Incorrect use of Language

It seems that spoonfuls and spoonsful are equally correct.

Some sources say that 'spoonfulls' is the most used, and that 'spoonsful' is American.

‘It was SO fun’.

SUCH fun!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well I’ve just seen a list of words the Trump administration is discouraging from use. It includes climate change and female. 1984 is with us

Oreo

JamesandJon33

How about an hotel ? What are your views on that?

Oh this question 🤔
Well, an hotel is correct but sounds silly.

It only sounds silly if you pronounce the "h". Many people do pronounce it but we have a long history of not doing so.

Our words have often been borrowed from other languages so we pronounce some "aitches" but not others. Even that can be different in different parts of the country. I can't see why any of this is a problem unless you have nothing better to do with your life, These are desperate times all over the world; what's difference is a dropped or added "h" going to make?

We all remember things we, personally were taught. "Can" and "may" scream in my brain if someone, for example, asks, if they "can" take a spare chair from our table when we are out. I can hear the old reprimand of "we all know that you can PN, but the question is whether you may". Would I say anything to the person needing a chair - never, nor would I say anything on GN unless I needed to clarify something in a debate. The rest is conversation. I may have been brought up knowing some then current rules but who am I to impose those now dead or dying rules on anyone else. Life really is too short.

But, but how many times do people get upset by my "old fashioned" writing. It seems the will attack others on GN, for their way of doing things but will always expect to be excused for their own. This one rule for us and another for them view is something that makes me think I would not like these people. But does it matter? Not at all. Some people are pleasant, other are not and, as I have already said, life really us too short.

Suki70

The increasing use both in writing and spoken of ‘use ‘ instead of ‘used’ eg, “We use to go there often”.

I believe this has always been acceptable when talking or writing about something in the present tense. I myself would say, I usually go there, or I am in the habit of boing there, rather than I use to go there the latter not being a form usually used in Scotland.

We used to go there means that we did so formerly, but no longer do so.

I find "have a nice day" instead of good-bye annoying. I nearly bit the head of the cashier at a supermarket check-out when she used it to me, ten minutes after my sister had been diagnosed with cancer. The shop-girl could not know that, so I bit my tongue hard, Said to total strangers it can be very hurtful indeed.

Just to labour a point… if you only needed half a spoon full
, would you say
3 spoons half full… or… 3 spoon half fulls?

What I don't understand is why so many people copy these mistakes in our language. Is it simply a case of thinking it's the 'in thing', or are they showing their own low standards?

I also always say spoonSful, though a hotel…
My pet hate is “can I GET …” in a shop/restaurant. I feel like saying, “of course, go ahead…”

No you need 3 spoons full of syrup.
. The measurement is the number of spoons., whether you use one spoon three times or three separate spoons.
Ba ba black sheep
Have you any wool
Yes sir, yes sir
Three bags full
Not three bagfuls. ..note

Is the plural in the spoons? When I'm baking & I need 3 spoonfuls of golden syrup, I only use one spoon but I fill it 3 times.

JamesandJon33

Yes I know all that MaisieD. And I do say an hotel. Similarly I say spoonsful and not spoonfuls , as the plural is in the spoons. May sound silly as someone said but correct I think.

I'm not sure you are right there.
I thought that this compound noun should be spoonfuls, not spoonsful.
Though obviously if you separate it into its two component parts you can have spoons full (or bags full if you are into nursery rhymes ☺ )

Yes I know all that MaisieD. And I do say an hotel. Similarly I say spoonsful and not spoonfuls , as the plural is in the spoons. May sound silly as someone said but correct I think.

Thank you everybody I am genuinely finding this thread very interesting and informative.

As they say, on Gransnet every day is a school day.

On the "school" coach in the 70's, two housewives were regulars & one would say to the other "busy in town today, must be the sales" & the other would reply "Well this is it." Then she'd say, My daughter's coming I bought lots of food, the grandchildren eat as if they haven't been fed for weeks" & the other lady would reply "Well, this is it!"
We used to amuse ourselves counting the number of times they said it before we got out of town. It did make us giggle!

Y pet hate is educated American women who sound like corn crakes. It really is unpleasant to listen to . The sound like they have swallowed a load of rusty nails.

I my youth I loved American accent of Marilyn and other famous film stars but find the majority of those from the States I hear on TV and radio unpleasant. ( I rarely go to the cinema these days as cannot cope with the noise).

CariadAgain I can't hear you so have no idea about a RP accent, but there are so many deviations from Standard English in your written posts that I have to read everything more than once to understand. I don't mind - we are all different - but complaining about others using different constructions or vocabulary when doing so yourself is a bit odd, surely?

