Another baby killed

I didn't grow up with dogs but my daughter was desperate to have one. We waited until we were living in a rural area and she was ten. She took a really active part in training the dog (border terrier), he was bought from a local breeder and we saw him with his mother and siblings. We bought a second one three years later (again KC reg and from a known breeder). Twenty or so years on, we currently have a third BT. TBH I can't imagine life without a dog now, he is very much part of our family life and each day he takes OH and me for lovely long walks. However, despite having lots of quiet places to walk him off lead (he has excellent recall) we always put him back on the lead if we meet other dogs or walkers. I am really careful with him around children, even my own GCs, who are used to dogs and know how to interact with them safely. IMO too many people who own dogs are ignorant of how to train them and sometimes parents are too willing to let their children interact with strange dogs without asking the owner's permission. We had lunch with my daughter in a dog friendly pub, she had her very well trained Vizsla with her, sitting quietly at her feet. A small child came rushing up to him and my daughter quickly stopped the child from getting to the dog. The mother's reaction was not "thank you for looking after my child" but "oh she loves dogs, can't she have a cuddle?" I'm afraid she got a very frosty reply!

Bringing back the dog licence wouldn't make any difference at all. Responsible people would buy one, irresponsible people wouldn't. How on earth would you police it, what would be a suitable punishment? It was always unworkable which is why it was abandoned. Training a dog should start as soon as possible when they are puppys which is a serious commitment and hard work but so worthwhile. Most are pretty easy, as puppies are almost always eager to please, and thrive on being praised. Firmness with lots of praise and affection for doing well and you will have a dog to be proud of. BUT, never forget that they are animals and not humans and NEVER EVER leave a small child or baby on their own with any animal,however well trained they are.

Yes I agree with you entirely BlueBelle unfortunately there will always be the stupid, uncaring people who have a dog for all the wrong reasons.
Can't believe the idiocy of the Father in question if he thought he would get £2000 pound a time for a stud dog without history and/or papers. That's without the danger he put his family in. We can't legislate against arrant stupidity.

Our council still has a dog warden Bluebelle. He was called when we had the incident with the dog running around the road. The dog cornered him and was jumping up, snapping and snarling at him. The poor man was terrified.

Goodness!!

Still the fault of the owners, the dogs are not trained which should begin when they are a puppy, looked after by responsible people, etc. Yes, there did used to be licensing for dogs, I remember having to go to the Post Office to buy one, that should be reintroduced and a clamp down on irresponsible breeding (all should be registered).

Why oh why do people have to be dramatic and polarised The dog hating brigand on here blondiescot I ve only seen one post that said the poster truely disliked dogs most people are trying to put it all in perspective and that doesn’t mean they are dog haters

I love dogs that I ve owned I don’t really feel the need to coo over other people dogs I loved my own children and would help any child I could but I don’t necessarily want to adore everyone else’s children

Bring back dog licensing
Tighten up completely all breeding situations
Ban all advertising of animals on social media
Go after rogue breeders and puppy farms and shut them down
Bring back dog wardens
Heavier fines for fouling or hanging the bag of poo on the nearest tree
Remove dogs from inside eating places like it used to be
Ban dogs from shops like they always were

Unfortunately there will always be tragedies but many could be avoided
And please all you overt dog lovers read Kissingates post again

The fault is with the owners not the dogs.

I think far more humans are definitely - not potentially - dangerous.

I agree Lucky. I love looking at the wildlife on the canal behind our house. I don't hate dogs, I just don't like them. I am afraid of them. I think they are potentially dangerous.

I have not seen any dog-haters on here. I have seen people who are concerned about the problems that are caused by dogs, including deaths of children.

There is nothing at all wrong with loving animals - I spend a lot of time looking out on the fields and hills behind me and being impressed by the all the wildlife. But I do not want to "socialise" them - I want them out there being themselves.

I don't think there is any regulation. I know someone who bred as they didn't think it was fair on their female dog not to have a baby

I was going to ask about dog licences.
Are they still even used?
Not that buying a licence would deter someone who would pay 3 grand for an animal bred to be ai deformed that it can't breathe properly, because it's cute.

I thought there had been strict rules introduced about dog breeding in this country? And that you had to have a licence of some kind? I looked up the breed of dog involved in the attack as soon as I saw it mentioned on Facebook. I know it said that they were bred for good temperament but they were descended from pit bulls. The XL variety reminded me of mastiffs.

I despair at some of the people I know who claim to be animal lovers.
Dressing dogs up.
Not training them.
Bringing them into abusive homes.
Actively seeking out pets when they havent the money to feed them.
Shutting them away for hours on end.

It's about balance, isn't it?
That, and respect for all living creatures.

No of course there's nothing wrong with loving animals. I love animals. I would go out of my way to help one, and have done so. I detest trophy hunters and cruelty. I just resent the attitudes of some people - 'if you don't think like me, there's something wrong with you.'

