All these tests these days

madeleine: isn’t it wonderful that we can watch so many wonderful things on our tablets and TV’s. My current favourites are Channel 91 which is a wildlife safari and a utube channel called Cornish Walking Trails. I wish I could ignore Dr Google; he has a lot to answer for!

There is always going to be a great variety of views on this. My take on it is that I am now 80 and have run my life to the best of my ability, and have every intention of doing so for the rest of it, long or short. So long as I was not causing problems for others I have made my own decisions and accepted the result of that. So think Diana Trent in Waiting for God, if you ever saw that. There is no way that I would go and live in a care home , if I can help it. They may suit other people , but as long as I can possibly do so, I will live in my own space , and so , while health and lack of funds might stop me doing some things, I have the joy of music, radio 3, and 4, and surrounded by many books, and the ability to go out and come in at times that suit me and be beholden to no one, and not have to "clock in" . I accept the down sides, when I struggle to move about much or cant bend for something or whatever. Then things just have to wait until I can manage. I have always cooked most things from scratch, preferring my own cooking to shop bought stuff and knowing what makes up the contents of my plates. Yet I have had to find a few things that I can have in the freezer , for days when I just cant stand up and cook.

I did 10 years hospital car and have seen how unforeseen things can alter your life and not in a way you would choose. So I gave up my house and lovely garden with regret but chose to move to a ground floor flat, ensuring that I could manage for longer with no hills etc. But it has ensured that I can remain in charge of my life for longer, well that is how I see it. I have cancer again now which is not good news , but am coping and again , by living here I am able to go for treatment, and remain at home. Actually my back causes me much more everyday hassle and frustration, and if I was in a care home I recognise that I would have more help, and probably much less pain, yet even that does not make me want to leave here. As regards to medication, I listen carefully to what doctors say, do some checking up of my own and try to come to a sensible decision. I am diabetic and take tablets for that, but with reasonable care I can manage my food intake and of course sometimes eat less healthily , but over all I am coping.

We all have our own views on what is important in life. If I can still enjoy music and art and reading, be able to enjoy eating and drinking occasional treats then I will continue to plod along. If I am feeling particularly down or struggling a lot then I have bits of Billy Connolly recorded, and I just find him very funny and makes you laugh out loud. Definitely something that , for me, is much better than medication. I listen to J S Bach every day, and many other things too, which can still surprise and cheer me, and enjoy watching the wonderful Nature programmes which allow us to see things that we may never have the opportunity to see in real life. There is a lot of rubbish on tv , in my opinion but those wonderful nature programmes I thoroughly enjoy. So with things like that and my radio, I have much to still enjoy, and can please myself when I listen or watch. This may not be the best life but it IS a life , in a way that matters to me. I just hope that I am never in a situation where I am bedbound without the chance to enjoy these things that count so much for me in my life. If I can no longer enjoy anything and am only living because I am breathing, then I would not want to continue. We all have things that make our lives still worthwhile, and I think we are all responsible to try and live in a sensible manner so that we can continue to enjoy our choices. However , one mans meat etc., I do not think I have the right to tell anyone else how they live their lives. GN is also part of my life too now, and there is much to learn, and enjoy , and occasionally feel annoyed about, but how great it is to have something to read about at rubbish oclock in the morning when you cant sleep! I never look up on Google or whatever about illness things, If I cant actually do anything myself about it , it would just be one more thing to worry about, so I dont look. After all these years I think I recognise when I need to see a doctor, although they usually moan at me and say I should have come sooner, but if something hasnt been affecting me much I prefer to see how it goes. I hate injections and dont much care for tablets, so will definitely not be trying to have any unnecessary costly treatment, and accept it is my own fault if I should have gone earlier. If they suddenly discovered that coffee shortened your life by a day a month, I would still choose to drink it as fresh coffee is my favourite drink, and so again I make my choice and live by the consequences. Enjoying what you can in life seems to me to be the measure of what you can do for yourself within reason.

I can follow the logic re any medication being a "poison" - certainly amongst the conventional drug range for sure.

I think maybe one of the reasons why medications are problematic to so many people is that they hear (or should hear) what the effects are on a noticeable number of other people - but go ahead and take it themselves subsequently.

