia, but apart from that, we have had parents who were practical in their attitudes to extreme old age, bought in care, where needed, made adjustments to their lives and enjoyed them until close to the end.

Granny23 I hardly know what to say, you have certainly done more than your fair share of caring for others. Please look after yourself now.

This thread covers exactly where I am at the moment. Both my Grandfathers "died in harness" before I was born. One Granny had a spinster daughter who lived with her, the other a son, both DGMs died suddenly in their mid 70s, so my DM and DF were never burdened with caring responsibilities.

Sadly for me this was not to be the case. My own DM suffered from anxiety and depression and was always 'ill' or unable to cope, demanding help from her DDs, particularly me as she and DF moved to a flat just round the corner.
My DH was an only child. His DM was acknowledged by all as a 'nightmare' and she showed animosity towards me from the day we met. Nevertheless, once FIL was diagnosed with Dementia, and admitted to a mental health hospital, she demanded that she should come to live with us. Thankfully DH said no way. However she would not visit FIL (too upsetting) so I became his only visitor because I was already visiting my maiden aunt who was in the same facility.

So, there I was mid 50's. having an awful menopause, working 2 jobs (as was DH) caring for my DM, MIL, DH's Maiden Aunt (housebound after she broke her hip) sharing responsibilities for my Maiden Aunt with my sister and trying to fit in visits to my DDs - both then at University. At one point 4 of them were in different hospitals simultaneously and I could not win because each expected me to be there at every visiting time.

Then when we had a year when all five of them died' A few years of respite then my DF died, I was made redundant, had a 'breakdown and my sister (whose husband was dying of Cancer) and I become responsible for my Dad's brother, who had developed dementia & eventually had to be sectioned as he refused to move into a local care home, where, in fact he flourished and had a good few years.

Then it was my DH who began to show symptoms of Dementia, cared for at home by me for 4 years until it all became too much for me, then a move to the same care home until he died last September.

Because of all this my DDs are well aware that it is a move to the same Home as soon as I become unable to function independently. They already do so much for me, when I tell them it is too much they insist that it is their pleasure to be useful and I should accept their help with good grace.

Sorry for the long diatribe, but I have recorded it in full to illustrate how chance can lay an impossible burden on one pair of shoulders.

In cases where the person has full mental capacity, I’d agree absolutely, mokryna.
But in the case of dementia, which is incurable, is only ever going to get worse, and - if the person doesn’t die in the meantime - will eventually result in double incontinence and a total loss of dignity - I can’t think it at all kind to ‘strive to keep alive’ in such circumstances.

Not that the question of ‘striving’ ever arose with my mother, who thanks to the constitution of a rhinoceros went on to 97 with advanced dementia, but I was always painfully aware of how her former, very private self would have been so horrified at the pitiful state she was in for her final years.

One of my students, in one of my conversation classes, aged 95 had heart treatment through choice and why not, she was intelligent active person and was told she could have a heart attack at any time if she didn’t go through with it.
However, a younger student’s mother was operated for cancer which neither she nor her mother wanted and just made her weaker.
Every case is different. We mustn’t give an age to refuse treatment when life can be enjoyed.
That being said for myself, if I am in pain and/or not enjoying life wherever I am, I would prefer to have non-voluntary euthanasia.

jaylucy

We can pre pay for and even arrange our own funerals well in advance.
We can also sign paperwork that we do not want to be resuscitated.
It's a shame that we can not make plans in advance for when we need extra help either before we become physically incapacitated or mentally incapacitated. It would save a few problems - you wouldn't feel a burden to your family because you had already made advance plans of what you wanted to happen and maybe even made the choice of where you wanted to go - all decisions taken out of your family's hands and they would be happy knowing it was what you wanted!

You can at least put in place a Health and Welfare Power of Attorney (as well as the finances one) with your own added paragraph in the space provided, to state your wishes if you become mentally incapable, or otherwise unable to state them (e.g. after a major stroke).

This is in addition to any ‘do not resuscitate’ direction in your medical notes. That will apply only in very specific cases and will not prevent any other ‘striving to keep alive’ that you might not want.

E.g. I heard of a case of an over 90 year old with at least moderate dementia, being given a pacemaker. It was the relatives’ choice, even though they’d asked medics what would happen if s/he didn’t have it, and were told that s/he would most probably drift away in their sleep.

madeleine45

I have lived abroad , sorted my own way out with a child of two living in syria, travelled about and never been near enough to my family to be able to rely on anyone to help me . Looked after my husband until he died, on my own and am now living with cancer and a bad back. I do not have the money to contemplate living in any sort of care home style place even if I wanted to . I did hospital car service 3 days a week for 10 years, and saw so many people having to move somewhere they would not have chosen through ill health, because they did not want to leave a loved home. So I moved here a couple of months ago to a ground floor flat, leaving my 3 bed semi but more importantly my beloved big garden. It was a wrench especially giving up my piano, but I shall get myself sorted out eventually and have got my independance , which I value, am now near to a train station and buses if I have to give up driving . It was a very difficult move as had been in my last property for the longest time I have spent in one house of 21 years to sort out and with covid it made it extremely difficult and could not have family or friends to help. But the most important thing is I am still doing it my way!! However my body behaves my brain , at the moment, is working ok, and I can listen to radio 3 all day and not bother anyone else. Stephanie Cole in waiting for god has used much of my ideas and I must have been a role model. ! I intend to carry on being myself and living my own way, eating what I like, doing as I please, within reason. If I cant sleep and want to wander around at three am, reading or going on the internet it is up to me. In particular with the covid situation seeing how people have been treated in care homes I do not intend to join them unless I can help it. There may have been genuine reasons for it but to be controlled and told what you can and cant do and being stuck in one room sounds more like prison than a home to me. I stuck to the rules and was also shielding because of the cancer but I still felt in charge of my own life and was behaving appropriately because it was the right thing to do and not because I was told or forced to do something by other people. So I hope to stay here for as long as possible and make the most of what I can , here in Yorkshire, where I want to be for as long as I can. Friends, music, reading and walking and being able to go up into Swaledale or to the coast give me much pleasure and hopefully I should be able to continue to have those for a long time and dont cost a lot of money so have done the best that I can to organise my life situation and not be dependant for now. What the future brings I cannot say but by moving I have done a lot of sorting out so that will not be a hassle for the family . After many years of looking out for other people I think working out a good solution for ourselves matters. Leaving friends of many years to live near family who are probably out at work and you would not see very much is a big step to take. Also especially in the present circumstances there is the possibility of the family having to move for job reasons and you could end up alone in an area you dont know or dont particularly like.

We do need to help ourselves by moving to a place that is suitable for an 80 yr old when we retire, being near public transport when we can't drive any more.
I've always been shocked by the newly-retired talking about 'moving to the country'.

I have 3 daughters and 1 son.
My ex had a refrain 'i'll be alright in old age plenty to look after me'.