Free Bus Pass scheme labelled "unsustainable& quot;

I Strongly disagree with the idea of removing free bus passes.
I don’t qualify for one and won’t for at least another five years but hope they are still a “ thing” then.
…but the buss pass/concession means nothing if the services are cut and they are just none existent in some areas now.

maddyone

I have a bus pass, but never use it. I think people should pay a subscription for it.

Which is easy to say when you don't need it. Who do you think among the elderly does use the. I would bet it is mainly the sad, the lonely and the poor.

Please don’t label bus pass users as sad, lonely and poor DaisyAnneReturns it is demeaning.

Maybe those who never use buses should think ahead - to the time when they have to stop driving? I'm lucky here, with good public transport and plenty of cabs. I can walk all day, if I want to, as well, the result of always having dogs to walk and never having a car - use it or lose it.

Still, I wouldn't move to somewhere remote where I'd be isolated if/when I became frail. Being stuck indoors day after day must be a nightmare.

Granmarderby10

Please don’t label bus pass users as sad, lonely and poor DaisyAnneReturns it is demeaning.

I didn'tsay anything like that Granmarderby

If you read the post you will see both the words "mainly" and "elderly" and no sign of the word "all". However, the vast majority of free passes do go to the elderly and I mentioned reasons why I think this is particularly important that we keep them.

You are free to disagree.

Hetty58

Maybe those who never use buses should think ahead - to the time when they have to stop driving? I'm lucky here, with good public transport and plenty of cabs. I can walk all day, if I want to, as well, the result of always having dogs to walk and never having a car - use it or lose it.

Still, I wouldn't move to somewhere remote where I'd be isolated if/when I became frail. Being stuck indoors day after day must be a nightmare.

Indeed Hetty. Even if you move within walking distance of shops it may not be your walking distance later on. I'm afraid dogs do not stop people getting arthritis, although the walks may help delay it. You can find your balance affected by some conditions, etc. We all hope that what we do will delay and limit the signs of aging but who knows what we will and won't be able to do. If bus passes help retain independence we are likely to cost the NHS a great deal less.

DaisyAnneReturns, of course, you're quite right - I'm lucky with my health, too, but wonder how many 'good' years I have left. Independence is so valuable, in many ways. Perhaps we should be asking 'Can we afford not to have free bus passes?' It's a shame that local councils are just so underfunded that they're looking for any way to cut costs.

Well said Dickens good post.
Why is it always about money. Ofcourse that's one good reason but the health of the planet is my most urgent concern

1 person per car. 50 in a bus. Just look around you.
If you have a pass, use it Maddyann you can pay for it if you want. I'm sure your council would be delighted but just leave your car at home.

I have never owned a car, I’ve never driven, I love my bus passs I only use it for local buses (or to the nearest city now and then)
If it’s only for pension credit I ll lose it but I m only just literally out of the pension credit guidelines

It is a complete lifeline for so many and in this time of needing to cut car emission surely it ll be a back step to lose it
If they have to cut corners why not cut free long distance travel but leave it free for pensioners in their own county

Why do they never cut things for the well off folks it’s always the ‘just above’ that are pxxsed on

As a dog walker, I meet a lot of elderly people. It is striking how many (mainly women) who live on their own and who are living on just the state pension or perhaps a very small occupational pension, and it is clear just how much they must watch their spending, and frankly how little money they have.

The bus passes are an absolute vital part of their day to day living. Most seem to shop daily and many have frequent trips over the year to hospital ( various appointments). They seem to have very little money for entertainment. Meeting others (say with their little dog) sitting in the park and chatting seems to constitute towards their social life.

Take away their bus passes and you take away a huge amount of their freedom, and happiness.

£450 million is absolute peanuts in the scheme of things. But never let societal welfare get in the way of ideology or ideologues.

Can I just say that people living solely on the state pension should investigate applying for Pension Credit.

Absolutely, Dickens.

Use it or lose it. Obviously people who live out in the sticks or have health issues need their cars, but shouldn’t the powers that be encourage the rest of us to reduce our dependence on them? We leave the car at home whenever we can, and for as long as we’re able, we’ll walk to and from the bus stops, though the distances get longer as services are cut. Our local public transport network’s pretty dire, but the fewer people who use it, the worse it will get. Other, more enlightened countries, have slashed the price of public transport - it’s free across Luxembourg - and upped the frequency and efficiency. Here, the car is king, and we prefer to turn a collective blind eye to the many problems this causes. We have friends who take great pride in not having used a bus for 60 years - it’s obvious that they think most of those who do are some kind of underclass. We’re viewed as being a bit eccentric.

The sums add up too. A report from KPMG several years ago concluded that every pound spent on concessionary bus travel for older people generated, at that time, £2.87 of benefits for society and the wider economy. The same report found that scrapping free bus passes could cost the UK economy more than £1.7bn a year due to the probable decline in volunteering and poorer health among older people. The figures will be higher now.

This, as well as the obvious benefits to our environment of reducing car usage, is why the system should be widely expanded to other age groups, not scrapped. A good system of affordable public transport is one of the most obvious signs of a civilised society.

Grammaretto

Well said Dickens good post.
Why is it always about money. Ofcourse that's one good reason but the health of the planet is my most urgent concern

1 person per car. 50 in a bus. Just look around you.
If you have a pass, use it Maddyann you can pay for it if you want. I'm sure your council would be delighted but just leave your car at home.

