The image of the royal family

M0nica

Why don't we sometimes talk about what is good about Britain for a change?

I tried on another thread but was told I was in denial.

If you start a thread M0nica, I'd be happy to take part, seriously.

Why don't we sometimes talk about what is good about Britain for a change?

What’s wrong with Britain? Let’s start with the monarchy

The Royal Family’s archaic-seeming rules and customs obscure its deep connections with modern global corporate power
www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/whats-wrong-with-britain-lets-start-with-the-monarchy/

That's me

Alegrias, if I had known you were the source I wouldn’t have questioned it. Unimpeachable.

Calistemon

Do you have an issue with foreign men as a result RVK1CR? Thu 04-Nov-21 14:42:54

They're not all bad.

No, only foreign men who marry English women who are wealthier than they are and benefit from that wealth (DH wouldn’t be on the acceptable list either then, but like PP he wouldn’t care.)
Being foreign, not wealthy like your wife, using helicopters and doing your own thing after you retire . . . Anything else?

Germanshepherdsmum

Ah, GN, that well respected source! Would they want to? Would she want to? She will be a foreigner!

Twas me! I am that source.

So: Would they want to - sadly for me, yes. Support for the monarchy is as strong in Scotland as it in rUK.

Would she want to : Well its a monarchy. As so many people keep telling us on here, they do it even if they don't want to. So she doesn't get a choice.

She won't be a foreigner. Any more than she's a foreigner in Canada. Or Australia. Or New Zealand. Or ... well anywhere else she's queen of. And her mum was born in Scotland so we can get her dual nationality ?

Ah, GN, that well respected source! Would they want to? Would she want to? She will be a foreigner!

Germanshepherdsmum

I would beg to differentiate between the Spanish and British monarchs but here we have a Queen who has steadfastly dedicated her life to the job and two heirs who have been trained in the same vein so I don’t foresee a crisis with our monarchy within my lifetime or within that of the next generation. George is of course a completely unknown quantity and will be for a long while. There is unlikely I think to be a referendum within my lifetime but it may come one day. In principle though I have no problem with the current system, HM so long as she remains mentally capable, Charles (or Camilla) or William. I have no problem with the principles of aristocracy (other than primogeniture) or inherited wealth either but I respect the right of others to hold different views even though I may profoundly disagree with some of those I hear and read.

But Germanshepherdsmum we've had Prime Ministers who, although we may not all have agreed with their politics or methods, have tried to do their best for the country and the people in it. Brown for instance, or May.

So if you can bring up Berlusconi as an example of how voting for a leader doesn't work, I can bring up Juan Carlos as an example of how a monarchy can go wrong.

Apparently the Scots may still be entitled to claim the Queen as Head of State

I'm really not sure how to comment on that.... ???

I would beg to differentiate between the Spanish and British monarchs but here we have a Queen who has steadfastly dedicated her life to the job and two heirs who have been trained in the same vein so I don’t foresee a crisis with our monarchy within my lifetime or within that of the next generation. George is of course a completely unknown quantity and will be for a long while. There is unlikely I think to be a referendum within my lifetime but it may come one day. In principle though I have no problem with the current system, HM so long as she remains mentally capable, Charles (or Camilla) or William. I have no problem with the principles of aristocracy (other than primogeniture) or inherited wealth either but I respect the right of others to hold different views even though I may profoundly disagree with some of those I hear and read.

.^Anyway if you get independence you can have your elected Head of State^.

Apparently the Scots may still be entitled to claim the Queen as Head of State after independence, or so I think I read on GN Germanshepherdsmum

If we do have a referendum on the continuation of the monarchy, I don't think it should happen until after the Scots have had their next referendum on independence.

trisher

Wasn't "Phil the Greek" a term used by the RF for him when he first courted the Queen? Doesn't that make it completely acceptable because we all know the RF can't possibly be at all racist

@Trisher. You are correct . Back then the queen mum was not keen on him and it took a while for her to agree. I think she wanted a landed gentry/duke type chap with his own fortune for her eldest child.

Germanshepherdsmum

I have no problem with democracy Alegrias but I'm happy with our existing system of inherited monarchy, which so far as I'm aware has not been put to the vote. It provides stability. If it ever were the subject of a referendum, you know which way I'd vote and I respect the fact that others have different views. Anyway if you get independence you can have your elected Head of State.

That's fair enough Germanshepherdsmum, being happy with the status quo is a perfectly valid position. But when people start saying that we shouldn't think about changing it because in the past some people who have been elected turned out not to be very good? Where do we go from there?

King Juan Carlos of Spain turned out to be a bit of a wrong 'un - by your yardstick that means we shouldn't think of having kings and queens because some of them have been bad at their jobs.

Do you have an issue with foreign men as a result RVK1CR? Thu 04-Nov-21 14:42:54

They're not all bad.

I have no problem with democracy Alegrias but I'm happy with our existing system of inherited monarchy, which so far as I'm aware has not been put to the vote. It provides stability. If it ever were the subject of a referendum, you know which way I'd vote and I respect the fact that others have different views. Anyway if you get independence you can have your elected Head of State.

@Mollygo. No offence meant, I married a foreign man years ago and he turned out to be a nasty violent bully. Regarding Phil, he was a penniless Greek prince who soon settled into a "comfy" life at the palace and used helicopters on a regular basis. I know he started an award scheme but he certainly knew where his bread was buttered. When he finally retired he just left the queen in London and scooted up to Sandringham to spend his days painting while having staff to pander to his every need.

Germanshepherdsmum

I’m aware of his status Alegrias.

So its just democracy you have a problem with?

Germanshepherdsmum

I say one word about elected leaders. Berlusconi.

Yes, as an argument for getting rid of an elected prime minister it can't be beat.

I’m aware of his status Alegrias.

grany often put the president of Ireland forward as an example.

Before becoming President of Ireland he was president of
the Labour Party and had the Labour party’s nomination for the presidency.

We know how money is poured into the tory party by wealthy
donors, would there be a candidate for president supported by
the tory party, v a candidate supported by the Labour Party and unions.

So what, should we give up on democracy?

Berlusconi was Prime Minister by the way, not head of state. Just like our own dear Boris.

I say one word about elected leaders. Berlusconi.

Yes to be fair having a weekly visit from Johnson is not what I would describe as lucky.

Anniebach

Yes Petra said often, would politics be excluded ?

Would wealth be used to support a candidate?

One other thing that is often said is "Do not let the perfect become the enemy of the good"