One in five new teachers leaving.

Most parents can’t wait for their kids to start school. If it was spelled out to them, as it used to be, a condition of them starting is that they are out of nappies I bet they’d soon all be toilet trained. No question.

Before I left my school I was the Dedicated teacher for Child protection. 20% of our children were on the register. Two for sexual abuse, the rest for emotional abuse and neglect. Even so in all the time I was there we only had two children still in nappies. Dummies that had to be taken from a fair few at the classroom door ever y morning, became the norm.

Quercus

Anyone who thinks the only children who start school wearing nappies are those with specific medical needs is sadly mistaken. There is a lot of lazy and inadequate parenting out there.

I don't think anyone on this thread has stated such a belief?

Anyone who thinks the only children who start school wearing nappies are those with specific medical needs is sadly mistaken. There is a lot of lazy and inadequate parenting out there.

A relative who left after two years cited workload and poor management rather than anything to do with the pupils as reasons for leaving.

HelterSkelter1

I expect it depends on the school, the head, the children and the parents.

It’s actually all the admin and sats and “expectations” which are pretty much the same in any school.

My male relative has recently left, a top notch teacher of science. It was never the children, he could easily keep good discipline being respected as ex-military officer. It was the bullying headmaster, who tried to gag him and felt threatened by this teacher who could hold attention by his presence, eloquence, knowledge and excellent exam results

He has had a break to recover and was temporarily employed within large beautiful grounds, responsible for teaching various sports. He was biding his time and has now been accepted for the police force and has been told he will be fast tracked. They rang him two hours after interview.

David49
However Golding's fiction was allowed to become true in many schools, where gangs and law of the jungle rules, the only effective discipline is gang authority.

There have always been examples of gangs or bullying cliques or even individuals opposing authority in school fiction, whether by Enid Blyton, Frank Richards or E M Brent-Dyer. That doesn’t excuse it.

However there seems to be an increasing number of examples of violence and/or rebelling against authority - not just from the children as evidenced in Lord of the Flies, but from some parents who endorse their children’s bad behaviour and sometimes, demonstrate why the children are like that.
It makes teaching more difficult and less enjoyable.

David49

DaisyAnneReturns

There have always been "uncivilised" children. Lord of the Flies was published in 1954. They are not that different in 2026.

I can't believe this comment, the fiction Lord of the Flies illustrates just what discipline and authority should be respected.

However Goldings fiction was allowed to become true in many schools, where gangs and law of the jungle rules, the only effective discipline is gang authority

Could you be a little more exact about what you "can't believe" in my comment please David. That would give me a better chance of answering.

I don't think Golding was suggesting that "discipline and authority should be respected" although it he did mentioned that the novel was a reflection on the darkness that lies beneath the surface of human nature. I've never read of any specific answer he gave to the issues he described. Certainly not one as specific as you suggest. I think most readers see the answers to the problems of human nature that he shines a light on as one's they are asked to think about which means they will be many and diverse.

My DIL has taught from leaving uni. A very dedicated teacher for 25 years but 2 years ago became a supply teacher. Much better for her as no planning, paper work etc. with good pay.

Due to cuts she has now left the profession and would not go back under any circumstances. The children are so badly behaved with parents in all the time criticising and demanding .

I have several friends whose daughters are teachers but are so unhappy and will be leaving soon.

After 1 year: 10-11% leave
Maybe because not everyone is cut out to be a teacher. They give it a go, but if it's not for them I don't think that figure is too shocking.

DaisyAnneReturns

There have always been "uncivilised" children. Lord of the Flies was published in 1954. They are not that different in 2026.

I can't believe this comment, the fiction Lord of the Flies illustrates just what discipline and authority should be respected.

However Goldings fiction was allowed to become true in many schools, where gangs and law of the jungle rules, the only effective discipline is gang authority

Teaching, nursing, banking, police and social work to name just a few professions that many would not choose to do nowadays.

Chardy

About 10% of all teachers leave every year (but only 1% are retiring)

After 1 year: 10-11% leave
After 3 years: about 25% have left
After 5 years: roughly 1 in 3 teachers quit within their first five years
(HoC library)

These statistics haven't varied much over the years

Thanks for the figures Chardy. Sadly they don't fit the arguments the press want to make so we are very unlikely to see them quoted with the "story".