I recall when Prozac came on the market and was being touted as side-effect free - and I cynically thought "Oh really?!!!" and sure enough it turned out to be very far from. Right at the moment there's Ozempic and the like that a lot of people are taking to lose weight - and, sure enough, that's turned out to have a load of side-effects too and yet still people are demanding it. Which I find very odd - as, to me, there's two other choices anyway....so "Just why". Take one of the other two choices imo - either stay fat or go on a diet. It's like they forget those two options are still available.

Any medication is a 'poison'. It is there to stop the body doing or not doing something by working against what the body wants to do.

But all medications these days come with very comprehensive leaflets spelling out the dangers, and there are often articles in the print and social media, not to mention reliable medical sites online that regualrly publish information ondrugs and their side effects.

As long as people are sensible and can tell a reliable site from some conspiracy theorist convinced that every vaccine or tablet you take will kill you, all the information anyone caan need about a medication is available at the touch of a button.

fancyflowers - I had a breast cancer test - once and never again. I knew it involved a mammogram and the thought hadn't crossed my mind they would do a test that was painful of itself. So I got in their machine and they "tightened and tightened" the darn thing - and kept tightening - even when I said the test itself was hurting. It hurt a lot by the time they finished their tightening. Never again! I was gobsmacked they would do a test on people that was painful - yep...I know and I feel pretty naive to not know that...but no-one had ever said! Of course I've now read since that this primitive test itself can cause problems. So double reason not to let them near me with their "Stone Age" medicine.

So I felt betrayed - both by the NHS (with their primitive test) and other people (some of whom must have had it - but kept schtum that it was painful!!!!)

Then there's the fact they'd probably want to stick one of those things down my throat to check out why I have been getting acid reflux daily (!) for a while now. Errr...no...the whole idea is to avoid anything unpleasant and my dentist could tell them I'm very concerned about just what I let anyone put in my mouth. So that's another thing I won't do and I'm thinking "Even the NHS knows that's primitive and there's a sorta Contac type thing one can swallow instead for that test - so why are they still doing it that way?!!!". Meanwhile - I'm now experimenting with whether Aloe Vera liquid will stop the problem.

Basically I find most of "modern medicine" of this era very very primitive indeed and, when I can even picture some of what there will be in centuries to come = I'm blowed if I'm going to let them get their hands on me with this primitive early 21st century stuff of theirs. To me - it's in the same category as "A couple of centuries ago they used to do operations without general anaesthetic - they were so primitive".

So - to me - I've now come pretty firmly to the conclusion "I'll live in the 23rd century mate mentally-speaking - and, if you've not invented what I need yet = I'm going to use alternative medicine instead. Get a move on and stop being so darn primitive with what you're offering currently".

It seems all medication has side effects - not something they are very clear about. You just have weigh up whether the advantages are stronger than the side issues. I personally think in the case of statins they are ( especially for someone like me who has a family history of heart attacks and very high cholesterol readings ) but we all have different opinions. I don’t have high blood pressure, so far but I eat tons of olives and olive oil so I would rather that than tablets.

nanna8

I was thinking of the numerous blood tests etc we have these days. Far more than when I was younger and far more technology available. They pick up all sorts of things before you are even aware of any symptoms. Mostly this is a good thing but sometimes ,well, I’d rather not know especially when there is no way of treating what is found. I have been told I have chronic kidney disease but it doesn’t warrant any treatment, not that bad. Did I want to know this? Also there are cholesterol issues - well I take tablets for that and don’t want to take a higher dose because of side effects. Other things which can’t be treated anyway. Sometimes it seems we know too much! Ignorance is bliss ?

Ignorance leaves you helpless and powerless.

There are things you can do, changes to diet, habits and lifestyle, to support impaired kidney function. (or counter high cholesterol, or pre-diabetes, etc)

Staying as well as possible for as long as possible, doesn't necessarily depend on medication.

fancyflowers
Agree with you 100%!

Rightly or wrongly, at 66 I don’t have tests for the sake of it. I feel they ate ‘touting for business’ and its a way of pushing more medications when not always necessary. When I look at the huge list of meds my MIL took and then the side effects of some which were counteracted by another med, I lost confidence in GPs.

If you are taking statins try British supplement Plant sterols just read the reviews.

I have stage 4 kidney disease, and am about to be referred to the kidney consultant. He will show me various graphs as to how my kidneys are functioning, and he will talk to me. Unfortunately there is no cure for kidney disease, so I'm not sure of the value of seeing him.

I very rarely do any tests. I am 72 and have only had one cervical screen test. No mammograms either. I do blood tests when I am obliged to, and that's about it.

