Wales really does look after its young guns

Casdon

Allira

Casdon

Also, Poppyred, we can criticise the 20mph speed limit, which I have myself, because it can be a pain, particularly when it keeps changing between speeds in short distances - but it has worked, it has saved lives. So, although we don’t like it, the government didn’t get it wrong.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/18/wales-20mph-speed-limit-lives-money-policy#:~:text=However%2C%20a%20year%20on%20from,the%20figures%20are%20pretty%20clear.

It's been reversed in some areas.

Yes, they have asked councils to identify which stretches of road where they feel it was not appropriate, which is sensible I think, as councils will know best where the potential black spots are. 20mph will remain in town centres and where there are houses near the road though. In my view the implementation of the policy was not well executed when it started, although the principle was right.

I agree Casdon.

Some Councils have reversed the 20mph on some roads but others have not.
How much has all this cost?

One country 'A' road we use quite often had a 30mph limit imposed but within weeks it was changed to 40mph.
I would think 40mph is probably a reasonable speed for that particular road.

Wheniwasyourage

Sorry, OldFrill, I do know perfectly well that it's under 22 for a bus pass in Scotland, not under 21. Should be better at proofreading! Anyone blaming bus passes for antisocial behaviour is stretching things a bit, I think. Think of all the freedom that young people (and older people) have to move around for all sorts of reasons. I like to see young people taking the bus rather than driving, and I hope the habit stays with them.

I can assure you they aren't stretching the experiences of anti social behaviour. There has been an increased police presence on certain routes as young teenagers are cruising the buses being abusive to other passengers. It's given teens from certain areas easy and free access to other areas that previously weren't subject to this level of antisocial, and in some cases criminal, behaviour.

Allira

Casdon

Also, Poppyred, we can criticise the 20mph speed limit, which I have myself, because it can be a pain, particularly when it keeps changing between speeds in short distances - but it has worked, it has saved lives. So, although we don’t like it, the government didn’t get it wrong.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/18/wales-20mph-speed-limit-lives-money-policy#:~:text=However%2C%20a%20year%20on%20from,the%20figures%20are%20pretty%20clear.

It's been reversed in some areas.

Yes, they have asked councils to identify which stretches of road where they feel it was not appropriate, which is sensible I think, as councils will know best where the potential black spots are. 20mph will remain in town centres and where there are houses near the road though. In my view the implementation of the policy was not well executed when it started, although the principle was right.

Where I live, in part of Yorkshire:

£1 per journey 18 and under with Zoom (no cost) pass
£13 student bus pass go anywhere for a week.

Casdon

Also, Poppyred, we can criticise the 20mph speed limit, which I have myself, because it can be a pain, particularly when it keeps changing between speeds in short distances - but it has worked, it has saved lives. So, although we don’t like it, the government didn’t get it wrong.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/18/wales-20mph-speed-limit-lives-money-policy#:~:text=However%2C%20a%20year%20on%20from,the%20figures%20are%20pretty%20clear.

It's been reversed in some areas.

Allsorts

Indigo8

Nationwide free travel for pensioners. Regional variations for school children in compulsory education and college students. Makes perfect sense.

How many years was bus fare 30pence

Never, anywhere I have lived. I had to pay half fare (1/-6d each way if I remember rightly) for school. DCs paid half fair (60p each way) for school. GCs pay half fare (1.50 each way just gone up from £1.00).
Three different places. This has never been nationwide unlike the free bus pass.

Casdon

Also, Poppyred, we can criticise the 20mph speed limit, which I have myself, because it can be a pain, particularly when it keeps changing between speeds in short distances - but it has worked, it has saved lives. So, although we don’t like it, the government didn’t get it wrong.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/18/wales-20mph-speed-limit-lives-money-policy#:~:text=However%2C%20a%20year%20on%20from,the%20figures%20are%20pretty%20clear.

20mph limits in Scotland. It was a bit of a shock when we first started driving over the border but we've got used to it now. Local people seem happy enough with it, too [the ones I've spoken too anyway].

Sorry, OldFrill, I do know perfectly well that it's under 22 for a bus pass in Scotland, not under 21. Should be better at proofreading! Anyone blaming bus passes for antisocial behaviour is stretching things a bit, I think. Think of all the freedom that young people (and older people) have to move around for all sorts of reasons. I like to see young people taking the bus rather than driving, and I hope the habit stays with them.

Indigo8

Nationwide free travel for pensioners. Regional variations for school children in compulsory education and college students. Makes perfect sense.

How many years was bus fare 30pence

Also, Poppyred, we can criticise the 20mph speed limit, which I have myself, because it can be a pain, particularly when it keeps changing between speeds in short distances - but it has worked, it has saved lives. So, although we don’t like it, the government didn’t get it wrong.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/18/wales-20mph-speed-limit-lives-money-policy#:~:text=However%2C%20a%20year%20on%20from,the%20figures%20are%20pretty%20clear.

Poppyred

Meanwhile all us oldies spend years on NHS waiting lists……but hey ho it takes years to get from A to B with the 20 miles an hour speed limit. The Welsh Labour government is a joke!

It’s like the curate’s egg though, some things being bad does not mean we should criticise the things they do that are good. In my opinion at least, this is good.

Oreo

It isn’t as simple as that tho, the huge amount of our benefits bill, including the large part, for pensioners and the bill for the NHS and education on its own is huge.Many immigrants have only the one wage coming in and a large family, therefore taking out of the pot more than they put in.Many work in the black economy therefore contribute nothing.

