Archie Battersbee

I dont think I phrased that well though Fanny. I am interested in challenging the narrative of scare stories that can cause other parents worry. I am not blaming or judging anyone for that I just think its important to say there seems to be no evidence for it.

Heaven forfend that some here ever have to venture onto the council estate where she lives. There would definitely be a touch of the vapours and pearl clutching.

It must have a snowball affect, too, as long as there are appeals to be made, and again, with the eyes of the public on you, and pressure (or backing?) from this group who have funded the appeals and expenses.

Galaxy, like Monica and others; you always post such considered and balanced opinions.
You come across as a very wise woman
(I know that you will modestly dispute this!)
I tend to just blurt out what has immediately popped into my head…

We know absolutely nothing about how or why Archie Battersbee ended up in being strangled and until we do, it is best not to speculate. Nor do we know about his family baclground andwhether it played any part in the event, again it is better we do not speculate.

MerylStreep

Heaven forfend that some here ever have to venture onto the council estate where she lives. There would definitely be a touch of the vapours and pearl clutching.

I think I may have an inkling...

Thankyou fanny but I mostly dont have a clue just like everyone else. I think anyone who thinks they have all the answers is usually someone to be wary of! It's just a terrible situation and sometimes there are no 'answers' to that.

M0nica

We know absolutely nothing about how or why Archie Battersbee ended up in being strangled and until we do, it is best not to speculate. Nor do we know about his family baclground andwhether it played any part in the event, again it is better we do not speculate.

I agree with M0nica, but going by hearing Archie’s mother talk about the hospital and the ‘evidence’ she has been collecting, then reading the judgement, I feel she is deeply in denial ( and who could blame her?). I just hope that after the funeral is over she will find some time to grieve and a degree of acceptance, rather than continuing a crusade against the authorities.

Sadly, I doubt that she will.

She will pay a heavy price, either way, I imagine.

Years ago I dealt with patients complaints and time and time again you had complainants who just could not let go. Their file (paper in those days) got bigger and bigger and heavier. You answered their complaint, maybe even held an enquiry, but still they would not accept that nobody had done anything wrong, and still kept writing in. Their whole life revolved around it. So sad.

Anniebach

*Miss Adventure* Universial Credit ? Does she live in rented accommodation and did she leave school without A’levels ?

Does that have any relevance to Archie's death or her anguish?

I hope no-one thinks it does.

I am concerned about the media interest here. Did any of this need to be in the papers at all? What public interest is served by publicising this?

What should have been a private matter finished up being played out in the media spotlight.

This poor woman (whatever her background - which is totally irrelevant) is a mother struggling to accept what has happened to her child and being led into taking steps that prolonged her agony.

The media should stay out of this. If it turns out that there was some online influence on this poor boy, then it makes sense for the media to be involved then so that parents can be alerted to any danger.

I do not know how it came about that the media stuck their oar in - did a court reporter hear it? Did the family contact them? Either way the media have a choice - to publish or to rightly regard this as a private matter and do nothing.

Lucky girl the mother gave an interview to the Daily Mail and had been very vocal in her opinion.

Luckygirl I imagine that it was Hollie Dancer’s backers Christian Legal Concern who contacted the media.
It’s been their extreme Right Wing Pro Life agenda that has driven all this.
And they were fortunate in that Hollie Dance was compliant.

FC of course she was compliant. They told her what she wanted to hear.

Media outlets can choose NOT to respond to someone requesting an interview. They are allowed to have integrity here as they know how dangerous the media machine can be. They can choose not to put a vulnerable person through the mill but instead they lap it up in the full knowledge that it will increase the family's suffering.

Don't get me started on b****y right wing Christian fanatics - Samaritan's Purse is on the surface a benign organisation and many are fooled into filling their Christmas shoe boxes. Makes me mad.

I used to work for a magazine as photographer and picture editor. A "story" came in about a Gypsy boy who had been run over on his site and the editor said eagerly> "Oh - did he die?" and was quite disappointed when it turned out he was only injured. This is how they think.

25Avalon

Years ago I dealt with patients complaints and time and time again you had complainants who just could not let go. Their file (paper in those days) got bigger and bigger and heavier. You answered their complaint, maybe even held an enquiry, but still they would not accept that nobody had done anything wrong, and still kept writing in. Their whole life revolved around it. So sad.