Good regular inexpensive public transport is one of those virtuous circles and you are right Grammaretto, Dickens hit the right note. Insulating and upgrading homes is a similar one.

Public transport is one of the reasons why I really like the idea of turning government from top down to smallest form of community up. Our local Metropolitan council has very little idea, it seems to me, of the different needs of a small market town.

I meant to add - the articles linked to in the OP is not even about whether the senior pass is unsustainable, it’s about the funding of it. The LGA are saying that the government is not paying local authorities enough to cover the cost. No doubt that’s true.

kittylester

Can I just say that people living solely on the state pension should investigate applying for Pension Credit.

Yes I know kitty but honestly what they get is barely sufficient .

I can remember that a few years ago, an eminent Geriatric Consultant (an expert on older people - not a Consultant who was geriatric!!!) stated that the surest way of helping very many older people deal with both mental and physical problems would be the extension of the London Freedom Pass to all. Meaning free travel on ALL forms of public transport.

Indeed, if all public transport was free at thepoint iof use t o all, it would be a gigantic first step towards getting many private vehicles off the road for many journeys. Next step would be extension of those public transport services, and ALL nationalised.

I know that at present his is 'pie in the sky' with the present government and even the present Opposition - but any government who really wishes to bring in greener options this is the way forward.

Dream big!

On that note, and thanks for all the excellent posts, I shall catch a bus to the garden centre and spend the tokens I won at a recent raffle.

This morning I met a group of three ladies and we wondered around together, and I mentioned about the bus passes and they were horrified. They were saying that they could walk down to the shopping centre but walking back with shopping would be impossible so they would have to take the bus. One said that with the cost of everything going up she is beginning to cut back on stuff week on week - so where she once bought something every week she has cut back to every other week now. They are ladies in their late 70s and early 80s, widowed with no means to transport - they own their own property except one who pays rent and is finding life incredibly difficult. She has no children (son died) and only a sister-in-law in similar circumstances as far as I can make out.

This is the next crises I think.

DH has never applied for his bus pass, I am able to get one later this year at that point I will apply for the both of us.

We live on the main road through our commuter village I see busses going past my kitchen window during the day so they are definitely around, no idea where they go or the frequency must do some research.

My late Mum used her bus pass right up till she was too poorly and becoming less mobile to do so. Apparently she often used to meet the same people on the buses and enjoyed the interaction and conversation.

It would be a shame to lose this, which appears to be a lifeline for so many.

GSD aren’t you anywhere near a Coasthopper stop? Brilliant in the summer if you don’t want to struggle with the holiday traffic along the coast.
We often park in a quiet place take the bus and walk back to the car along the coastal path. Can recommend.

The funding for the scheme by local councils must be tricky I imagine. For everyone that uses the bus they also lose revenue from the parking machines. A double whammy for them.
I will pay for my pass if requested although I don’t use it much.

No, there’s no public transport where I live. We would have to drive to it, as you do. North Norfolk is a big place!

Whitewavemark2

This morning I met a group of three ladies and we wondered around together, and I mentioned about the bus passes and they were horrified. They were saying that they could walk down to the shopping centre but walking back with shopping would be impossible so they would have to take the bus. One said that with the cost of everything going up she is beginning to cut back on stuff week on week - so where she once bought something every week she has cut back to every other week now. They are ladies in their late 70s and early 80s, widowed with no means to transport - they own their own property except one who pays rent and is finding life incredibly difficult. She has no children (son died) and only a sister-in-law in similar circumstances as far as I can make out.

This is the next crises I think.

I have a neighbour who has never driven and is still grieving the loss of her husband and doesn't like to stay home as, as she says, she just ends up crying.

Getting to the doctors is a nightmare. She has multiple, mainly moderate conditions. She is well into her 80s and nothing she can do will stop her "wearing out". She walks with one of the sqare walkers with space for shopping and a seat. Maintaining her independence on an income that would not pay for taxies.

There used to be a bus passed the surgery. It's been cut. The staff are helpful and if she arrives early she may get an appointment for, say, 11 o'clock. (She doesn't have techy stuff) She will say she will wait. The kind receptionist will say she doesn't have to wait and my neighbour will explain she cannot walk all the way there and back. Sometimes, they can get her in early and sometime they can't.

My reason for writing all this is they simply don't understand the limitations on some people's lives. They are not bad people. I doubt I understood at their stage of life - but there could be some thought - and training - for the generation that is becoming disenfranchised from what we have left of a reasonable society.

You don't have to have a bus pass to use buses grannygravy . You can buy a ticket.
You would be doing your bit to cut the number of car journeys.

I use buses all the time, and am years off getting a bus pass, which you don't get here until you are state pension age. They are very expensive though (£8 from my town to the nearest city 15 miles away), so anyone on a budget would have to think twice. Also, as I said upthread, there is no integration, so you often have to go into the city to get to another town, which could easily mean that a one way journey would be £16, and take hours including waiting for a connection.

Someone should take charge of the whole public transport system, and ensure that it is cheap, clean, safe and reliable. They could then make car use less attractive, which would cut the need for clean air zones and arguments about parking. Other countries can manage it (eg Switzerland) so why can't we?