Virtue Signalling

GrannyGravy13

I happily admit to reading chi lit, when I am down and need a comfy blanket read I revert to Jilly Cooper (I have a not so secret crush on Rupert Campbell Black)

I am not sure I am 100% au-fait with virtual signalling is it not just boasting by another name?

My house is called Catmint Cottage.

Lilyflower

There was an amusing amount of VS on this thread of outrage.

Personally, I try to be as wicked as I possibly can and remain shtum about it. Is there a term for this? Possibly ‘being human’.

I struggle to notice when someone is virtue signalling.Plus I am useless at jokes.
Therefore much of this thread just baffles me.

Well put GagaJo.
I’d add that anyone with any knowledge of domestic abuse couldn’t have said what `fB said. She’s a highly skilled and experienced presenter whose links with Refuge should have stopped her making a statement that appeared to minimise domestic abuse. She added the caveat the broken nose incident was denied. She could have said ‘alleged’ incident and added the the former Mrs J has alleged she was subjected to physical and emotional abuse throughout her marriage.
She must be aware that an ‘accidental broken nose’ is highly unlikely to be a one off incident

Grantanow

Fiona Bruce simply quoted what had been said about SJ as context. She didn't offer her own assessment. Imho there was no cause to criticise her.

You don't dance with the devil if you're Christian.

You can't support battered women and defend a wife beater.

Fiona Bruce simply quoted what had been said about SJ as context. She didn't offer her own assessment. Imho there was no cause to criticise her.

Reading what the father was like, no wonder Boris is the shambling duplicitous bore he is.

M0nica

Eloethan I quote from an article in The Guardian

In the case of Stanley, his ex-wife, the late artist Charlotte Wahl, kept his abuse secret until four years ago when she told Boris’s biographer, Tom Bower, that their marriage had been “ghastly, terrible”. “I want the truth told,” she said about Stanley’s violence, which was witnessed by Boris. “He hit me many times, over many years.” Early on he resented her seeing her friends “and that’s when he first hit me”. Later, she was deposited in the country, without a car. “To adultery and violence, his family could add deserter.”

The fact someone has not been charged and investigated over crimes of domestic violence, does not mean that the crime did not happen and the quote above rather suggests that the public knowledge of his crimes extends beyond one occasion when he broke her nose.

Well said M0nica

Eloethan of course, based on your posts on GN, I wouldn’t characterise you as loathsome but I would use that word to describe Owen Jones. Being left leaning doesn’t mean I share his views on everything.

MOnica’s post at 8.45 summarises what Charlotte described as the physical and emotional abuse at the hands of Stanley Johnson. Fiona Bruce didn’t add these allegations when she felt she must provide balance. It’s a pity Refuge lost a high profile supporter but better that she left. Anyone with any knowledge of domestic abuse would know causing a broken nose wouldn’t be an isolated incident.

If you read Bower’s book, in particular the chapters about his childhood, you will go somewhere understand why Boris is as he is.

Stanley Johnson had many peculiarities; including making the children’s nannies go about in the nude in their home in France.
This was to ‘save on the washing’

The family would have come under the scrutiny of Social Services under different circumstances

Sorry for this digression from the OP but, Terribull, all Waitrose personal discounts have been reduced recently, but only a lucky few are offered a free newspaper. No explanation is forthcoming.

Eloethan

What's anti terf please? I thought you were a bit of a leftie Iam64 or am I wrong? Owen Jones can come across as a bit of a know all but why do you call him loathsome?

Just because someone is of one particular political persuasion doesn’t mean that you have to like all others of the same political bent!
That type of polarised thinking drives me mad.

And Owen Jones is awful

Eloethan I quote from an article in The Guardian

In the case of Stanley, his ex-wife, the late artist Charlotte Wahl, kept his abuse secret until four years ago when she told Boris’s biographer, Tom Bower, that their marriage had been “ghastly, terrible”. “I want the truth told,” she said about Stanley’s violence, which was witnessed by Boris. “He hit me many times, over many years.” Early on he resented her seeing her friends “and that’s when he first hit me”. Later, she was deposited in the country, without a car. “To adultery and violence, his family could add deserter.”

The fact someone has not been charged and investigated over crimes of domestic violence, does not mean that the crime did not happen and the quote above rather suggests that the public knowledge of his crimes extends beyond one occasion when he broke her nose.

Iam64 I can't get that worked up about the trans debate but one of my very good friends becomes apoplectic about the issue. I don't feel as strongly as her and I feel that she is over-reacting - but that wouldn't make me call her loathsome. I am a supporter of Corbyn and I'm not terribly keen on Starmer - does that make me loathsome?