One of the most depressing aspects of this case (apart from the death of Archie) is the fact that some people are now so fired-up by the accusations against Barts and the medical profession that they are, apparently, calling the hospital and leaving some very nasty messages.

On one Facebook article - where the basic details of the switching off of the ventilator were given - one woman was demanding that no-one post anything other than messages of sympathy and told anyone with an "opinion" to SHUT UP (her capitals). Actually, no-one had said anything derogatory about Archie's mother anyway - this was just her deciding what should or shouldn't be allowed to be said. Another (also a woman) said that the judge in the Barts -v- Dance, Battersbee case should be tried for murder (written also in capitals).

This is not good. It reminds me of the "Enemies of The People" infamous headline. The media are very much to blame here - they have exploited the mother's grief and sensationalised the case, reporting her Court appeals unquestioningly. They, along with the campaign group supporting Archie's mother, definitely have an agenda.

Bluntly, I don't think the media proprietors nor the editorial staff give two genuine hoots about Hollie Dance, and it wouldn't surprise me one bit if they didn't become involved in a backlash against her. Unfortunately, I think she's so wrapped up in her grief that she doesn't realise she's been used and manipulated. Just because journalists and reporters stick a microphone in your face and look at you intently recording your statements, doesn't mean they are necessarily in sympathy with you. In fact, I feel very sorry for her, not only has she got to cope with the devastating loss of her child, I think she is blind to the fact that there are already those who are 'researching' her past life with the intent to make mischief when the time is right. I hope she and her family get the heck out of the spotlight now for her and their sakes and allow themselves the time and the space to come to terms with the loss of Archie. And that the media (not all have behaved badly) leave her alone and find something else to chew on to maintain their advertising revenue. For all her 'fighting' talk, she is a vulnerable woman.

I think Ms Dance was already ‘media savvy’, as she seems to have contacted the media before, when Archie was prescribed eye drops, but ear drops were dispensed by mistake.

Bluntly, I don't think the media proprietors nor the editorial staff give two genuine hoots about Hollie Dance, and it wouldn't surprise me one bit if they didn't become involved in a backlash against her. Unfortunately, I think she's so wrapped up in her grief that she doesn't realise she's been used and manipulated.

Exactly - but the media do have choices. They make bad ones. I find it sickening.

No one knows how they would react to a situation like this.
To those of you who have had to make the decision, my heart goes out to you.
Eventually the right decision was made for Archie and I wish all concerned peace and time to reflect.
God bless Archie.

Well said, joane123. That poor child.

Tragic child deaths ( especially murder ) does seem to interest an awful lot of people.
I’m not sure why?
Maybe it’s the ‘there but for the grace of god go I’ thing, but these stories sell.
That’s why the papers can’t get enough.
Parents of murdered children go on and write books: Sarah Payne, James Bulger, Holly Wells, Madeleine McCann ( I know MM is still officially missing ) but Kate McCann’s book was a best seller.

The press know people are really interested in these tragedies.

I was speaking to a friend abut this yesterday and she said that this had been Archies third attempt at suicide .Its an awful truth that many very young children end their lives nowadays ,my GD's friend hung herself last year ,her second attempt ,in a public park at night .
Mental health issues amongst teens and younger are spiralling ,in a lot of cases due to the pandemic.My GD has councelling daily for her problem .We know the cause its just how to take her worry away thats the issue .Children like Archie who are fragile but look happy in public will sadly slip through the net

The right wing right to life organisation who funded Archie’s parents have a lot to answer for in my opinion. What do they not understand about brain stem death? Sadly Archie was dead last April. He was never going to recover. I think this organisation have only added to the grief of Archie’s parents.

Joane123

No one knows how they would react to a situation like this.
To those of you who have had to make the decision, my heart goes out to you.
Eventually the right decision was made for Archie and I wish all concerned peace and time to reflect.
God bless Archie.

Very difficult with children, that is true.

However, I am very surprised to hear from many friends and family, that they have never discussed the 'what if' and what their wishes would be in similar circumstances and with regard to organ donation too. Perhaps not the right thread to discuss, but this tragic situation made me think.

RIP little one.