Demanding neighbour

I have! They're struggling. She really is awkward. I'm just not getting involved if she calls as she needs to really understand that she's not able to cope any more. It feels nasty to me but I suppose it's being cruel to be kind.

I would definitely do what Grandmabatty said above and advise the people with POA to progress the POA.

MissAdventure, I should imagine that being too tight to pay for care is not at all uncommon. Dh’s old aunt (no dementia) had plenty, but absolutely loathed having to part with any of it. The carers dh organised were sent away. She expected neighbours - in a small block of flats - to help her ‘for love’ - never mind that she would never have put herself out for anybody on a regular basis.

And she thought nothing of summoning dh for some very minor reason when he was only just home after a long, work-related night flight. And we lived a 2 hour drive away.

The neighbours were themselves mostly elderly/decrepit to some extent - one was virtually blind. I used to have them on the phone wailing that they couldn’t cope any more.

When after many months of all this it finally got to the stage that getting herself to the loo in time was a real issue, it still took dh an entire day until 9 pm, to get her to move to the very nice care home he’d arranged - just across the road.

And he had to say sorry, but that was it - he was off home, before she finally agreed.

These stories are terrifying! I hope I don't end up like your neighbour Aveline.
There's a woman in our town who fits your neighbour. I refuse to engage with her as see how she manipulates but she has lots of people running about after her. They are mostly from the church and some in their late 80s.
Her own AC don't come near her.
Her health is "far worse" than anyone else's. She never enquires after anyone but has stories possibly fanciful of when she was young and lived all over the world.
I guess she's a local character but my reaction is the "wrong" one so she doesn't like me. I suggest sheltered housing but she doesn't want that.

As others have suggested, adult social care is the best bet.
But, it's not up to you to be at her beck and call.
Older people like this 90 year old can be stubborn, set in their ways and expect people to run around after them. They think everyone owes them. Sounds like she's a danger waiting to happen. Do you think she really is that deaf or could she exaggerating a little yet actually hear better than she's letting on?
Get on with your life and if she has a genuine problem, you could always let the couple know.

It's of significantly long standing for it to be a UTI. I think Kimski is nearer the mark but most likely just long term deterioration/ischaemic attacks rather than anything more complex.

It also could be as simple as a urine infection

Just to pick up on the opening doors at 0300 and other things, it may be possible that she slipping into psychosis, which is under-reported in the very elderly. If she thinks she is “hearing things” yet is profoundly deaf, it’s a possibility. At this age, it’s more likely to be caused by neurological things, general degradation of brain cells, unreported ischaemic attacks and so on, which can lead to a form of very late onset schizophrenia (this presents completely differently to a young person showing signs of schizophrenia, btw). It can usually only be diagnosed by an experienced special interest geriatric psychiatrist in the basis of symptoms - often an organic reason isn’t found (although sometimes more white matter found during head MRI). As more and more of us become extremely old, this is another concern - rather than the more common dementia issues….

Pearlsaminger

Good point!
I've had a bit of a hiatus, as we "had words" a couple of weeks ago.

Oh, it's been lovely!!!

MisA, you could point out to her that if getting on people's wick was the criterion, then some nearer home might qualify . . .

My neighbour, (yes, THAT one) has just been telling me how the man over the road needs to go into a care home.

I've explained time and again that getting on peoples' wick doesn't count as a good reason, as he is absolutely with it, and just too tight to spend money on what he needs.

If he can get the neighbours running around doing everything, he will.

My neighbour isn't afraid. She wants to be on her own. The POA couple arranged a regular carer to visit but the old lady made it impossible for the poor woman to stay on. She's so set in her ways that any change is bitterly resented. I don't know what she thinks will happen to her.

I do wonder if its fear that makes some older people so demanding. Several years ago I was seriously ill after major surgery and the complete helplessness and total reliance on other people stressed me out and made me very bad tempered. I can only imagine what it feels like to be totally dependent on other people for ever

spabbygirl

Witzend

Tink75

Adult care Social Services will come out if you ring them.

If the woman won’t accept carers - and if she’s still officially deemed to have capacity - then TBH there’s sod all Social Services can do. You can arrange them all you like, but it’s not going to be any use if the person won’t let them in, or sends them packing after the first day.
Can you tell I’m speaking from experience here? 🙁

I know it sounds harsh, but sometimes all you can do is withdraw to some extent, until she either a) accepts the need for paid help, or b) some sort of crisis occurs.

