M&S diversity officers give staff pronoun badges……. a step too far?

What does it matter to you, as an individual if someone identifies as other than their sex?

Why do I have to be informed of their sex? If it doesn't matter to me; why is there the need to tell me? All customers want to do is go in, buy their stuff, pay and leave. Why do they need to know anything personal about the shop assistant? I could see the relevance of "dyslexic" or "colour blind" on a badge because that could affect how they assist customers. But you still haven't explained what benefit providing pronouns is to the customer.

That article is nonsense

fairplayforwomen.com/pronouns/
this explains it nicely

ginny

Staff have the option to request a name badge with pronouns. No one is being forced to have them.

Good. That’s as it should be. So the initial news was media hype? What a surprise! Not.

What does it matter to you, as an individual if someone identifies as other than their sex?

It doesn't unless they then want to access single sex spaces that don't correspond to their sex, no matter how they identify. It doesn't unless they want to participate in sports categories that don't correspond to their sex no matter how they identify.

Identify how you like but respect my right to my sex class and the words associated with it.

It matters because safeguarding is based on sex not gender. toilets, prisons, women refuges etc should be based on sex. let's not confuse sex and gender.
If a boy wears a dress is he a girl. or is he a boy in a dress?

PS only joking I don’t go shopping in M&S any more, nothing in there I want to buy.

I’d better get my badge on then!

Just in case they address me as ‘Madam’, I might be having a ‘Man’ day, only joking……

Actually I’d just have one with Woman written on it, that should save any confusion shouldn't it?

GrannyMacawell

It's utter tosh. sex matters. you cannot change sex and they are trying to blur the difference between sex and gender. non binary is just meaningless twaddle

Serious question, no snark:

What does it matter to you, as an individual if someone identifies as other than their sex?

I've never understood how someone personally identifying as trans or non-binary or gender fluid harms anyone. The people I know that do not identify with their sex simply want to live their lives in peace and acceptance. They're not asking or demanding that anyone else change their gender. They simply want to be themselves, just as anyone else would.

Perhaps that's part of the difference in perspectives? Actually knowing people who are trans, non-binary and gender fluid. I don't know, but I can't wrap my head around being so terribly upset over someone else's gender.

Staff have the option to request a name badge with pronouns. No one is being forced to have them.

We could have a brand new topic on GN entitled ‘You couldn’t make it up.’
I guarantee that people would find something to post on it every single day.

It’s often been asked, when will all this PC madness end, but I fear the answer now is sadly never.

Simple enough isn't it?
I mean Yes, of course.

No was to the first set of questions.

Chewbacca

^But how does their pronouns being on their badge impact you in a negative manner?^

Do I need to know their religion? Catholic? Jewish? Muslim? Sikh? No.
Do I need to know how they vote? Tory? Green? Labour? No.
Do I need to know if they're homosexual? Straight? Bi? No
Do I need to know their preferred gender? He? She? They? No.

I just need them to do the job their being paid to do. I neither need, nor want, to know nothing else about them, or from them. I do, however, want the ability to use a changing room where I know that there will be no penis havers. Simple enough isn't it?

No.

They don't need to know about my personal life and I don't need to know about theirs. I need them to be professional and know what they're doing and I will thank them for being helpful and doing their job properly.

I have never addressed a member of staff at M&S as you, she, her, him or they etc.

It's utter tosh. sex matters. you cannot change sex and they are trying to blur the difference between sex and gender. non binary is just meaningless twaddle

That's nice
Thank you

MerylStreep

VioletSky
Do you not think that millions of people cared for, thought about, considered other people before it was a thing, a law, guidance
If that’s what you think then you couldn’t be more wrong.

Don't assume what I think, look for what I was responding to instead.

Hate this sort of nonsense in discussion.

VioletSky
Do you not think that millions of people cared for, thought about, considered other people before it was a thing, a law, guidance
If that’s what you think then you couldn’t be more wrong.

Chewbacca

That's nice.

Thank you

Chewbacca

^But how does their pronouns being on their badge impact you in a negative manner?^

Do I need to know their religion? Catholic? Jewish? Muslim? Sikh? No.
Do I need to know how they vote? Tory? Green? Labour? No.
Do I need to know if they're homosexual? Straight? Bi? No
Do I need to know their preferred gender? He? She? They? No.

I just need them to do the job their being paid to do. I neither need, nor want, to know nothing else about them, or from them. I do, however, want the ability to use a changing room where I know that there will be no penis havers. Simple enough isn't it?

But it also doesn't harm you any, which is my point. It doesn't cost you extra, it doesn't actually impact your life at all. It's words on a name tag, which, since you want to know nothing about them, you're not reading anyway.

And since trans women may well have a penis, I'm going to say no. Trans women deserve safety as well.

I know a non binary person who was AFAB (Assigned Female At Birth). They were accosted and threatened with violence for using the female bathroom. Should they have had to prove that they had the proper genitals?

Nobody should be subject to threats simply b/c of the change room/bathroom they use. Everyone minding their own business is the way to go, imo.

That's nice.

I can't imagine being a person who doesn't value every single one of the hundreds or thousands of people who make my day possible. The amount of people involved in the simple process of enabling me to make a quick cup of tea is staggering.

I value people, they aren't just grunts.

I do care that the person who sevez me in a shop feels values and appreciated. Using preferred pronouns is such a small and easy way to show them.

Didn't M &S reverse the changing room decision?

November 2019. Following on from a customer who, took her 15 year old daughter to be measured and fitted for a bra and found that there was a man there "clutching bras and asking for their personal bra fitting service. The mother contacted Marks and Spencers who issued this statement":

“As a business, we strive to be inclusive and therefore, we allow customers the choice of which fitting room they feel comfortable to use, in respect of how they identify themselves,” the statement continued.

“This is an approach other retailers and leisure facilities have also adopted. We understand your concerns and I want to make it clear that if any customer was to act inappropriately or cause intentional offence, the necessary action would be taken.” A M&S spokesperson said transgender people are encouraged to use “whichever changing rooms they feel comfortable in.

So sod the 15 year old girls.

Can they have more than one badge?
Supposing that Arthur wanted to identify as Martha on, let’s say Friday?
I don’t Marks have thought this through ?

But how does their pronouns being on their badge impact you in a negative manner?

Do I need to know their religion? Catholic? Jewish? Muslim? Sikh? No.
Do I need to know how they vote? Tory? Green? Labour? No.
Do I need to know if they're homosexual? Straight? Bi? No
Do I need to know their preferred gender? He? She? They? No.

I just need them to do the job their being paid to do. I neither need, nor want, to know nothing else about them, or from them. I do, however, want the ability to use a changing room where I know that there will be no penis havers. Simple enough isn't it?

I found that film creepy but I cant really remember why.