Something similar seems to be happening in regard to Fiona Bruce in relation to a comment she made on Any Questions.. My view is that she has chaired the programme very well and held panel members to account, particularly those representing our current government. Yasmin Alhibai-Brown wrote in the I today that Bruce, under the rules, had to counter her (AB's) comment that Stanley Johnson was a wife beater. To my knowledge, he has not been convicted for this and it was incumbent on Bruce to clarify that this account - and the statement that it had happened only once -came from SJ's friends. A-B regrets that Bruce has suddenly become a serious hate figure and is being subjected to a deluge of vicious comments.

There are some commentators and politicians that I do find pretty horrible but not just when I disagree with them - but when I believe they are corrupt, selfish and quite happy to use controversial topics to increase their popularity, even if it means stirring up hatred.

My 4 year old grandson has read more than I have

Eloethan yes I agree to being a bit of a leftie. Terf - trans excluding radical feminist. That will be many 70’s feminists who like jk Rowling, Suzanne Moore, Hadley Freeman and Sarah vine (daily Mail) all express concern about the erosion of women only spaces, like the refuges many of us fought for. I’m not anti trans and resent being called derogatory names, like terf
Jones is angry with women who talk about safe spaces. He’s a Corbineester who loathes Starmer and disputes the findings about anti semitism.

If you only read things that you agree with you’re living in an echo chamber and you don’t find out what the enemy are up to.

What's anti terf please? I thought you were a bit of a leftie Iam64 or am I wrong? Owen Jones can come across as a bit of a know all but why do you call him loathsome?

I’ve been a guardian reader for many years. I no longer buy it and only occasionally read on live. Owen Jones along with its ‘ ‘ anti terf ‘ line really cheesed me off.
Jones is a loathsome little smug leftie. The loss of Suzanne Moor and Hadley Freeman ended my previous loyalty and enjoyment of the paper.

I think those of us who choose what we read from an eclectic mix of newspapers could be regarded as having "judgement" and being well-balanced 😂

I think the problem (if that's the right word) with the trans/women's rights issue and newspapers is that support for women's rights is not a left/right split. It crosses those lines in ways that political allegiance doesn't. I think that very often there is confusion over what is left and right, anyway. It is much more about large state/small state than about things like freedoms or tolerance of difference. There can easily be dictators and libertarians on both wings, and there are plenty of misogynistic people of both sexes on both left and right, too.

FannyCornforth

Yes Callistemon I’m always being reprimanded by The Guardian.
And The Telegraph has cancelled me altogether!

same here, but The Guardian gently reminds me that I have read xxx number of articles in the past year......in such a polite, non judgemental way.....

I dip in and out of online newspapers, the DM has some good information if you can be bothered to sift through the spittle flecked bile articles and tantalising bikini shots of people you have never heard of. The online Independent is, I think cutting back on costs by getting rid of grammar and spelling checks and having most of their articles written by keen 5th formers..

FannyCornforth

I don’t read the Mail Online at all.
Can you see me waving my flag of virtue? 😇

I don’t need to read the DM. I get to hear everything GNs don’t like about what’s in it on GN.
I even stopped reading the free copy (VS) in McDonalds
(😱not VS) when I call in for breakfast after early Gym sessions. (VS)

An acquaintance who (apparently) has the most perfect husband in the world. Who is never the slightest bit annoying, untidy, never forgets anniversaries, expert at all things domestic and DIY, perfect father and grandfather, all fine except that she reels off all of his perfect virtues if anyone even has the slightest lighthearted moan about the men in their life. And gives a little shudder at the same time.

I don’t read the Mail Online at all.
Can you see me waving my flag of virtue? 😇

FannyCornforth

Oh! And another thing! The DM is on the (what I believe to be) right side regarding women’s rights and safe spaces etc

I do think you have a point there Fanny, at least two female journalists have left The Guardian finding their positions untenable there, the latest being Hadley Freeman who now writes for The Sunday Times.

I remember over on MN a while a go, there was a thread about The Guardian's stance on always supporting Owen Jones' point of view and they even mentioned, I believe, can't remember the exact details, evenings promoted by that paper showcasing Owen Jones and Frankie Boyle, the general consensus being
A couple of mysogynists

I'm sometimes perplexed by The Mail because at times it does have serious journalists who would be more at home at say The Guardian, pop up and write for them as indeed its produces articles about matters we should know about that don't always get the coverage in papers that would be deemed more heavyweight.

I'll admit to getting on to the Mail on Line, not least of all for the sidebar of shame that seems to give my husband a certain amount of rage and a lot of questions such as "who is this person?" and "what does "posing up a storm mean?" I can only reply "no idea" but only worry if "I start doing what you might imagine that could be" [shock} I feel I've turned to the aforementioned sidebar since the magazines in hairdressers disappeared after Covid. I can't over-estimate enough how much I feel those hours pouring over illuminating literary publications such as OK, Hello, Heat and Closer have impacted on my well being, I've no idea who anyone is now apart from the omnipresent Katie "if the Price is right" I'll be getting another lip/boob/bum implant/engaged next week and Gemma "I'm a diva/incredible weight loss" Collins.