I was a local authority adult care social worker and witzend is right, if she is deemed as having capacity no-one can force her to do anything she doesn't want to. She can't be forced into a home or to have paid care. The reasoning is that some people prefer to risk falling & dying at home than being physically safe in residential care and if she has capacity to make that decision she can do that. Its just as if she was 20ish not 80ish, cos the ability to make decisions isn't dependent on age necessarily and some people do make decisions that others would say are daft.
what you can do is look after yourself & just refuse to do anything you don't want to, make up excuses or whatever suits you but don't get yourself too frazzled and exhausted.
It's much harder if she's opening her door etc. at 3am, that might be worth referring to social services in case it is a symptom of some sort of dementia, or there is a way to stop it.

This is the post I meant to 100% agree with

Romola

I agree that there does seem to be a safeguarding issue here, in which case anyone who is concerned can contact social services.
Obviously, the people with the PoA would be the right ones, but Aveline, as a neighbour would also be an appropriate person, having spoken with the holders of the PoA.

this 100%

Witzend

Tink75

Adult care Social Services will come out if you ring them.

If the woman won’t accept carers - and if she’s still officially deemed to have capacity - then TBH there’s sod all Social Services can do. You can arrange them all you like, but it’s not going to be any use if the person won’t let them in, or sends them packing after the first day.
Can you tell I’m speaking from experience here? 🙁

I know it sounds harsh, but sometimes all you can do is withdraw to some extent, until she either a) accepts the need for paid help, or b) some sort of crisis occurs.

I was a local authority adult care social worker and witzend is right, if she is deemed as having capacity no-one can force her to do anything she doesn't want to. She can't be forced into a home or to have paid care. The reasoning is that some people prefer to risk falling & dying at home than being physically safe in residential care and if she has capacity to make that decision she can do that. Its just as if she was 20ish not 80ish, cos the ability to make decisions isn't dependent on age necessarily and some people do make decisions that others would say are daft.
what you can do is look after yourself & just refuse to do anything you don't want to, make up excuses or whatever suits you but don't get yourself too frazzled and exhausted.
It's much harder if she's opening her door etc. at 3am, that might be worth referring to social services in case it is a symptom of some sort of dementia, or there is a way to stop it.

Our case is almost parallel. The neighbour alerted her surgery and they visited, saying it was a routine visit as they had not heard from her for a long time. More visits over a period of months ending up.with an assessment. Our case ended with a diagnosis of moderate Alzheimers. She is deemed not to have capacity to take decisions about her own welfare. SW has become involved and we are in process if finding a cleaner. Look on health forum.here for my very recent post about all.this. In your case the people with POA could do as above.

There is such a problem in this country and no doubt many others, for people with no family close by, as they and we all get older. It seems to me the happiest ones are those who live in some sort of sheltered accommodation with a manager on call if needed, and company available, and eventually moving into more supported living or a care home. It is all a question of finances. Sometimes it can work to live with family but there are so many pitfalls. In some societies, that is the norm. As it is, many neighbours and families are struggling to cope with the demands made on them. I don’t have any solutions, but solutions are desperately needed, as we live longer.

This is becoming a safeguarding issue therefore it’s a case for Social Services. If the POA friends are not addressing this then Social Workers need to be aware. Next time there’s a problem phone SS. This can be done anonymously. Her safety is the issue. She can claim for care or attendance allowance. So often it’s the caring friends or Neighbour’s who age prematurely due to the pressure. Sad but true.

Lots of good advice in the replies so I won’t add to that. However I always say we have all been children but none of us has been an elderly person. Who knows what being 90 feels like?

I think you have to make it clear to her, and to the relatives with PoA, that you simply cannot continue to be at her beck and call and she has to rely on her relatives and paid help. Harsh but necessary - she’s brought it on herself. And block her phone calls after telling her relatives that you are going to do that for your own sanity. Let them deal with her. You are not her servant.

If only it was so easy to convene such a meeting! Getting all these people together at the same time is impossible. The old lady won't accept carers and won't consider moving. She may well be assessed as having capacity so can't be moved against her will. Meantime what could happen?!

It does sound like a “ best interest meeting” should be organised, so that everyone can come together who is involved; POA, the lady herself, social worker, district nurse if they are involved, so that everyone can be honest about their concerns with this lady. Often neighbours begin helping with good intentions, but as the needs grow and become more complicated risk assessments need to be considered and honest discussions should take place. You cannot expect this lady to make a fully informed and considered decision, if she is not aware that you are struggling to support her. Hope it goes well and a safe resolve can be found.

I had POA for finances for an elderly aunt, who was in similar circumstances.
She relied on neighbours who were being called out day and night by lifeline. She refused carers saying she could ' manage' and didn't want to pay .
Eventually I actioned PoA and family took her to see residential homes . With firm persuasion and much to relief of her neighbours,we got her into a home.
I live 30 miles away so couldn't drop everything to go each time she demanded help..so thankfully neighbours took the load for 2 years.
It was sad as she was never happy in the residential home and anger constantly directed at myself and my sister for moving her.