The problem with testing is that they are practically guaranteed to find something wrong with you.

I take the attitude that if I feel well, I probably am. I don't want doctor's testing and probing until they find something that would probably not affect me very much.

Breast cancer screening can be very problematic, in that today's technology can find miniscule tumours that would never develop into a life threatening issue, yet the result will cause untold stress and worry, which is extremely bad for you anyway.

...and yep....there'd even been people who were strangers to me (never mind my friends husband) offer to donate blood for the NHS to take across the country from Wales to England for him - so that he could be sure of what he was getting (ie only blood). Total strangers even to me - and they were offering to help.

AuntieE

For me the question is: do I want to spend the last years of my life (however many they may be) having tests done, waiting with a certain level of anxiety for the results, perhaps then waiting even more anxiously for further tests to be carried out, then wait for the results, then begin treatments?

It can very easily become a vicious circle, can't it?

No, I do not want to spend the remainder of my life on numerous visits to the doctor and the local hospitals.

I shall certainly go to the doctor if I observe worrying symptoms or a general decrease in my health, but I have come to terms with the thought that I too will die one day.

I hope the day does not come soon, because as yet I am emjoying life. I hope, when life becomes, if it does, a burden that I shall be ready to go.

I certainly do not want to drag out a half-life in a care home, any more than I want to waste my own and doctors', nurses and hospitals'¨time with tests and worries that probaby are unnecessary.

With you on that one. I wasn't exactly joking when I said to my parents some years before their deaths that "Your social life seems to consist of medical appointments these days". Previously it had been a few long weekends away a year, pub lunches or coffee out when my mother took it into her head to do so and my mother going to church every Sunday.

I'm seeing the same thing has been going on for years now with a good friend of mine that's now up in her 80's and her husband (whilst he was still alive).......and yet the NHS had proved they didn't really care about either of them - by the fact that, when they told him he was to have blood transfusions every so often and he "asked" (being him he would have "asked" - rather than "told" them as I would have) for that blood to be clear (not from any donor who'd had Covid jabs) they refused and said it was impossible. No - it isnt impossible actually - there is a way - but they cba to even try and find it....though, in the event, I blame their refusal for the fact that I would say they foreshortened his life by insisting on "blood + any Covid jabs any donors had had blended in with it" - rather than just "blood and that's it - as per prior to 2021".

lizzypopbottle

How coincidental can you get? I asked for a blood test because, with an underactive thyroid and on a small dose of thyroxine, I'd begun to experience some symptoms e.g. eyebrows falling out, feeling cold, feeling sleepy in the afternoons, terribly weak nails etc. all things my mother had before she was diagnosed. Apart from that, I'm fit as a flea. Of course the GP listed several other tests to be done. That was Wednesday and the results are back today. Phone call just now asking me to make an appointment within a week! Heaven knows what's shown up! I'll find out on Thursday... And I'll worry until then! If it's just an increase in my thyroxine dose, surely they could've told me that and prescribed accordingly? Rats!

The results may well be on the NHS App if you’re signed up.

*Calandergirl I'm with you.

AuntieE

For me the question is: do I want to spend the last years of my life (however many they may be) having tests done, waiting with a certain level of anxiety for the results, perhaps then waiting even more anxiously for further tests to be carried out, then wait for the results, then begin treatments?

It can very easily become a vicious circle, can't it?

No, I do not want to spend the remainder of my life on numerous visits to the doctor and the local hospitals.

I shall certainly go to the doctor if I observe worrying symptoms or a general decrease in my health, but I have come to terms with the thought that I too will die one day.

I hope the day does not come soon, because as yet I am emjoying life. I hope, when life becomes, if it does, a burden that I shall be ready to go.

I certainly do not want to drag out a half-life in a care home, any more than I want to waste my own and doctors', nurses and hospitals'¨time with tests and worries that probaby are unnecessary.

AuntieE surely what matters is the quality of your life between these hospital visits.

DH has quite severe heart problems, so regular tests and hospital visits are part and parcel of his life. He grumbles, but he would not have it otherwise. He is enjoying life, keeping active, still able to enjoy many of his lifelong interests, loved and loving his family. Why should he choose to peg out just because he has to see a doctor somewhere or another frequently?

For me the question is: do I want to spend the last years of my life (however many they may be) having tests done, waiting with a certain level of anxiety for the results, perhaps then waiting even more anxiously for further tests to be carried out, then wait for the results, then begin treatments?