Kate1949

With respect, there is a great deal of difference between changing our babies nappies and picking up dog poo in the street. This is once again putting dogs on a par with humans.
I think some dogs, assistance dogs for instance, are fantastic. It's the attitude of some owners that gets me. There must be something wrong with you and you can't be a nice person if you don't like dogs.

No there isn't. I'd happily pick up dog poo any day over changing nappies! And I make no apologies whatsoever for choosing dogs over humans, especially the dog-hating brigade on here. If I had to choose between a human and a dog - outwith my absolute immediate family - then I'd be choosing the dog every single time. Animals are wonderful - this thread just confirms my feelings about many humans.

There's nothing odd about loving animals - they could teach most humans a thing or two about love, loyalty, devotion etc. Children benefit enormously from having a pet in the house - it teaches them how to care for another living creature, as well as responsibility, etc etc.

With respect, there is a great deal of difference between changing our babies nappies and picking up dog poo in the street. This is once again putting dogs on a par with humans.
I think some dogs, assistance dogs for instance, are fantastic. It's the attitude of some owners that gets me. There must be something wrong with you and you can't be a nice person if you don't like dogs.

I am not blind to the reasons why people keep dogs and the positive aspects that there might be for some. But we are now in a highly distorted situation where the "rights" of people to own a dog override the rights of the rest of us to lead peaceful and safe lives.

Sometimes I think that I am more sympathetic to the needs of dogs than many of their owners are. Owners want them to fulfil various needs that they have - but dogs just want to be dogs.

We have stopped bear-baiting and circus performing animals - why? - because we could see that it is cruel to ask an animal to be something it is not, simply for our own pleasure.

I can see around me every day that what we have at present is not working. Every time I go for a walk there it all is: dogs straining at the leash, desperate to be allowed to be themselves; dogs barking and barking and barking out their frustration at being confined to the garden; dogs on the loose who are being a damn nuisance simply for being dogs - for being themselves.

It is a mess - and in the middle of this we have children killed by dogs - who are just being dogs.

We have gone so far down the unlicensed route now that to bring in licensing would result in thousands of dogs being turfed out to run feral, as their owners do not want to pay the fee.

Proper control will not come about until there are proper rules around responsibilities of dog owners - but this is all tainted by the British obsession with dogs - it will be very hard for any law-maker to get a grip on this without a massive backlash.

But what we have now is now working. If we want our children to be safe, and want adults to be able to go out and enjoy a walk, we need to find some way of regulating dog ownership.

My son has recently had a dog through Service Dogs UK as he suffers terribly with PTSD.

They attend training sessions twice a week with the organisation and the change in him is so noticeable

They use rescue dogs from the Dog's Trust. 'Saving two lives at a time' is their motto

My DS works in A&E and says every single week of the year a child is brought in with a dog bite. Sometimes they have multiple cases per week. Not one type of breed is responsible he's seen horrendous injuries to a young child's face caused by a small dog. Never leave a toddler on their own in a room with a dog especially if they are sleeping or eating.

I've been really depressed recently and sticking to a routine and getting up and going out with my dog for a good walk, whatever the weather has kept me going and I am starting to feel a lot better

I share your sadness sodapop. I’m saddened that my very intelligent canine companion who enriches my life so much and would give her life for me could be seen as an outcast that should be kept out of sight.

If a child wasn’t trained and socialised with its own kind it would grow up to be wild and feral. I have witnessed that for myself when working on social services cases.

So it is with dogs. If brought up in the same way you would bring up a child, with boundaries, they don’t jump or slobber over people, nor attack without reason. Sadly some people have such deeply entrenched hatred of dogs that they refuse to understand that. If they had the misfortune to lose their sight and were offered a guide dog as their sole means of getting out, would they turn it down on principle and remain lonely and housebound?

Before I retired, my dogs often came to work with me, to help support therapeutic work with children. One was a frequent visitor to a secure unit. Our dog training group made regular visits to a residential care home. We also entertained children from a psychiatric unit at our safe enclosed field. My big doodle was a calm, happy obedient girl, she was always one of the first to be chosen to be handles over agility by a teenager living on a ward in the psychiatric unit.
I don’t dispute some serious issues need addressing but, claiming no one should have dogs as pets - phew

There are many many pluses to having a dog sodapop and I had the most beautiful dog who I loved, however when I had to change from part time work to full time she became very miserable so I made a sacrifice for her and found her a new home where the people were in all day She had eight years with me a year of being not so happy then six years with her new family who adored her as much as me
There has to be a lot of thought into owning any animal and
I m sad to say for many that isn’t the case I know dogs who are left all day alone and it breaks my heart

There has to be stronger regulation there are too many dogs and too many poor owners whether it’s over indulgence making them into ‘humans’ or neglect and cruelty

Breeders need a LOT more vetting as do buying and selling on social media