Is the 'gutteral' sound people are talking about 'vocal fry', where people speak with a sort of reverberation in their voice caused by relaxing the vocal cords when they speak? It is usually a female way of speaking, but not exclusively, and it tends to be associated with younger people. It can make them sound hesitant, a bit like the use of 'like' as a modifier, and may simply mean that they are less confident than older people (or men).

BlueBelle

Don’t mind most of them probably guilty of ‘bye then see ya later’ thing never really thought about it but surely it’s a bit of a positive phrase really presuming you ll still be around to see them later…. I also use Uni sorry Doodlebug
The ‘like’ thing drives me crazy but I really don’t think it’s been around since the 70s or even 80 s I would have said last tenish years only I have one grandaughter who uses it all the time she talks for England and barely takes a breath and it’s littered with likes I never say anything and luckily the other 6 don’t use it
I saw that JudgeJudy programme Georgesgran poor chap had no other words did he ?
The ‘So’ at the start of the sentence mainly used by young professionals drove me mad, but that seems to have died a death now so has the awful guttural voices some women put on in the hope of sounding sexy do you remember that a few years ago.

Now you've got me trying to remember if I've ever heard another woman talking in a guttural voice - real or fake......

Since I've still got being deaf in one ear apres Covid = I've come to hate the voices of women who are SO intent on sounding "breathy/lightweight/I am so FEMALE arent I". I have asked these breathy light female voice people before now (both in person and when they are the narrator on a YouTube video) to speak more clearly - as my deaf ear makes it difficult for me and I point out that I'm far from the only one that will have that issue with their voice.

Yet still they speak in that little girlie voice - grrr!!!! At which point I stop trying to hear them - as if they can't be bothered with me (or other people with hearing problems) = then what does that say about them then? It says they don't give a darn and they are so determined to be "little flighty feminine little me" that I give up on them....as I can hear (or rather - not hear - all I need to know about them) and I don't want to know them.....

Women can modify their voices to be clearer - if they choose to. Margaret Thatcher changed her voice. Me - I changed mine. I went to primary school in the first place all those years back probably speaking what amounted to modern received pronunciation. Cue for a few weeks there and me trying to imitate my fellow pupils and I came back at night speaking in a Devon accent (I am Devonian........). My mother promptly sent me to an elocution teacher to get my own voice back again - which resulted in me promptly learning to speak very "posh" apparently. Cue for I had to change my voice again - as it was "over the top" and it went back to what it was in the first place (ie standard middle-class easy to understand) and that'll do for most people. But it aint "little girly - focused on herself"......

JamesandJon33

Anyone going to answer my question?

Hotel, hospital and history (are there any others?)

All came into English from French where the /h/ isn't pronounced. So, English elites continued to pronounce them without the /h/ sound. Which meant that 'an' was required before them. English elites all spoke French, too, of course, so they knew that the /h/ wasn't pronounced.

Once the plebs all learned to read and saw that there was an 'h' at the start of each of those words, not knowing French they pronounced it. Only need 'a' in front of the consonant sound /h/. 'An' precedes a word starting with a vowel sound.

When I was younger people used 'an' far more often than it's used now.

I must confess to thinking that 'an historic occasion...' sounds better than 'a historic etc...' but I'd say 'a history'. 'a hotel', 'a hospital...'

Well I'm no expert but the French appear to use prof as an abbreviation for professeur/e and bac for baccalaureat.

Once these expressions have been around long enough, most cease to irritate me. I even end up using quite a few of them myself, 'uni' being a good example.

When I was a child (born in '61), my grandparents still referred to the radio as the wireless. In recent years I have wondered if they were irritated by younger people calling it a radio. They never said so. I, on the other hand, cringed each time they said 'wireless'!

At the moment, my pet hate is the use of 'merch' instead of 'merchandise'.
However, if I am lucky enough to live long enough, I'm sure I will get used to it.

I find the evolution of language interesting.

‘Haitch’ sounds completely illiterate. It makes me cringe

Magenta8

I used to cringe when people said Uni and talked about their Proff, or even Proffy at Uni but I am used to it now.

Goodness, we said ‘Prof’ in the early 1960s!

Also in the 60s, a German girl I knew commented that English people (well, students like us anyway) never said ‘yes’, just ‘yeah’.

So you see, these things have been going on for quite a long time,

I spent a semester at Munich University in 1965. The Germans called it Uni then, and still do. GS is doing a semester in engineering at a Uni in Berlin right now. I'm getting used to it here now.

"Whatever!" 😉

I once went out with an American who said I looked like a hay girl, I was a bit affronted as I thought he meant a roll in the hay but turned out it was a hey! Girl, like a hippie as they said things like hey! Man.😂
Two countries divided by a common language.