So it’s all down to immigrants again. They’re a good excuse for years of government cuts aren’t they. This is like one of the many nostalgia pages that I view on Facebook. No matter what the subject matter is it doesn’t take long before someone mentions foreigners

Meanwhile all us oldies spend years on NHS waiting lists……but hey ho it takes years to get from A to B with the 20 miles an hour speed limit. The Welsh Labour government is a joke!

CariadAgain

Oreo

infoman

The Welsh Government will introduce a flat rate fare of one pound for 16-21 years olds for all bus journeys in Wales.

Why does the English Government not do the same for its young uns?

Could it possibly be that the entire population of Wales is around or under the entire population of London?Never mind the rest of England and the population of Scotland must be similar to Wales.Which is also why England can’t offer free Uni education.
Wales, or rather its governing body is the all singing and dancing place many think, and many come into England for NHS treatment as it’s been mismanaged in Wales for years.

It probably helps as well if a lot of the "brightest and best" Welsh teenagers don't find themselves too restricted in job opportunities and have to go over the border to England to ensure that all employers bother themselves about is pure objective things like 1. qualifications 2. work experience and that is absolutely that and no other factors being taken into account. I've talked with a couple of "cream of the crop" ones here and could see as well as them they were being asked to speak Welsh - as well as have those two factors and it was very clear they would both be heading over the border at some point.....

So - yep....fewer young people asking for cheap/free transport than there would otherwise be.....

People in Wales aren’t able to receive their treatment in England unless they are nearer to an English general hospital than to a Welsh one which offers the treatment they need, that has been the case for a number of years now?

On the transport issue, I’d say there is justification for cheap transport costs for young people because after age 16 education is distant from the homes of a lot of young people. Where I live they have to travel up to 40 miles from age 16 to go to 6th form college or further education college, depending on the subjects they want to take. There are lots of rural and deprived small towns and villages, very spread out, and lots of families on low incomes, for whom transport is a deal breaker cost wise.
I think free transport for under 21s should be available UK wide, but at least this is a start.

Linking free bus passes with a rise in anti social behaviour is a big leap in my book! I think there are different threads to your arguments. Definitely there is a need for more buses and better timetables. That is down to the bus companies not providing them, presumably because of lack of profits. That's the part where SG could offer subsidies I think. What is not free but funded by central government? Your point isn't clear

Wheniwasyourage

You are aware, surely, infoman that in Scotland anyone under 21 as well as anyone over 60 is eligible for a free bus pass. England has the capped bus fare, which is a great idea IMO, but I would hope that eventually bus travel will be free for everyone. We'll need a lot more buses though...

Free bus travel in Scotland hasn't increased the number of buses nor routes quite the opposite.
It's under 22 btw not under 21.
Fares for those who don't qualify are extortionate, many of those are on minimum wage. The reliability of the buses in rural areas is dreadful. It's not free - it's funded by central government, well tax payers. There has also been a marked increase in antisocial behaviour (under 22s) since the free passes were instigated.

Oreo

infoman

The Welsh Government will introduce a flat rate fare of one pound for 16-21 years olds for all bus journeys in Wales.

Why does the English Government not do the same for its young uns?

Could it possibly be that the entire population of Wales is around or under the entire population of London?Never mind the rest of England and the population of Scotland must be similar to Wales.Which is also why England can’t offer free Uni education.
Wales, or rather its governing body is the all singing and dancing place many think, and many come into England for NHS treatment as it’s been mismanaged in Wales for years.

It probably helps as well if a lot of the "brightest and best" Welsh teenagers don't find themselves too restricted in job opportunities and have to go over the border to England to ensure that all employers bother themselves about is pure objective things like 1. qualifications 2. work experience and that is absolutely that and no other factors being taken into account. I've talked with a couple of "cream of the crop" ones here and could see as well as them they were being asked to speak Welsh - as well as have those two factors and it was very clear they would both be heading over the border at some point.....

So - yep....fewer young people asking for cheap/free transport than there would otherwise be.....

England pay £££s billions for interpreters to help people claim benefits or to understand their (free) NHS appointments. £20 billion I think.
That’s an awful lot of free bus fares, right there.

It isn’t as simple as that tho, the huge amount of our benefits bill, including the large part, for pensioners and the bill for the NHS and education on its own is huge.Many immigrants have only the one wage coming in and a large family, therefore taking out of the pot more than they put in.Many work in the black economy therefore contribute nothing.

Oreo, if we look at population as a measure, England have more money in the pot because of the higher population therefore could use a bit of that to help travel costs surely?
Scotland and Wales are more in line with European countries here, I think.

argymargy

Reminds me of when we (as schoolchildren) could go anywhere on any Greater London bus for 5p. Good old Red Ken. Nowadays parents have to spend a fortune just to get their kids to school.

Other European countries put us to shame when it comes to affordable & reliable public transport.

I agree

infoman

The Welsh Government will introduce a flat rate fare of one pound for 16-21 years olds for all bus journeys in Wales.

Why does the English Government not do the same for its young uns?

Could it possibly be that the entire population of Wales is around or under the entire population of London?Never mind the rest of England and the population of Scotland must be similar to Wales.Which is also why England can’t offer free Uni education.
Wales, or rather its governing body is the all singing and dancing place many think, and many come into England for NHS treatment as it’s been mismanaged in Wales for years.

My youngest still has to use public transport and the problem is the lack of direct transport to places so a capped fare is good for say one journey, but if you have to swap buses twice, that's a fare of £9 (3 x £3) one way

Nationwide free travel for pensioners. Regional variations for school children in compulsory education and college students. Makes perfect sense.

I blame Thatcher. Years ago Sheffield had an excellent bus service and you could travel anywhere for 30p.

Thatcher stopped all that and public transport has been a nightmare every since,