Is this fair?

Absolutely NO. I am 70 have a small private pension and combined with my state pension gives me £15k a year, which I pay tax on and unable to get any top ups except for CT reduction for living on my own. I have always worked full time even when I had my 2 kids.
I have just taken on a merchandising job part time along with some cleaning as I cannot balance my books. I put the heat on only if someone visits spend far too much time in bed in order to stay warm when whatching the idiots lantern, eat frugally and a chicken will serve up 4 dinners along with a sandwich and soup upon boiling the bones. Retirement isn't what I thought it would be, it didn't help my partner of 33 years died just before covid. Its depressing. Its given in one hand and taken away in the other with youngsters accusing my age group of being a drain on the system. How the system works to pay this kind of money to people like this is mind boggling and acceptable it seems. I'm quite angry if I'm honest.

I completely agree with OP. The thing is, you can give as much money as you like to parents, but there's no guarantee that the children won't still be living in poverty. Parents can spend this money on whatever they like and it doesn't always work its way down to the children. I was working full time with families on benefits that had Sky TV, smoked, even went on holiday and I couldn't afford the Sky TV or a holiday (never want to smoke but I know it's darn expensive). This government has made this kind of situation worse. Of course no one wants the children to suffer for the parent's choice. There are better ways surely?

Hi Allira yes your post made me smile.

ROMILO

Not alligator stupid auto correct!

Did you mean me? 🐊
😁

Not alligator stupid auto correct!

Alligator as last someone who still has a sense of humour

Iam64

Who can blame them? My memory is Gordon Brown activated workinggtsx credits with the aim no one would be worse off working. In reality I fear the tax payers are subsidising supermarkets by topping up wages

Yes! Ever since that introduction Employers have benefitted and not just supermarkets!

Menopauselbitch

I remember being jealous of my friends that had dinner vouchers.

Universal Credit is based solely on INCOME earned, not hours worked as in the old system.

ROMILO

When I posted this question I knew it would be contentious. This is Gransnet a forum for the over 50's so I was appalled to see so much I'll feeling towards pensioners and to find so few people able to have a reasoned debate about an important issue without getting on their 'soap boxes' and telling the rest of us how to think.
In the spirit of a previous poster here is a solution.
All third and subsequent children to be removed to be in doctrinated by whatever inept government happens to being power. Anyone with the temerity to reach their 70th birthday to be immediately transported to the nearest euthanasia unit!
Would that please everyone?

😀
I'm a third child with three children and I'm over 70.
Just checking to see if my passport is in date before there's a knock on the door.

Iam64

Who can blame them? My memory is Gordon Brown activated workinggtsx credits with the aim no one would be worse off working. In reality I fear the tax payers are subsidising supermarkets by topping up wages

Oh yes, private firms employing carers too; many firms took advantage.

sazz1

What really is annoying me is the Pension credit fiasco. It's meant to top up the pension to the full level which I agree with. BUT those on it get so many other payment and concessions which add up to hundreds of pounds extra. Like rent, council tax, cost of living payments, free TV licence over 75, cheaper entry to many things, free dental treatment etc etc.
So if you worked all your life, had a small private pension you get nothing. My small private pension is £90 a month which takes us over the limit for pension credit while my friend is on pension credit and gets double what we get.
So very wrong

I think my DB and SisIL found that- they were in fact only just a few pounds over the limit whereas their neighbours were just under the limit and were, as a result, so much better off than them.
There are bound to be anomalies but having a definite cut-off point is bound to cause resentment when the benefits one pensioner couple received was very generous while the other couple got nothing.

"38% of people needing to claim Univeral Credit are working. That says a lot about our low-wage economy, that working people need to claim benefits to survive."

I think it says a great deal more about the perverse incentives built into our benefits system that make it worthwhile for people to work part-time and claim benefits rather than work full time for what is now the second highest minimum wage in Europe.

I did have someone who was pregnant when the cap came in saying they would not have bothered having another child if they’d have known this.

Who can blame them? My memory is Gordon Brown activated workinggtsx credits with the aim no one would be worse off working. In reality I fear the tax payers are subsidising supermarkets by topping up wages

I remember being jealous of my friends that had dinner vouchers.

Cossy

Btw, a very large proportion of those claiming Universal Credit are actually in work, on low salaries. There are many many adults with children who earn far less than the national average, are likely to be living in privately rented accommodation, and the amount paid towards rent is capped using out of date local housing rates.

But they only want to work so many hours as it affects their benefits.

