Medical update

Good thinking.
Back to basics type of thing.

Sorry you're in this situation and it's making matters worse. Could you phone NHS Direct, explain you're in pain and what can they suggest rather than go to your GP? You can request to deal with another GP at your surgery. Hope it gets you somewhere as you deserve to feel well.

gentleshores I have seen several consultants "out of area".
I have found the ones I want to see and simply told my GP that I wanted to go to that particular clinic instead of my local one.
I have been to London, Nottingham and Birmingham and do not live in any of these areas.
I had to insist that I didn't want to go locally - and one GP some years ago said I had to go locally first (which isn't true).

Obviously you have to tell your GP why the service/consultant you want to see is better for you personally- and you have to get there.

www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/about-the-nhs/your-choices-in-the-nhs/

B9exchange

It does sound as though you have an uninterested GP, and that is never good. If you get to see another one, grit your teeth, be pleasant, and say to them 'If I was your mother, what would you recommend to relieve the severe pain?'

It would be worth taking up your case with the local Integrated Care Board, you can find them here www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/find-your-local-integrated-care-board/ and write to your MP, requesting they take an interest in your case. I wish you well and hope you find help soon.

Thank you I'll look into that.

I don't have any arthritis. I have torn cartilage in both knees - originally it was after a fall/injury but only one knee bothered me initially and I muddled on through the pandemic with that after it being suggested I could start physio "after all this is over" - well of course it wasn't over for quite a long time and then the other knee just went in a big way. I couldn't do stairs any more and had to get a stairlift in urgently - thinking it was temporary. When I got to see a GP face to face again I asked to be put on a waiting list for knee replacements as to me it was serious - not being able to do any steps and restricted walking. That's when I was told - can't do - you don't have arthritis. Told to self refer to physio (which I did about two years ago). That wasn't much help - they said you don't need an MRI scan and you don't need to see a specialist. Just take painkillers, do the exercises and keep active. Well it was trying to keep active at home without bending my knees that led to other issues with my arm and shoulder - bending and reaching. So I've been struggling with that for the past year. I did finally get MRI scans earlier this year but only once I ended up in a wheelchair. I thought right now I can get a specialist referral - no - I was told GP can't refer directly to a specialist - only to MSK clinic. So I went private then to see an orthopaedic consultant who was as explained earlier - extremely unpleasant and rude and it knocked me for six. Only just getting over that - I felt on the edge of a breakdown after that. It was such a shock and left me no further on and treated badly. Somehow, when you're in pain and can't walk or do much it affects you much more if someone is rude and unpleasant. I think he was ageist and sexist.

But am feeling more confident again now. I got worse every time I tried to do more. And I have more tears now.

They won't do knee replacements for cartilage. The treatment for that is arthroscopy to repair the cartilage - which doesn't always work but ..... or - someone on here gave me a tip - stem cell injections which help regrow/repair the cartilage.

But if you can't even get to see a specialist you can't get the treatment. It's rare they do arthroscopy over 70 but I'm not 70 yet!

I just can't believe they'd leave you like this either. I tried to explain I was struggling, at my wits end, can't do anything. I have pushed - but it;s a bit like talking to a brick wall. My GP thinks the only answer is physio.

I have another muscular condition as well which I managed well for years but now I'm not very active and can't kneel I;m not managing that any more as a lot of that was posture which is why I'm having arm and shoulder problems now.

To me this is urgent! And has been for two years. I've jumped through all the hoops and now I'm on a merrygoround and back at square one again - referred to physio. It's too painful to do the physio exercises any more.

I'm actually using a mobility scooter rather than a wheelchair now but getting to the point where I need a wheelchair in the house as I've spent more time on top of a bed than walking this year as I keep getting setbacks. It's a struggle to get across a room and if I overdo it it's too painful to walk at all.

I am so shocked by it all. I can only assume there's some kind of criteria somewhere that if you're over 65 and don't have arthritis - just send them away with painkillers.

I did have an idea today though. I saw a rheumatologist a long time ago about the muscular issue. That maybe if I went to see him again he might refer me to an orthopaedic person - after all the lack of treatment for my knees is causing me significant other medical problems.

Can I really just ask a GP to refer me to a specialist in another area? An NHS one? There's an NHS cartilage clinic but it's out of the area.

gentleshores - I’m back on this thread because I’ve been thinking about you and I remembered you said you are in a wheelchair and that your arms are also hurting.. Is it Osteoarthritis that you have or Rheumatoid Arthritis? My friend has RA (since her 30s). She has had 2 knee replacements, but still needs a walker to get around. If you are in a wheelchair, you must be pretty bad. Take the advice of our friends here. Badger your GP. Good luck x

It does sound as though you have an uninterested GP, and that is never good. If you get to see another one, grit your teeth, be pleasant, and say to them 'If I was your mother, what would you recommend to relieve the severe pain?'

It would be worth taking up your case with the local Integrated Care Board, you can find them here www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/find-your-local-integrated-care-board/ and write to your MP, requesting they take an interest in your case. I wish you well and hope you find help soon.

Keep going, gentleshores.

Ive also spent the last few years trying to get help with my issues.
Nothing to do with orthopaedic problems, but I've been met with indifference.
If I make a fuss, I'm told I'm depressed, I mustn't mention more than one problem at a time, and I've been as good as called a liar.

I know how very difficult it is, but it's honestly ridiculous for doctors to stand by and watch a patients quality of life go down and down, and to not at least try to help.

In vase that upsets anyone, I'm not for one minute inferring it is all GPS.

