Letting 15 year old Son travel to Europe by rail

I know nothing about KA apart from her TV persona, but I agree with her reasoning with regard to her son’s trip which I think she expressed well.

JaneJudge

Monica I don’t think you need to worry about Bozs inverted snobbery, Kirstie has much more actual snobbery in abundance 😂❤️

I judge her by the same standards I have for other people and she is no worse or better than anyone else. I really do not give a toss about her background, or anyone elses for that matter

Sorry Oldbat!,

Oldbat1

I was in full time employment before i was 16!

As was MrJ oreo he left school aged 15.

I was in full time employment before i was 16!

Monica I don’t think you need to worry about Bozs inverted snobbery, Kirstie has much more actual snobbery in abundance 😂❤️

BlueBelle

But it’s very different flying to visit a family to wandering around Europe maybe staying in hostels etc Cold I see nothing wrong in a 15 year old flying to visit a family hopefully being met at the other end
Again 15/16 in student accommodation is only a step above boarding and I m sure that’s safe too this is a totally different situation

In what way is living on your own in your own flat without any supervision "only a step above boarding"?

But it is the norm here.

mae13

Would Ms Allsop have given her blessing to a 15 year old DAUGHTER doing this?

Why on earth would she treat a daughter differently? IME girls often mature earlier than boys. I went to Germany for two weeks aged fifteen with a school friend. We travelled to Germany on our own although we were met in Munich and taken to our B&B in Oberammergau. We had language lessons in the morning but were free for the rest of the day and evening and we used our free time to travel to all sorts of places. We had a wonderful time and our tutor Manfred travelled with us back to Munich on the train. He had a little brown case with the making of a Manhatten cocktail in it and we all had a cocktail. I felt very grown up. We had couchettes on the train journeys from the ferry to Munich which was also very exciting. The only drama was having my bottom pinched by some random man and missing our bus home from Schloss Linderhof but we cadged a lift on a coach with a school trip! I learned a lot and not all of it was language based. I'm very glad that my parents didn't wrap me up in cotton wool but they had both left school at 14 and started work!

Boz

Because of her class and education KA is very sure of herself; doesn't care to be challenged and arrogant to post it on X - from where SS found it.
I must concede I do not like the woman. Being told to 'Make do and Mend' by a rich aristo, did it for me.

What shocking inverted snobbery.

In all aspects of life you meet and can know people different from you and know and understand their life style, both constraints and freedoms.

All the great social reformers from Elizabeth Fry, to Florence Nightingale and so so many others showed how people born into wealth could identify with and help the unfortunate. What makes you think, without being a great social reformer KA cannot do that?

As I said inverted snobbery

I think it’s the case for the individual. I have three sons the eldest went abroad at 17 he’d booked it before even asking! Anyway he was very a very grown up lad did look much older and street wise we thought. Now second son was hopeless I wouldn’t let him go to the corner shop never mind abroad😂😂he’s still the same and he’s 43 😂third son very grown up and sensible and didn’t go abroad till 19.

Would Ms Allsop have given her blessing to a 15 year old DAUGHTER doing this?

Children are indeed different foxie and it can depend on whether they have been allowed some level of independence and responsibility in a graduated way, according to their age, understanding and maturity.
Children in modern society, I feel are generally over protected, and do not become “streetwise” as early as their parents.

I think we can never eliminate risk, but we can prepare our children as well as possible for their future independent lives, whilst they are still under our guidance and influence. They don’t wake up on their 18th birthday and suddenly become responsible mature adults.

At that age l wouldn't have bought no2 son a return 😁

I was a child protection social worker in Carlisle a long time ago once a child hits 16 in Scotland they are legally an adult and can do as they please, not so in England, its 18. We had several 16+ yrs olds on care orders who did exactly that, going to stay with dodgy 'uncles' & if they were in Scotland we could do little about it but the minute they cross back to England the care order is valid till they're 18.
I would let a 15 yr old travel with a friend if he was a sensible type. I expect social services only rang to avoid dramatic headlines the following day.

I believe you have to phase in adult behaviours and let them try things on their own. KA is well resourced and could ring and book hotel rooms if there was an emergency.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-21742512

When your offspring are 18 they are legally adults and can do what they want provided they can fund it. I'd much rather they start doing things on their own well before that age, when they still need permission and help to fund it (probably). It means you can discuss plans, talk through any potential problems/risks and generally be there in the background should they run into trouble. Parents know their children better than anyone else (or should!) and should be able to gauge how much freedom to give them according to their maturity not their chronological age. My younger daughter matured more quickly than my older daughter, she was much more adventurous and confident, aged 7 she went on her first activity holidays with PGL on her own. When asked if she'd like a friend to come too she said no, as it would be too much of a responsibility as the friend might be homesick. She did not phone home once. My older daughter went away for a couple of days with her classmates aged 9 and cried to come home. They are all different!

Most accidents happen in the home, so perhaps leaving them at home isn't the best idea either.
There again, who wants to take a stroppy teen away?

I think the law is not specific enough about this and it should be. They might be able to leave home at 16 but only if the accommodation is safe and suitable, join the army (where they are looked after) etc. Traveling to a foreign country without a legal adult is another matter I think.

But a parental is legally responsible until the child is 18 and an adult. If something had gone wrong she would have been liable.

I don't think it's good to let them do whatever they want - they should be told - when you're 18 you can do it and for now you come on a family holiday.

That's tricky though as 16 year olds tend to not like family holidays any more (unless they're abroad possibly) but they could always bring a friend (and in that case, the friend needs a letter of consent from their parents).

It is such a worry and i'm not convinced doing what these people say always works either. It's mindless

It doesn't bear thinking about, does it?
I tell him not to make eye contact, keep walking briskly, keep his mouth shut, give anything he's told to; trainers, money, phone...

Boz

Because of her class and education KA is very sure of herself; doesn't care to be challenged and arrogant to post it on X - from where SS found it.
I must concede I do not like the woman. Being told to 'Make do and Mend' by a rich aristo, did it for me.

I’m sure you’re not alone 😂

MissAdventure

I worry about knife crime when my boy is out and about.

So do I

Did you do matching pants for your man, too?

MissAdventure

Ah, that explains a lot. 🤭

In my defence I wasn't only doing knickers!

I worry about knife crime when my boy is out and about.

Easter 1955, a lot of us aged 14/15 had monthlong French Exchanges arranged by the school. Three of us travelled together, waved off by parents on steam train from Birmingham, got to Southampton, found ferry, got to Le Havre, found train to Paris, were met by the French families who were hosting us in various parts of Paris. First trip abroad for all three of us. I don't recall any problems at all on the journey. No teachers with us . We had been told not to go to the British Embassy church un Easter Sunday because it would be very full but to go instead to a British Nonconformist church, possibly Methodist we did, each travelling there alone by Metro, and were pleased to see each other and a few other girls from school. I think that exchange visit gave us a lot of confidence about being abroad as well as improving our spoken French.