Thank you for an interesting post, Romilo and even more interesting revelations about some posters.

sazz1

What really is annoying me is the Pension credit fiasco. It's meant to top up the pension to the full level which I agree with. BUT those on it get so many other payment and concessions which add up to hundreds of pounds extra. Like rent, council tax, cost of living payments, free TV licence over 75, cheaper entry to many things, free dental treatment etc etc.
So if you worked all your life, had a small private pension you get nothing. My small private pension is £90 a month which takes us over the limit for pension credit while my friend is on pension credit and gets double what we get.
So very wrong

I wish re Pension Credit...but not eligible - because of small private pension.

Rent only applies if one is still (or again) in rented accommodation (though thank goodness I managed to get out of that sector and finally buy a place), free TV licence over 75 no longer applies I gather (I'm annoyed about that - as I'd already been mentally adding it into my income come the time)...but nope will still have to pay it.

Free dental treatment - only if you are one of the ones that has managed to have that rare breed - ie the NHS dentist. I had to drop having an NHS one about 15 years or so ago - as I could see which way the wind was blowing.

In some parts of the country one can tell the state of someone's finances the second they open their mouth - if they're middle-aged onwards. Where I am now - there are lots of people with bad teeth and I've been horrified by it - and that's because it's very difficult/nigh impossible to get an NHS dentist. So - thank goodness I've been used to the idea (darn it!) of a private one anyway - though I've had to "swop and change" several times until I found one equivalent to what I'm used to (ie "Of course the look of my teeth matters...of course I have the modern system for cleaning my teeth" that I'm used to).

There should though be a graduated cut-off scale - rather than abrupt cut-off point. It is upsetting to be on a lot less than national average salary (??think that's around £38,000 these days??) and I'm even not quite sure my combined pension income comes to National Minimum Wage level even - and I'm single. Would love to have national average salary level and the extra few thousand £s per year it costs to be single on top. I wouldnt actually know what to do with that (large) increase in income if I got it - but at least I'd have a fair income and would feel a lot better about the level it was.

When I posted this question I knew it would be contentious. This is Gransnet a forum for the over 50's so I was appalled to see so much I'll feeling towards pensioners and to find so few people able to have a reasoned debate about an important issue without getting on their 'soap boxes' and telling the rest of us how to think.
In the spirit of a previous poster here is a solution.
All third and subsequent children to be removed to be in doctrinated by whatever inept government happens to being power. Anyone with the temerity to reach their 70th birthday to be immediately transported to the nearest euthanasia unit!
Would that please everyone?

Allira

Well, it was not just a stupid comment, it was based on untruths, misconceptions and prejudice.

Which comment??

FranP

When my children were small, early 80s, I had to work to provide us with a manageable income. A young lady in the same village had applied for a job where I worked.
My instant response was to offer her a free lift, simply because I was going and my salary would be more than her entry level. She would be giving up her 80% rate reduction, her rent paid, and benefit income, so working would give her an income of £5 pw more than currently.
This did not allow for new clothes, or any of the work social stuff like collections or the coffee club. It would take her away from her small children all day, and parcel them around friends and neighbours for the school run.
I advised her not to - would you?

Absolutely no! Work isn’t just about the salary paid, it opens the door of opportunity to many other things, including better well paid jobs in the future, self esteem, role model to children and adult company

StoneofDestiny

Beggars belief that so many on here think the biggest problem with the UK is the removal of the two child cap. Just been through 14 years of Tory mismanagement where even 5 prime ministers couldn’t improve things. We have this government in just over a year and people expect miracles.

I have worked all my life and have only two children by choice. Yes - there is an issue with people expanding their responsibilities beyond what they can afford. There is also an issue with multi millionaires avoiding paying taxes into the countries coffers. There is an issue too with the ‘sick note’ mentality. There is an issue with short sighted voters who forget just how misled they were into supporting Brexit and who the politicians were behind that madness.
This two child policy change is not the most worrying thing for me. Far more worrying is the fact that we have the rise of Fascism and the normalising of racism in our country. We have Reform feeding this daily and groups of idlers with no agenda other than to divide our communities.

👏👏👏

What really is annoying me is the Pension credit fiasco. It's meant to top up the pension to the full level which I agree with. BUT those on it get so many other payment and concessions which add up to hundreds of pounds extra. Like rent, council tax, cost of living payments, free TV licence over 75, cheaper entry to many things, free dental treatment etc etc.
So if you worked all your life, had a small private pension you get nothing. My small private pension is £90 a month which takes us over the limit for pension credit while my friend is on pension credit and gets double what we get.
So very wrong

Glo33

What a stupid comment, if you have nothing constructive to say - say nothing!

Which particular comment did you have in mind?

Well, it was not just a stupid comment, it was based on untruths, misconceptions and prejudice.