Thanks all. I just keep getting "can't do" from the GP. I did go and see an Orthopaedic surgeon privately a few months ago, in desperation and that was an awful experience. The GP referral said very little and he didn't seem interested at all and was a rude and unpleasant man. I posted about that on here. I know logically I should see a different one but needed to get over that experience first, and meanwhile accepted waiting longer for referral to MSK clinic - which has turned out to just be yet another physio appointment.

I was told GP can't refer me to a specialist at all, let alone out of the area. But NHS online says differently.

I think I might need to change my GP.

Ask to be referred to Epsom, they specialise in in hips and knees, swelioc is what it's called.

Allira

^oryvste specialist^
I've not heard of that? Is that a branch of orthopedics?

I do understand, having recurrent sciatica and being told there's nothing to be done, it's my age, I can understand some of your frustration.
Physiotherapy exercises just made it worse.
Paracetamol is the only painkiller on offer.

Short of going back to your GP, demanding to see a specialist urgently, bang the desk, burst into tears whatever, I don't know what to suggest. Your GP doesn't sound very helpful, ask to see another one.

Short of going back to your GP, demanding to see a specialist urgently, bang the desk, burst into tears whatever, I don't know what to suggest. Your GP doesn't sound very helpful, ask to see another one.

gentleshores

Reading your post - I think this might be the point you're at anyway and should consider desperate measures as suggested by Allira. You've been passed from pillar to post, and it's not acceptable.

If I were you, I'd even consider contacting the Daily Mail with your story - they have in the past been very good at taking up the baton on such matters.

You should not have been abandoned like this. It's shocking.

gentleshores have you considered paying privately to see an orthopaedic surgeon to find out exactly what is going on with your knees ? It shouldn’t be too expensive, about £200, although you would be charged a bit extra for an X-ray.
Then if the surgeon says surgery would help you, you have ammunition to press the GP to refer you under the NHS.

I certainly wouldn’t accept a GP’s assertion that nothing can be done as you don’t have arthritis.

crazyH

Iam64 - that’s nice to know. I hear there’s a 2-year waiting list for knee replacement- so I’d better see the Doc soon - I just keep putting off, because I’m too scared of surgery. And because it doesn’t affect my day to day life, I’m relaxed about it. I take anti-inflammatories and it seems to help.
Yes Babs - bad knees is bad news 😂

We are obviously lucky where we live - DH only waited 5 months for his knee operation (last year). I think you can ask your GP to refer you to any NHS hospital? May be worth asking where the waiting lists are shortest?

I know where you are coming from. Every time I see the doc there seems to be no attempt to deal with the problems properly and a blanket assumption that this is what getting older entails. Pain is pain whatever your age and should be dealt with thoroughly by investigating causes and providing proper treatment or pain relief.

Iam64 - that’s nice to know. I hear there’s a 2-year waiting list for knee replacement- so I’d better see the Doc soon - I just keep putting off, because I’m too scared of surgery. And because it doesn’t affect my day to day life, I’m relaxed about it. I take anti-inflammatories and it seems to help.
Yes Babs - bad knees is bad news 😂

CrazyH I understand knee replacements are more complicated than hips but - 5 friends had knee replacements, all recovered well and now pain free and much better mobility

crazyH

Not heard of that either oryvste - I have bad news as well, but not as bad as yours . In the new year, I will see my GP for a referral for a possible knee replacement, although i have heard knee replacements are never as successful as hip replacements .

I hope you get some joy with your knee replacements. I was told they only do them for arthritis - and I don't have any arthritis. I would happily have them if it meant I could walk but there seems to be this division - knee replacements only if you have arthritis. For cartilage it's supposed to be arthroscopy and repair - if you can actually get a referral to a specialist. I suspect it's my age. I will try a different GP at the same surgery but will see how this next physio assessment goes. I'm going prepared to say - it was caused by an injury and I need treatment before physio.

Sorry must have been errors on my phone keypad. It was meant to say "private" specialist not oryvste!

I've been making a fuss for over two years -and begging and crying and asking for support. Today she just said - I don't think there's anything else I can do (except keep referring me to a physio - as she did two years ago).

crazyH

bad knees, not bad news

Well I suppose bad knees are bad news 😞

bad knees, not bad news

Not heard of that either oryvste - I have bad news as well, but not as bad as yours . In the new year, I will see my GP for a referral for a possible knee replacement, although i have heard knee replacements are never as successful as hip replacements .

oryvste specialist
I've not heard of that? Is that a branch of orthopedics?

I do understand, having recurrent sciatica and being told there's nothing to be done, it's my age, I can understand some of your frustration.
Physiotherapy exercises just made it worse.
Paracetamol is the only painkiller on offer.

Short of going back to your GP, demanding to see a specialist urgently, bang the desk, burst into tears whatever, I don't know what to suggest. Your GP doesn't sound very helpful, ask to see another one.

I was so sorry to read about your situation gentleshores. It must be horrible to be in so much pain and depressing to be so immobile. You seem to have been badly let down but you must return to your GP and at the very least get some pain control to start with and then push for more support.

So sorry gentleshores, you should not be up against it with the NHS, the NHS should be in your corner with this trying to improve your quality of life. My OH has a similar problem with a shoulder impingement that hasn’t improved with physio or ibuprofen rub, is getting worse and now he can’t even hold his mug. They have done an x ray but no scans, asked about this but they said is a shoulder impingement, he doesn’t need scans, but a friend whose OH is a GP says he should be getting scans in case is something else. And they won’t give him injections for the pain until he has completed physio exercises which are not working after several months.
I despair.
All the best with your battle 🌺❤️

At one point the stress of pain triggered an asthma attack and I ended up in A&E. They were just talking about managing asthma and I kept saying - it’s because of my knees. They said can’t do anything about that you need a referral.