It can very easily become a vicious circle, can't it?

No, I do not want to spend the remainder of my life on numerous visits to the doctor and the local hospitals.

I shall certainly go to the doctor if I observe worrying symptoms or a general decrease in my health, but I have come to terms with the thought that I too will die one day.

I hope the day does not come soon, because as yet I am emjoying life. I hope, when life becomes, if it does, a burden that I shall be ready to go.

I certainly do not want to drag out a half-life in a care home, any more than I want to waste my own and doctors', nurses and hospitals'¨time with tests and worries that probaby are unnecessary.

Oreo

Some really interesting reading here 😃
I did read that most men die with an enlarged prostate and often cancer, but that’s with not of and there are many men with serious side effects where they’ve been treated, sometimes wrongly.
It’s a minefield isn’t it?

Enlarged prostate is apparently a side effect of age. But there are 2 types, non-malignant, which can be reduced with drugs, or removed and the kind that spreads. So yes many older men with pee issues may ignore them and autopsy for cause of death may show it, but it is not the cause.

Being on an inadequate dose of thyroxine can cause increase in blood sugar and cholesterol. It may be worth looking at the thyroid U.K. site.

6 years ago I had a urinary problem so was sent for tests not the most pleasant but as they couldn't find anything wrong they sent me for an ultrasound of my abdomen.
While looking for a urinary problem they noticed a dark spot on my bowel.
Since I had not long before had a clear result for the sample you send away when your older.
I wasn't worried but after a colonosopy they removed a malignant polp.
It was so small that it just had started growing.
5 years on I returned for a follow up this march gone.
All clear
So thankfull for these tests

How coincidental can you get? I asked for a blood test because, with an underactive thyroid and on a small dose of thyroxine, I'd begun to experience some symptoms e.g. eyebrows falling out, feeling cold, feeling sleepy in the afternoons, terribly weak nails etc. all things my mother had before she was diagnosed. Apart from that, I'm fit as a flea. Of course the GP listed several other tests to be done. That was Wednesday and the results are back today. Phone call just now asking me to make an appointment within a week! Heaven knows what's shown up! I'll find out on Thursday... And I'll worry until then! If it's just an increase in my thyroxine dose, surely they could've told me that and prescribed accordingly? Rats!

In my view prevention is better than cure. I insist on an MOT every year now I have turned 75 as then I can know if things are seizing up. I refuse to be written off because of my age and have said so to the professionals.
My gynaecologist expressed that I am “ remarkably fit” and long may it continue. If I find out something is wrong then I can make an informed choice as to how to proceed!

I have stage 3 CKD that was found while testing for something else. I'm glad it was found as a stent is keeping me at stage 3, I would have definitely got worse by now without it.

Calendargirl

MOnica and NotSpaghetti.

No, I realise there are many 90+ people who lead active and fulfilling lives.

And many below that age who don’t.

If you fit into the former category, that is good. But sadly, there are many who don’t, whose final years are spent existing, not living.

That is the point I was making in my earlier post.

I think the reason so many people are now living to older ages, is not so much that they are kept going by more and more medication.

What keeps people going to 90 is often minor medical investigations, and some major medical interventions earlier in their lives. Antibiotics, screening tests that catch illnesses in the early stages. Specialist drugs, innoculations that have banished small pox and almost banished polio and diptheria. For many medication runs to statins, and pills to reduce high blood pressure. The obverse of this coin is the damage diabetes and dobesity cause.

The other factor is that most of those reaching extreme old age now spent at least part of their cchildhood and formative years during WW2 and its aftermathh, when food was rationed and the healthy feeding of children made paramount. It meant many impoverished children were better fed through school dinners and things like supplements of cold liver oil and Vit C through ornage syrup and everyone ate less, but aate better.

I think this is now coming through as we age and benefit for our scientifically balanced eating as children, that stopped early damage to our health caused by malnourishment ( not the same as being undernourished.)

well you have all lifted my spirits, I think... I am 89 and enjoyed good health, now it gets to me, can`t move as fast etc..
I was told I had "kidney failure" last year after annual blood test, nothing else, ..as I "gasped" well it was a bit of a surprise the doc. said."wellyou aren`t on dialysis are you!" no other information, nothing, I do have high BP and some heart stuff, take several pills.. but mentally, o.k I won`t admit to being depressed exactly, but I struggle. dh died just before covid was announced, and as I said , having enjoyed goodhealth it is a bit a shock this "old age" lark!