Grantanow

DaisyAnneReturns

There have always been "uncivilised" children. Lord of the Flies was published in 1954. They are not that different in 2026.

Lord of the Flies ( which I read at school in the late 1950s) was fiction and purported to show what happens in the absence of civilised values and authority. I don't think it justifies feral kids and parents in contemporary life.

The book was about what could happen Grantanow and that "could" still exists.

I didn't pose it as a justification for "feral kids and parents in contemporary life". I'm not sure where you got that from?

About 10% of all teachers leave every year (but only 1% are retiring)

After 1 year: 10-11% leave
After 3 years: about 25% have left
After 5 years: roughly 1 in 3 teachers quit within their first five years
(HoC library)

These statistics haven't varied much over the years

Silvershadow

And yes education is extremely important to me, Rosie51.

Yes I have worked in a school, but admittedly not recently.
I don't equate education is extremely important to me, Rosie51. with being prepared to deny it to late developers and the innocent children of lazy parents.
With the ever increasing lack of TAs available to teachers are you equally against time diverted away from the rest of the class for other individual children's reasons? I'd have thought nappy changing would occur during break times and lunchtime, not during lesson time. I do acknowledge it would be a problem but do we now punish children for things that aren't their fault?

DaisyAnneReturns

There have always been "uncivilised" children. Lord of the Flies was published in 1954. They are not that different in 2026.

Lord of the Flies ( which I read at school in the late 1950s) was fiction and purported to show what happens in the absence of civilised values and authority. I don't think it justifies feral kids and parents in contemporary life.

westendgirl

I always taught y7 and upwards and take my hat off to those who coped with infants and juniors.

How interesting! I've always been in awe of secondary school teachers. I just couldn't deal with them.

My daughter and daughter in law are teachers. They are both in primary and have been teaching now for about 10 years and are amongst the happy teachers but I can understand those who leave.

Too old now but yes, I would be a primary teacher. Seniors, no chance! I’m not at all surprised at the number. Perhaps student teachers should go straight into classrooms in the first year, so they don’t waste time and money on courses (if they don’t already do so?)

And yes education is extremely important to me, Rosie51.

Do you/ have you ever worked in a school Rosie51? These children take up an awful lot of time and money in school resources. I know.

What about the children who do not wear nappies to school? What about their education? Who, in all honesty, wants to be changing nappies on children five years and older? Only the parents I’d have thought.

M0nica if you read my posts I have acknowledged that lazy parenting accounts for some increase in children still being in nappies when they start school. My question was and remains, how do you distinguish between those children and the late developers. I have stated that my grandson with severe complex co-morbidities was toilet trained night and day by 3 years old. My grandchild is the exception in his cohort not the rule. Your sister is one child just like my grandchild. Silvershadow has confirmed she's happy to deny late developers and the children of lazy parents an education, so obviously universal education isn't that important to her.

Silvershadow

Yes!

That makes me so sad, to victimise innocent children, but hats off to you for your honesty.

Mollygo you were obviously an excellent, caring teacher. I think it is a very hard job but must be so rewarding when you do see the results of your efforts.

Rosie51

Silvershadow

If a child has a medical condition and there might be an excuse for nappies that’s one thing.

Lazy can’t be bothered parenting is another. No child should start school in nappies without a properly diagnosed medical condition. That’s the way it always was and should still be the same.

Some children are just very late in learning bladder and bowel control and signals. Some children even wet the bed up to age 7 or 8 without any 'medical diagnosis' of anything wrong. How are you going to determine which child falls into these categories and which are the result of 'lazy parenting'? Given that financial penalties are used against parents for taking their children out of school for holidays because of the importance of education you'd still be prepared to deny children an education because they had lazy parents? No child should be held accountable for their parents.

My mother in law taught a reception class for 35 years. She told that in all that time only three children started school in nappies

Why should the number of children who are late in learning bladder and bowel control and signals have increased so much? My MiL said that there were family reasons that contributed to 2 of the cases.

As for bed wetting .My sister was wetting the bed until she was about 10. She was still out of nappies and had day time control, long by the time she started pre-school at 3.